Consequences for missing the bus - Page 2

[JL83]

Could it be that you're giving him too much time in the mornings?

I know that if we wake up an hour before we want to leave, DH, DD and I just poke around and do things really slow and we struggle to leave the home "on time". But when we over sleep the alarm and have 20 to 30 minutes to leave when we want to, then we always manage to get out the door at the right time.

That way we don't have any time to waste. We get dressed, eat breakfast and go. Since DD needs to be awake for awhile before eating (which is why we normally wake up early) we will take her breakfast in the car with us.

[K-Mom3]

First, I TOTALLY understand about a child that takes FOREVER to get a very small list of things done. I have a child, also, who is very hard to motivate. On many days, he only works on getting himself ready if I am in the room, prodding him. I am trying to move away from that. So....

Contests are often helpful for my ds. We have a race against a song (I pick a song of appropriate length) or against a task that I am working on or against a sibling. So I'll say something like "Whoever is dressed by the end of [x song] gets chocolate syrup on their pancakes" Or.."let's see if you can put on your shoes and backpack by the time I finish changing this diaper."

Here's an idea from a parent of a special needs child. Make a picture chart/list of all the tasks he is supposed to do, in order. Whenever he is not on task with his chart, you put his favorite toy (video game? whatever motivates him) in toy time out. For some kids, it doesn't even matter if they are allowed to use the toy during the morning routine or not. Just the fact that you have it and they are not allowed access to it is a big deal. Then, when he starts doing his tasks again, take the toy out of toy time out again. I think it makes sense to have a reward for completing the list on time as well. What motivates him? What does he like to do? Does he have foods that motivate him? I think that short term AND long term rewards is good, too. Like, every day he gets a cookie in his lunch box if he's ready on time and if he's on time every day for two weeks, you have a baking project together of his choosing.

Sorry I'm listing so many foods as rewards. I must be hungry.

I also want to mention about your DH--I heard in a lecture recently that punishing with intimidation or violence often DOES get rid of the problem behavior but the problem behavior is usually replaced by another one. Fear doesn't really get to the root of the problem. Perhaps that fact could help persuade him to stop?

[Oubliette8]

I worked at a summer camp for a few years in a cabin full of 6-8 year olds. One thing that really helped to get them up in the morning was music. Something fun and loud and upbeat. It even gets the counselors moving. Its very hard to sleep when there is catchy upbeat music playing. Interestingly, it also helped get them all to sleep, but then we opted for quiet, relaxing music.

Also, how much input is he capable of giving in the process? When I was growing up, my parents insisted that I get up far too early. I really needed about 30 minutes to get ready, but they insisted on an hour and a half. I resented having to get up that early and consequently often went back to sleep and we struggled over it as long as I lived with them. There's just no reward big enough to make you get out of bed, finish getting ready, and then sit around and do nothing for an hour, you know? You might ask if he wants more time, or less time, or if he feels it is just right. If he wants less, tell him you'll do a practice run on a non-school day and if he can do it in less time, then you'll allow it so long as he continues to be ready on time.

Another idea, is to use a reward. I once took over a cabin of 7-8 year old boys who simply couldn't finish their showers on time (showers started at a certain time, and they were never finished by lights out, over an hour later) I explained that in order to get this done one time, every needed to spend 5 minutes or less in the shower, BUT they all had to soap and shampoo while they were in there. If everyone did this, there would be a treat. They got very excited about trying to beat their own times (some had to be sent back to finish rinsing shampoo out, but no big deal) and they all wanted the treat. The first night I used a story AND the promise of M&Ms in the morning (they rarely got candy). It got done with time to spare. After that, we used just the story, but they worked very hard to get a story every night. What could you use as a reward for your son? Does he get alot of TV? Maybe if he finishes early he gets to watch TV until the bus comes? Obviously if he's not ready, he misses his program. Maybe if he's early he gets to pack a snack of his choice (be sure to keep choice items on hand) but if hes not, no snack, or something boring. Or, maybe if hes in the kitchen by X time, he gets to pick his breakfast out of some preapproved options, but if hes late, you pick. You could even say, breakfast goes on the table at X time, and put it out then. No one likes soggy cereal, I'd make sure I was there on time after a few bouts of soggy cereal.

[Carlyle]

Originally Posted by hergrace

The Dad Dollars idea is interesting.

I know he isn't getting enough sleep and we can't seem to get it right. It usually takes him a long time to wind down and actually fall asleep, so an 8:00 bedtime turns into 9:30 or 10:00 falling asleep. We may need a 7:30 bedtime for the school year, but I hate to do it since it will take away the only one on one time he has with me all day.

Would it help to move his bedtime significantly earlier, and make your one on one time in the morning??? That way you both have more sleep (you might need to move your own bedtime up too if you can...), and you and dh are *planning* to spend the hour with him in the morning and so will have more energy to relax into it? Good luck, my dd is pokey in the mornings too and it drives me a bit insane at times...

[Viola]

I've had a lot of experience with my daughter being late to school. Sometimes it is my fault, sometimes it really is her fault, and sometimes it's just that I don't care enough. I felt like I was constantly standing over her just to get her to move, move, move, but she had no concept of hurrying and resisted it. And then she'd be angry she was late. So I stopped getting angry, and I'd only tell her once or twice about the timing of things, then she'd be late, have to get a slip, and would tell me how it was all my fault.

There were times when we'd be ready, she was up and dressed, shoes on, jacket on, and as we were crossing the threshold into the garage, she'd freak out about how her shoes were uncomfortable or her shirt was wrong, and she'd go back in and change it. At that point it was either let her be late and take the no recess consequence at school, or physically herd her out the door, not allowing her to change whatever it is she wanted to change.

I started setting the kitchen buzzer and having it go off about 5 minutes before we had to leave. That worked for awhile, but then we got desensitized to it, even with it buzzing.

We've been doing better now that she is older. She started riding the bus last year. Honestly, she hates riding the bus, but seems more willing to do it in the morning since she'll get to school quickly. Riding home takes much longer and delays her arrival time to our house. So generally, if she is good about trying to get to the bus on time in the morning, and doesn't balk and get angry, I will pick her up in the afternoon. If she just refuses to get on the bus in the morning, which she will do if she thinks she is going to be late and miss it (one day she hid around the side of the house instead of walking to the bus stop, because she said she would have to run to catch it and the kids would laugh at her), then I drive her there and tell her to ride the bus home in the afternoon.

I also agree that if you know you have 2 hours in the morning, you end up doing other things, and then having to go to school seems like way too big of a switch or something. If we just get up, throw on clothes, eat a quick breakfast and go, it works better.

[hergrace]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I'm still working through them to see what might work. It is really hard to come up with a plan that we can be really consistent about with 2-year old triplets are in the mix.

I want to say that DH isn't violent with DS1. When he totally loses his temper, he grabs and DS1 and holds him still. It looks like a shake because DS1 is always in motion, but it is really just a forceful, stilling grab. It doesn't happen often and DH is working on it.

[heartmama]

I really like lilyka's ideas.

Also, music in the morning is a good idea, as well as making sure you get the 6 year old up BEFORE the triplets.

[thixle]

Originally Posted by hergrace

I want to say that DH isn't violent with DS1. When he totally loses his temper, he grabs and DS1 and holds him still. It looks like a shake because DS1 is always in motion, but it is really just a forceful, stilling grab. It doesn't happen often and DH is working on it.

Aw, man, I know that gesture, Dh has used it a couple times, too. Definately gets the kid's attention in the moment (but then makes my kiddo dissolve and still nothing is accomplished).

I have a dawdler, too... We started a sticker chart before school started and it's working really well. She switched to making check marks (hurray!!!). And hurries up to get her list done so she can watch WordWorld on PBS (she's 4).

Some days I put her clothes on her while she's still in the bed. As in, "Honey, time to wake up. I'm going to change your pants for you." 30 seconds. She usually sits up and puts her arms through her shirt, them bumbles with her socks and shoes for a few minutes... Then she goes to the potty and brushes her hair. Sometimes, I put her shoes on for her while she sits there and blinks. I guess I get her dressed before she has a chance to be coherent enough to object.

I read your son is not consistently dry at night-- does he sleep in protective pants or pull-ups? Waking up wet absolutely kills DD's mood for the. rest. of. the. day. And hauling her into the shower, etc is horrid... I buy disposables because when she pees, she peeeeeeeeees and no amount of cloth is going to contain it... Sometimes, she still wets through disposables.

Anyway, then we do backpack, she checks the cat's food, then breakfast (important here), and finally teeth. Occasionally, she will just have to brush teeth when she gets home.

[hergrace]

Originally Posted by heartmama

Also, music in the morning is a good idea, as well as making sure you get the 6 year old up BEFORE the triplets.

Music sounds good.

The trio are up at 5:30, so we can actually get them all ready to go except outdoor clothes before he is even out of bed.

Reading that, a good solution would probably be to make sure that DH and I are both ready to go before DS1 wakes up. But, I'm not sure I will be able to convince DH of that. Oh well, it will be worth a try.

[hergrace]

Originally Posted by thixle

I read your son is not consistently dry at night-- does he sleep in protective pants or pull-ups? Waking up wet absolutely kills DD's mood for the. rest. of. the. day. And hauling her into the shower, etc is horrid... I buy disposables because when she pees, she peeeeeeeeees and no amount of cloth is going to contain it... Sometimes, she still wets through disposables.

DS doesn't care one way or the other about waking up wet, but he does mind wearing a pull-up, so I just do a lot of laundry. And, he actually quite likes a shower in the morning.

[confustication]

It sounds like he really does need an earlier bedtime, and to not have the chance to dawdle in the mornings excessively. I'll be honest, this was a problem my dd had as well- and coupling that with my needing to get out the door to work it was a recipe for disaster. I was tired of the battle, and I was tired of having to pull teeth to get her ready.

Finally I realized that I have to make her change her behavior patterns, not just do what I'm asking of her. I also realized that I was as much a part of the problem as she was.

I set my alarm an hour earlier, and made sure that I was completely dressed and ready before waking her. This also gave me time for a cup of tea and some peace as I woke.

I put an alarm clock in her room. It was across the room so she had to get out of bed to turn it off. I guarantee that there is one out there loud enough and obnoxious enough to wake your child, you just have to do some digging to find it.

Clothes are always laid out the night before- the backpack was right beside the door packed and ready. Though we aren't really big on wearing shoes in the house, she was not allowed to step out of her room without clothes on including socks and shoes.

When her hair was long, asking her to do it herself didn't work. I stepped in and took care of that for her. She's had it cut short since then, and is older, so hair hasn't been an issue in a while.

An electric toothbrush with a built in timer took care of the toothbrushing issue.

Breakfast was a challenge and she fought having to eat that early at every turn. Eventually, I just arranged for her to eat breakfast at school. Her body isn't ready for food within 2 hours of waking, and neither is mine, so we compromised.

Consequences for being late? Obviously that meant we had to get up earlier the next day, which meant going to bed earlier the night before.

[lilyka]

If you start bed time at 8:30 and he is not asleep until 10:00 you need to start bedtime closer to 6:00 so that he is asleep by 8: or 8:30. you need a really good bedtime routien (all afternoon until bed routien - your triplettes will benefit from it too most likely) so if does not take him so long to wind down.

[sapphire_chan]

"he gets lost in his own thoughts"

A timer would probably help with that, a lot of kids really enjoy racing a clock.

[CarrieMF]

The trio are up at 5:30, so we can actually get them all ready to go except outdoor clothes before he is even out of bed.

If this is the case then either you or dh should be able to be with DS while he's getting ready & get that extra 30minutes you mentioned cut off.

Getting dressed - if you have to physically take his clothes off & put his other clothes on. Should take 5minutes max.

Getting out of bed - if you're waking him & letting him get himself out of bed, wake him up earlier & stand there reminding him it's time to get out of bed. if you are going to physically help him get ready, then you could let him sleep in later which would help with his bedtime too.

Brushing teeth/eating - set his toothbrush & stuff up while he's eating. Or have him brush his teeth(with a timer) & eat while waiting for the bus.

Even with 3 2yo's if there are 2 adults in the house this entire time it shouldn't be much of a problem to get him up & out of the house in under 40 minutes.

If he sleeps through an alarm, would he wake up to an alarm that plays music?

I would NOT purposely take the littles off to playschool & drop DS off after so he can have consequences at school for being late. At age 6 it is the parent's job to get the kid to school on time.

I have an 8yo who doddles, she gets constant(every 2-3 minutes) to keep her on track.

[spirit4ever]

Originally Posted by lilyka

If you start bed time at 8:30 and he is not asleep until 10:00 you need to start bedtime closer to 6:00 so that he is asleep by 8: or 8:30. you need a really good bedtime routien (all afternoon until bed routien - your triplettes will benefit from it too most likely) so if does not take him so long to wind down.

It really does sound like he is not getting enough sleep, I would move bedtime to 7ish and see how that goes! My ds was 6 last year, and he is an early riser but I had to make a point to do bedtime earlier! That even meant not going out on school nights cause dh sucks with the bedtime part!!

[joensally]

Read this and your thread re emotional OEs. Some random thoughts from a parent with similar issues:

-I recommend Sleepless in America. It's by the same author as Spirited Kids (Kurcinka) and it really did uncover some things we were doing that were undermining getting to sleep.

-Have you tried melatonin? 1.5 mg is a good dose for a six year old. We're now using one with 5HTP and LTheanine that's really helping as it also boosts seratonin level which may help with the emotional OEs. I got it at Shopper's Drug Mart.

-Personally, I would invest 10 minutes of my morning in getting him dressed and teeth brushed directly. If he wants to shower, I'd stand outside with a timer while DH has the triplets. My son is a morning bird but highly distractable, and DD is a surly bag (really!) in the morning. When we have to get out the door, I forget what they "can" or "should" do for themselves and just get it done in a timely manner. They'll figure it out for themselves when they're older (ie how to get themselves out on time, or the consequences of not doing so which will be solely their own). For now, I just need them out the door on time.

-We can all tell time, but have a poor sense of it. Every year, I've always been shooting for the last possible moment when we won't be late. Now, I shoot for 15 minutes before that.

-I have also started getting up and getting my own stuff done first so my mind isn't splitting in one more direction. I wonder if you could do triplets, you, son, outer wear? 530. Ugh.