Babies and the Word "No"

[bronxmom]

I have an almost 8 month old baby. In the last week, both our pediatrician (who we generally like a lot) and my mil, asked if he knew the word "no" yet. Our first reaction was to say that he did not but that then we never use the word with him -which is true. He's a baby. We move him when he's near anything dangerous; we do re-direct; we do talk to him as we do things; but generally we don't use the word no. For me, I have a fairly worked out philosophical approach to parenting that I would try to avoid that word with young children and focus instead on what they can do, offering information and re-direction. For my partner, it's just how we were going but it raised questions.

So here's the two key questions we wrestled with:
1) CAN a baby that age even understand no? I first said no, but now am not so sure. Perhaps he could. If he can, I don't want to start saying it but I might try to start telling him things that are dangerous as I remove him. (We are also babyproofed as much as possible).

2) Should we use no? We both seem to agree not. But is it useful to introduce it around safety issues - or things like biting while nursing?

What are your opinions? I come from a more unconditional parenting perspective, fyi.

[frontierpsych]

I have no idea if an 8 month old can understand no. My son is almost a year, and I don't think he knows what it means, though we also don't say it very often, I still just redirect, and if I need to get his attention I say his name, he does know that. I wonder why your ped is concerned about this. This seems to fall under the category of parenting theory/advice, and has nothing to do with your child's development or mental capacity. I don't think this is an area of your parenting that a pediatricians opinion should be involved in any more so than the opinion of some mom you met on the street.

[LianneM]

We are pretty conscious not to just say it without context. We hardly used it with DS now 4.5 and I assure you, he knows what it means

DD is 14 months and she doesn't know what it means. The only times I've used it were to say, "No biting" or "No hitting" and I always say it like, "No hitting! We don't hit. We are gentle with our hands," and model touching gently.

For situations around the house, we did exactly as you - baby-proofed, and then redirected as necessary.

I agree with the pp that it's more about parenting advice than child development.

[bronxmom]

Just to defend my pediatrician for a second: she wasn't saying that we should be using it. When we said we didn't, she clarified that it was just a simple, direct command that signals a stage in language development and so is easy to judge their language comprehension. She said we could sub in any other thing like that - such as "come" while holding out our arms or "look" while pointing at something. What confused/startled my partner was that she asked it as if it was a common developmental stage so made us wonder.

She's actually incredibly chill and doesn't tend to give advice and to the extent she does really respects our opinion/feedback.

[LynnS6]

Completely from a developmental perspective -- babies are capable of learning the word 'no' at about 8-9 months. Now, that means they are capable of understanding it. It doesn't mean that they're always capable of inhibiting an action when they hear it.

From a discipline perspective, I tried to save "no" for when it genuinely came out of my mouth, e.g., taking the fork to the outlets. I think avoiding "no" is almost impossible. That sort of horrified "no!" is my gut reaction and I think my kids learn from the emotion as much as from the word. Otherwise, I found that telling my kids what to do and redirecting worked well. As my kids have gotten older, I do tend to say 'no' more often. It's usually in a situation where I KNOW they know the right thing to do, and it's a short hand for "stop doing that."

[rubidoux]

I think the doc just expected that you used it because everyone else does. But I'm with you. I think it's way over-used. I hardly used it with my older son and he went through no "no" phase himself, which I think was probably nice.

My six month old has heard it mostly in relation to biting and I think he has a good idea of what it means. Although it is quite possible that he's picking up on other cues rather than my repeated use of "no biting". He thinks it's a big funny game. lol And it is actually kind of sweet because he bites very softly when he plays the game. Then I say "no biting", and he laughs. I think it's our first two way joke. Otoh, I wouldn't want to rely on his understanding of "no" to keep him from running into the street. lol

[njkarin]

I'm also not 100% sure whether an 8 month old can understand it, but for our family's case, it seems to be more the context in which we use the word that our baby (now 13 months) understands. We do use the word no but limit its use to safety situations (as in "No don't run past the end of the driveway and into the street!") or when it just comes out, as LynnS6 said. Because we limit our use of the word, my DS stops when he hears it and looks at me with the recognition that he gets what I'm trying to say. (Doesn't always mean he can stop what he's doing.)

Redirection is very important, IMO, and now that he's walking well, I'm practicing the use of "stop" instead of no and working on him stopping in his tracks until I can get to him and make a suggestion of a safer place to go (i.e. back on the lawn instead of into the street.) This is pretty effective so far. That being said, I think children need to hear "no" because that is life, but the overuse of the word is what causes problems or causes children not to respect its meaning.

[octobermom]

Overall I think the anti No thing is way over used and over rated. No is not a bad thing. However a mistake is made when we assume simpily saying no means a child of any age should get it and thats it. We said no to dangers right from the start we also did the redirrection the here this you can have and let our child know what they could do. No is a word and its a word that can and eventually will have meaning and a necessary word in parenting honestly but with out dirrection and guidence its just another meaningless 2 letter word.
Deanna

[mama k nj]

hmmm, well I use No, but sparingly. I actually found myself using it more as he got older because sometimes I just need him to stop before he breaks something or gets hurt. As a baby, I too tried to avoid it. I found that using words like "don't touch. Hot!" "hurt baby" "be gentle" or things like that were more constructive. Now that he's a preschooler he generally knows what is acceptable but is still pushing his boundries to see what he can and cannot get away with.
With a baby, I think it's just genuine curiosity. Redirection is a great tool, but I felt like I needed to "teach" him as well and not just move him away without explanation.

But to go with the original post, I don't see how knowing the word "no" is a developmental milestone. ??

[confustication]

We aren't anti-no around here. My 13 month old has known and responded appropriately to the word since he began crawling (before then, it was never an issue... )

We say 'no' when he's heading for a space that isn't babyproofed or when he tries to play with something inappropriate. Since we're renovating, and I have an older child, perfectly babyproofed isn't happening. We do the best we can and watch him carefully. If we do say 'no' he'll stop in his tracks, pout, and change to another toy/task- we began by redirecting him to a 'yes' when we said no, but he is able now to redirect himself. FWIW though- I wouldn't expect a young baby/toddler to be able to stop themselves most of the time, I know that didn't come into play with dd until she was much older. DS just happens to be one of those disturbingly 'easy' babies.

[ann_of_loxley]

We never used the word 'no' - we always used the word 'stop' so I do think you can avoid the word 'no' completely and I don't think there is ever a need to use it.
We did this for a few reasons. One being I did not want a toddler running around shouting 'NO!' to everything - I find that annoying unpleasant lol. By not using 'no' - I never had a child that did that! lol Which brings me to the main reason why I choose to use the word 'stop' and that is that I think its more explanatory...no what? With 'stop', its pretty self explanatory - my DS would stop, then you could move onto the 'yes' and what the child can do instead. So I used 'stop' also very rarely. And perhaps because my DS was a late developer, I don't think I started using 'stop' (cause there was no need to before hand) until DS was about 15 months old (and able to cruise around the house and get into things, etc). I didn't use much terminology of what my DS could and couldn't do before then because he wasn't doing much anyhow! lol - I would like with things like biting whilst nursing and hitting, etc (since theres no agression behind that at that age) a simple 'ouch!' with hurt expression is good enough to show the child that what they do affects others around them - rather than using the word 'no' (and obviously, if its appropriate situation, show them what they can do instead - though I don't think you can show them how to nurse instead! lol).

[roseselene]

When DD was first starting to say no -- she never said yes -- ever. She literally said no even if she meant yes. So we never had any idea whether she was saying yes or no to something we were offering her. That made me really question at the time if she really understood the word at all. So, I'd guess probably not totally. I think that they start to have concepts of what things mean....but especially for those of us that don't use certain words a lot, they just don't have a huge context of it.

My pediatrition was always asking me questions that I know were developmental -- to see if the kiddos were hitting developmental milestones, but alot of times the questions didn't even relate to our family life, so they ended up not making sense for our children.
Amy

[caro113]

My daughter definitely does. When she pulls my hair, I gently take her hand away and say "No. That hurts Mama." When she gets into the dog food and tries to eat it, I say "No, don't eat that. That's yucky." I know she understands it bc she will be across the room and look right at me and then go to grab something she knows she shouldn't have and then looks at me again and I "No." but not in a demanding or mean tone, just a cautious one, if that makes sense. Half the time she will go away from it. Half the time she'll just sit there and start to cry. So I'm pretty sure she understands it. When she gets near the dog food or the cat food (which she tries to eat btw) I tell her "No" as I'm on my way to pick her up to take her away from it. And she always gets this look on her face, like she understands me.

I truly believe she understands the things I say. Just today we were sitting on the bed and I was typing up an email while she was playing with a blanket. She was sitting on the other end of the bed when I looked at her said "should we go downstairs and get something to eat?" I kid you not, she put the blanket down, came over to me, stood up, put her arms out and grabbed my arms. She even made this noise that was like "let's go." It was eerie.

Also, when she's sitting in her chair eating, or I'm pushing her in a cart (bc I can't wear her all the time) when she starts standing up I always say "sit down please" and then she usually does, to which I reply "thank you." And then she smiles. So yes, I think an 8 month old can understand the word "no", but I think they can understand a whole lot more than that, too.

She's almost 11 months and ever since she started crawling, around 5, 5.5 months, she has seemed to know the word. I'm never stern with her about it. I just don't want her ripping up my books or eating dog food or trying to climb out of the tub or sink while I'm getting her towel ready.

[_betsy_]

I don't think an 8 month old can understand the word no. I think it's a lot more about tone of voice at that point. We use "Not for babies" usually, while removing something from baby's grasp or out of her path. "Uh oh! That's not safe!" has also come out of my mouth several times, and the offending object removed from the room or put well out of reach or whatever.

At 8 months, I don't think a baby can be expected to stop doing whatever it is you're saying no about. You can't expect an 8 month old to put something down, take it out of their mouth, etc. just because you said no from across the room.

And DD1 had a period of time when every answer to a question was no, even if the answer was yes, or blue, or whatever. I think that's normal.

[Mountaingirl79]

I don't know.......I was thinking of another context, for instance, does the little one acknowledge what the word "no" means? It doesn't necessarily mean that your child reacts to the "NO" command but perhaps it is a question of "Is your child starting to respond to simple words and phrases, like 'mama" "milk" ,"up" ,"yes", "no"...etc?' ....

ETA: For example, pretty soon, he will be able to say "no" when he doesn't want a cracker right now, ya know what I mean?

[riverscout]

Originally Posted by bronxmom

1) CAN a baby that age even understand no?

I started telling my daughter "no" occasionally when she started crawling at about 9 months. There were a few things around that I couldn't reasonably have out of her reach 100% of the time but didn't particularly want her playing with. I did not yell or use a nasty tone or anything, but she caught on right away..."no baby, we don't drink the cat water" "no baby, please don't play with daddy's book." She picked up on things quick so it's not like we had to keep telling her these things over and over. She really was and still is amazing. Of course we did use other techniques like positive phrasing and redirection, but "no" had it's place too.

Anyway, I really thought it was that easy with all kids until I had my second . He is almost 11 months, and I don't even really bother saying "no" or "hot" or "danger" or whatever anymore but rather just redirect because he just doesn't get it or doesn't care which I think is perfectly normal. I think my first child was the oddball. Oh, I forgot though that I do still try to work with him when he grabs roughly or pulls hair by saying "gentle" and showing him how to touch softly. Also when he bites I've been saying "ouch" and/or "no bite". So far, we are having limited success.

Originally Posted by bronxmom

2) Should we use no?

Personally, I don't think "no" is a dirty word and used sparingly can be quite useful depending on the kid. Then again, I don't think there is anything wrong with avoiding it. Whatever works.

[holothuroidea]

I choose to use more specific words. Mostly because if I use the same word all the time, dd (12mo) ignores me. But I also believe that "no" really doesn't teach anything. I don't think it's my job to tell her what she can and cannot do, or to order her around. I try to teach and model good behavior most of the time, with redirection for unsafe behaviors.

I think a lot of people tell children "no" all the time but not necessarily for the benefit of the child, but because they are doing something inconvenient for the adult. I just don't see the fairness in it.

I do use "no" if she is crossing my own boundaries. Poking me repeatedly, for example.

So far she knows: gentle, messy, fragile, and unsafe. She does know what no means, and she shakes her head "no" all the time at me. lol

[NicaG]

When my first ds was a baby, I never used that word. It wasn't even a conscious decision--it just didn't seem necessary. It wasn't descriptive enough. I redirected him with other words (hot, yucky, etc.)

Dd does know the word no. Her big brother says it to her sometimes (like when she's taking his toys). And I say it sometimes, like if she's climbing up the stairs, or putting bits of crud in her mouth. I shake my head and say "no no."

I'm pretty sure she understands, because at the playground yesterday she crawled into a big plastic tunnel, and I couldn't really reach her easily, so I sat at one end watching her. She started to put some wood chips in her mouth, and I said, "no no, yucky" and she looked at me and smiled and stopped. Maybe she was just responding to "yucky" though.

I hate to overuse that word, but it does come up sometimes, especially if there are older kids around.

[redcanoe]

I don't know if gifts of that age understand the word. BUT, we would never use it. Saying no is just such a negative interaction and we want to only have positive interactions with DD. Redirection is working for now, and later we're going to try CL:

[AirMiami]

My daughter is 7 months old and I use the word no instinctually when she's hurting me, which is often because boy does this kid love to bite me, yank hair, or scratch my back in the mei tai! I can't even help it, the first word out of my mouth is always "No." followed by "please don't do ____ it ____s Mama." I don't think she understands it at all, but then again, this is the child who laughed when I yelled "AHHHH!" after she bit me really, really hard.