Catheter and retraction , now what????

[gggifts]

Ughh! I am furious!!! My 11 month old son needed a catheter. I warned the doctor and the nurse that his foreskin was tight and did not retract. I said was no tot be retracted. Well, the idiot nurse at first seemed to be doing a fine job, then BAM she pushed the foreskin all the way back and my son screamed bloody murder in pain!!!!!!!!! And he didn't even have his catheter in yet. I am very upset. I don't know how to take care of his penis now. Do I put A & D on it to prevent adhesions?? WTF?
I also need some legal counsel. I have never sued anyone in my life. But this was outrageous. What does it take for a childrens hospital to be intact educated??? Please send some way that I can find a local lawyer in the pittsburgh area who would be knowledgeable. I have googled a search many times over tonight, but I am having trouble finding anyone.

Thanks

[MyBoysBlue]

Sueing won't get you anywhere. There is someone you can contact that will send them a nice letter on your behalf. I'm not sure the details as I am in Canada but I am sure someone will be along to give you the details.

[gggifts]

I appreciate your opinion, but this is not a discussion of whether or not to sue. I am just looking for resources here. It's not a joke. If the nurse doesn't know how to cath an intact boy, then she needs educated. IMO, here in the states, sueing is a surefire way to get people's attention. And this isn't McDonalds coffee. This is my son's bleeding penis.

I may sound harsh, but really I don't mean too. I do appreciate your opinion.

Thanks

[elisheva]

The idea of a lawsuit would be to get their attention so that they change their procedures and don't do the same to another kid. I would totally sue (even though I am also in Canada!). Your poor ds. I hope someone comes along with good info for you! Maybe try posting in the thread from the Pittsburgh area (assuming there is one)?

[eepster]

The best thing to do now is leave it alone and allow it to heal. Do not continue to retract it, this can cause paraphimosis (the foreskin getting stuck behind the glans.) He will probably experience pain every time he urinates for a few days. if you can get him to pee with his penis in a glass of warm water, it will be more comfortable. Keep an eye out for signs of infection.

It is very hard to find a lawyer who would take a case like this, since it's pretty much un-winnable, so unless you can pay a retainer up front... You can try PMing dave2ga, or emailing lawyers for the rights of the child, but I doubt they'll be able to do much for you. At the top of this forum in the stickies is a a way to get a letter from a lawyer sent to the medical people who retracted.

ETA: here's the link to that sticky http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=129378

[gggifts]

Thanks very much for your replies. I sent an email to a local attorney (who doesn't practice law) who had written an article in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette a decade ago negating circumcision. I also wrote an email to the arclaw. I requested a referral from both. I am going to try and x-post if there is a Pittsburgh tribe.

Should I give ds more baths? After the retraction I demanded to see the doctor. I had her look at it and expressed my concerns about what had happened. She said that I should be putting the A&D on the keep it from re-fusing. What is the difference if I do nothing and it re-fuses, or if I keep putting A&D on it to keep it from re-fusing? Both ways seem legit, but I kinda feel like letting it re-fuse would cause it to be harder to retract someday, like scar tissue or adhesions, kwim? Help, I'm confused!

Thanks so much for your help!

[eepster]

Originally Posted by gggifts

She said that I should be putting the A&D on the keep it from re-fusing. What is the difference if I do nothing and it re-fuses, or if I keep putting A&D on it to keep it from re-fusing? Both ways seem legit, but I kinda feel like letting it re-fuse would cause it to be harder to retract someday, like scar tissue or adhesions, kwim? Help, I'm confused!

There is the possibility of scar tissue and true adhessions forming, but repeating the trauma is not going to prevent that, it would increase it. Every time you would retract him to apply the A&D it would stretch and possibly tear the sphincter, leading to scar tissue. The foreskin will begin to reattach quite quickly, and you will almost certainly be having to break apart attachments frequently causing raw areas, where true adhesions can occur. Every time you forcibly retract the fore skin there is a riisk of paraphimosis.

Baths are fine, but avoid manipulating the foreskin.

If you leave it to heal, the chances of long term problems are pretty slim.

[BlessedMommy2006]

I don't have any idea how I would proceed if I were in your shoes, but just wanted to post and say that I can completely understand why you would be furious.

I hope that you get someone that could sue them for you!

[gggifts]

Update,
I took ds to the peds office this morning. He was appalled. He is writing a letter to the er doctor and encouraged me to file a formal complaint. He said that I could leave his foreskin alone and not pull it back. Thanks guys, I really needed someone to talk to last night and you guys were there for me.

[Dabble]

I'm so glad that your regular ped is there to support you and advocate for your son. That is going to make all the difference in the world to have an foreskin-friendly doctor in your corner.

I'm sorry you and your son are going through this, and thank you for the reminder to remain aggressively vigilant against ignorant medical personnel.

I agree that the best course of action is to leave his penis to heal. Is that what your regular doctor said to do?

Please keep us posted.

[Quirky]

If you contact John Geisheker at Doctors Opposing Circumcision, he will help you file all the appropriate letters of complaint.

I agree that a lawsuit isn't the way to go (I'm an attorney) but you can certainly file many letters of complaint and demand that all doctors and nurses on the pediatric ward, the ER, etc. go through an in-service to become educated about the proper procedures for handling an intact penis.

[Yulia_R]

Originally Posted by MyBoysBlue

Sueing won't get you anywhere. There is someone you can contact that will send them a nice letter on your behalf. I'm not sure the details as I am in Canada but I am sure someone will be along to give you the details.

I think that suing is the ONLY way to get them educated. The system will only change if you hit it where it hurts $$$$$$$$$$$$$

Doctors Opposing Circumcision have a great lawyer, why don't you start by contacting them (here is their contact info http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...t/contact.html ).

[Quirky]

Yulia, you don't understand the American legal system. It will be far more effective to file letters of complaint than to sue. It would be incredibly expensive to sue and take several years -- with no guarantee of a win. If you don't win, you pay all your own attorneys' costs and fees. You're not likely to find an attorney to take a retraction case on contingency because there's not going to be a big payoff at the end. It will cost tens of thousands of dollars to take the doctors and hospitals to court -- and you can bet that they have the lawyers on retainer to defend them who will more than likely get the case dismissed at an early stage.

[Yulia_R]

Originally Posted by Quirky

Yulia, you don't understand the American legal system. It will be far more effective to file letters of complaint than to sue. It would be incredibly expensive to sue and take several years -- with no guarantee of a win. If you don't win, you pay all your own attorneys' costs and fees. You're not likely to find an attorney to take a retraction case on contingency because there's not going to be a big payoff at the end. It will cost tens of thousands of dollars to take the doctors and hospitals to court -- and you can bet that they have the lawyers on retainer to defend them who will more than likely get the case dismissed at an early stage.

I see. And you are right, I do not understand the American legal system. For example, I totally don't get it why thefact that foreskin comes from the same fetal tissue in both genders and has the same purpose in both genders would not be enough to automatically outlaw male circ since cutting off the same tissue in females is illegal.

I still think that contacting a lawyer from Docrors Opposing Circ would be a good first step though.

[Quirky]

I certainly do not agree with the fact that boys don't get legal protection in this country the way girls do. And I want to change that as much as anyone on this board.

All I am saying, as someone who is legally trained, that you have to choose your legal battles. If there's not going to be a recovery in the hundreds of thousands or potentially millions of dollars, you're not going to be able to afford to bring a lawsuit about premature retraction.

To educate doctors, nurses, and hospitals, there are ways short of lawsuits that are going to be quicker, more cost-effective, and far more productive.

A lawsuit could in fact be counter-productive in a case like this.

For example, if I were an attorney defending a hospital against a suit for a premature retraction, I would insist that they NOT start in-service education process for hospital personnel prior to the resolution of the lawsuit, because to do so would be very damaging as an admission of liability or wrong-doing.

Which is not in any way to diminish the wrong that was done the OP's son -- or to say that she shouldn't pursue vigorously complaints to the appropriate authorities.

But lawsuits are not the only way to get things done, and sometimes they are not strategically the best way to go.

[tutucrazy]

I'm so sorry for your son! Just leave it alone and let it heal. Don't make any attempts to retract. The foreskin heals well, it is very vascular.

I would file a complaint in addition to the one your pedi is sending!

[gggifts]

Gosh, thanks for all this info. I have already received a call from a referral request that was forwarded. He was from a circumcision opposition group. He is forwarding my info to someone who he says has experience with these situations.

I am leaving his foreskin alone to let it heal. Yes, my ped is great. He is also a lactation consultant, can you believe it?

I am befuddled that a childrens hospital er did this even after I warned them. I'm not sure what i'll do because I am so scared that he'll have some kind of long term problem. P'LEASE, PLEASE hold your babes close. This experience was unnecessary and awful. I am going to make sure that this hospital educates it's staff.

[MCatLvrMom2A&X]

I am sorry this happened to your ds and I applaude you for taking the time to make sure the ones who did this know they where wrong. It is only by taking these kinds of steps that we are going to get the word out about proper intact care.

The great thing about infants and young children is their ability to heal fast. Watch for signs of infection at this point that is the only thing you need watch for. If you want to be proactive and head any possible infection off now you can put some breast milk on there at every diaper change if you are bfing. If you want to take the next step that would be applying bacatracin and otc cream once a day. Here is a thread about separation but it has some good tips to deal with irritation and aid healing http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=764732

[gggifts]

I could kiss you! Thank you for this info. I forgot all about the breastmilk. I am so sad for him. Thank you for your help. I have decided to really follow this through and insist that they let me present this from a mothers point of view to their staff. I imagine this will take a long time, but I am determined that they receive education. I do NOT want this to happen to any other little boy. Ds was born premature, was in the nicu, had incarcerated hernia at six weeks, and had inguinal hernia surgery. This shook me more than all that. It was so painful for him. Don't let this happen!

[PuppyFluffer]

gggifts, I am sorry this happened to your son. I am sad to say that I am not suprised at all that it did AND at a children's hospital none the less.

I had a nurse attempt to retract my son at a children's hospital in Washington DC. I told her he was intact, uncircumcised...and NOT to retract his foreskin. When I saw her begin to move the foreskin back, I said "You are retracting him, STOP" she didn't. I physically removed her from my child. The ignorance is one thing, not stopping when told is something else all together! I am addressing it with a letter to the hospital. I have many issues to address with them. The experience was so bad that I will never ever walk into a medical setting without a digital voice recorder. (I have all ready looked up the laws involved in recording conversations. In many states, you are allowed to record any conversation you are a party to. In some others, you must have the permission of all parties.)