How to talk to kids about strangers/kidnappers?

[lovevolving]

This whole Jaycee thing is really bringing it up for me, and other mamas too I bet. I grew up in South Lake Tahoe and was a grade younger than Jaycee at the same elementary school when she was taken, she lived in my neighborhood, it was a huge part of my childhood. And now it's all being brought up again. And now I'm a mother.

My daughter just turned 3. What is appropriate for me to say to her? She ran away from me in town today and I was like "There are people who might want to hurt you" and she was like "Yeah, and I'll hurt them!". So it was like, okay that won't work.

But what will, at this age? Any book or video recommendations for me, or her, for this age or older?

Thanks mamas!

[lucky_mia]

Read Protecting the Gift by Gavin DeBecker.

[lovevolving]

Thanks Mia, I did just request that one from the library today!

[Mama2Bug]

DD and I read "The Berenstain Bears Learn About Strangers." It really seemed to help. It gave concrete examples of what not to do and it made a point of saying that most strangers aren't bad people.

[A&A]

"Stay on the safe side" is a DVD on this topic to show to kids.

[~PurityLake~]

Is there a suggestion of how to do this without a tool (book, movie, etc.)?

[oceanbaby]

Well, from what I know of the story, it doesn't seem like there is anything Jaycee could have been told that would have prevented what happened. Even if our kids do everything perfectly, exactly the way we want them to, these horrible things can happen.

That said, I have explained to ds1 that most people are good people who don't mean to hurt us. But there are some bad people who will try to hurt him/us. The problem is that it can be hard to know which one is which, so we have to be very careful and make sure that he stays where mommy/daddy can see him. Something along those lines.

In response to the "and yeah, I'll hurt them" comment - I got similar responses from my older son. I told to him that he was indeed a very strong and powerful child, and he should always do his whatever he could to protect himself, but that in most cases adults are much stronger than children. And then we practiced me picking him up vs. him picking me up.

[ScarletBegonias]

my dd is 3 1/2 and we are very blunt with her about everything in life. i don't believe in lying or sugar coating for kids.

we tell her quite often (typically when she takes off/isn't staying by us in public, but also when there is a news story/personal story etc.,.) that there are bad people who will take her away from us and do very bad things to her or hurt her or kill her and she will never see us again. and that we love her very much and want to always be together.

it isn't said in a threatening way, but in a loving, quiet and serious way. it is not a scare tactic, imo. she usually will tear up and we'll hug and kiss and we'll talk a little more about whatever aspect she is curious about that time.

sometimes she wants to know why there are bad people. sometimes she wants to know why people want to hurt kids or each other.

we haven't told her the kinds of bad things people can do if she's taken away (too much, imo), but we also talk about (at other times) how yonis/penises are special and awesome and only for that person and being married and making babies.

too many people in my life have been molested/raped that i take teaching my children about it VERY seriously. i believe you can never start teaching them too young, and while you don't want to scare them/weird them out/give them a fixation, i think that just talking about life's problems and dangers consistently and making it a part of everyday life is the key to teaching them naturally and effectively.

hth.

[betsyj]

that there are bad people who will take her away from us and do very bad things to her or hurt her or kill her and she will never see us again. and that we love her very much and want to always be together.

I can understand not necessarily wanting to lie to children. But, is scaring her the best way to get her to stick close to you in public? Is scaring her the best way to help her process scary news stories?

Maybe I am not understanding your intent but it seems from my reading of your post that you are using teh fear of being taken from you to get better behavior.

Regardless of your tone in saying these things, the idea is terrifying-being taken from you forever and having bad things done? I just do not see how you can say the above in a loving way.

[meemee]

at 3 i did not go into bad people or strangers. never ever did the strangers talk. when the time was appropriate i told her she was not supposed to take anything from anyone and no one had the right to her body even her privates without her permission.

she also had a v. strong intuition about people and i encouraged that wholeheartedly. if she didnt want to go near someone, she wanted to walk on the other side of the road i would let her. whether she was able to express that in owrds or not.

i never made her say hi to people if she didnt want to.

however jaycee was snatched with her step dad right there. i will not let that incident instill fear in me or my child. if i had done the stranger danger talk with my dd and mentioned bad people she would have had nightmares for sure. plus i dont buy into the stranger danger anyways.

yes these incidences bring up big fears. my dd is getting to be old enough when she could be snatched.

however i refuse to live in fear. i refuse to let that dictate our lives. just coz it happened to jaycee doesnt mean it could happen to me. for all i know the 'stranger' might come in the form of 'cancer'. i do the best i can within reason to protect my dd. protection does not mean keeping her close to my side. protection means street smart. if anyone ever tried to touch my dd she would have screamed. i even taught her to go to a mommy with kids if she got lost - from the book.

however the biggest is her own sense of danger. she was scared of some - not shy but just not comfortable with some people. i never ever blew that off. if she never wanted to sit on santa's lap she did not have to. i never sent her mixed messages. if i couldnt tell if seh was afraid or shy i would encourage her to say hi. if she really didnt want to i never forced her.

there are times she has stopped me from going somewhere. and i have followed her lead. and something happened where we were supposed to go and i was glad we werent there. so if she didnt want to do something - and was really, really upset about it - i didnt force her. if it was a drs appt i might go. but usualy i would not go fi she reacted in such an extreme manner.

i think we all have a sense of danger. during childhood i think we parents kinda squash that under the guise of socially acceptable behavour. i recognise what my dd has was how i was when i was a little girl. my people instincts were dead on as a child and its pretty sharp these days too. i also had pretty good 'rabbit ears' for danger that i no longer have as strongly as i did when i was a kid and that is irreplacable.

i think we are all born with great instincts. but somehow they get squashed somewhere in childhood.

[texmama]

I had the stranger talk(s) with dd when she was 4. Basically I explained that

1) if a stranger comes up and says that something happened to me/daddy and she should go with them - to walk away and find a teacher or mommy to tell. That I would NEVER send someone she doesn't know to get her. Even a police officer.

2) to never go up to someone's car, even if they say they just want to show you a puppy.

She did ask why - and I explained that sometimes there are people who want to take children to be their own.

[_betsy_]

DD is 3 and so far has shown a strong, innate sense of people. She makes her own decisions about who to say Hi to and who to ignore, and I trust that and encourage it in her as well as I can.

I have had to have a little discussion about what might happen if she walks away from us /me and gets lost. That it would probably be very scary for her and for me to not be able to see each other in a place with lots of people. Lots of people tends to be overstimulating and difficult for her anyways, so sometimes all I have to say is "There's lots of people, let's hold hands and stay close together" and she will stick to me. But I never went into scary stuff like people taking and hurting her. In reality, stranger abduction is very, very rare.

We have had a "don't ride in anyone else's car" discuission a couple of times, but not because I'm afraid of kidnapping, I'm afraid FIL will try to drive her someplace and 1) he's not safe on the roads (I'm rallying to get the siblings to convince him to give up the car keys) and 2) he doesn't have/believe in the need for car seats.

[mamalisa]

Originally Posted by ScarletBegonias

my dd is 3 1/2 and we are very blunt with her about everything in life. i don't believe in lying or sugar coating for kids.

we tell her quite often (typically when she takes off/isn't staying by us in public, but also when there is a news story/personal story etc.,.) that there are bad people who will take her away from us and do very bad things to her or hurt her or kill her and she will never see us again. and that we love her very much and want to always be together.

it isn't said in a threatening way, but in a loving, quiet and serious way. it is not a scare tactic, imo. she usually will tear up and we'll hug and kiss and we'll talk a little more about whatever aspect she is curious about that time.

sometimes she wants to know why there are bad people. sometimes she wants to know why people want to hurt kids or each other.

we haven't told her the kinds of bad things people can do if she's taken away (too much, imo), but we also talk about (at other times) how yonis/penises are special and awesome and only for that person and being married and making babies.

too many people in my life have been molested/raped that i take teaching my children about it VERY seriously. i believe you can never start teaching them too young, and while you don't want to scare them/weird them out/give them a fixation, i think that just talking about life's problems and dangers consistently and making it a part of everyday life is the key to teaching them naturally and effectively.

hth.

This seems extreme and scary for a little kid. I don't want my daughter thinking everyone else is out to get her.

We see strangers everywhere and we interact with them all the time. I don't teach my kids anything about strangers, but rather to listen to how you feel about people. If someone makes you uncomfortable, get with someone you trust asap.
Stay with your friends when you are at the bus stop or out playing. Adults NEVER need a child's help. For example, "I lost my dog, can you help me?" We've talked about why that's silly, kids aren't in charge of helping adults.

We hold hands in big crowds, mommy waits outside the bathroom door in public places (ds gets 1 minute and 10 seconds to pee, if he's not out, I'm coming in!)

We've also talked a lot about that no matter what is going on, you can tell us. You don't have "secrets" with anyone but mommy and daddy. No one is going to hurt us and we want to know if there is something or someone bothering you. Lots of conversations about how your body belongs to you and no one can touch it unless it's your dr or parents.

He also knows the list of people that he can absolutely trust and that he can call them if there is something he can't talk to us about. He also knows who is on the emergency call list at school and who is allowed to pick him up if something happens and dh and I can't get to him. He knows which neighbor's house to go to if he gets off the bus and I'm not here.

Obviously those are for my almost 9 year old. For the 4 year old most of our talks are about holding hands and staying close and "no one sees your nakies but the people that live in our house". She is extremely picky about who she will talk to or go by, so we respect that. I never push her to talk to people she doesn't want to talk to.

They both know that if you get lost, you find a mommy. It was a great lesson this summer when we were at the beach and I found a lost kid. 30 people probably stopped and asked him if he was ok, I was the only one that stopped and stayed with him until we found his parents 40 minutes later. For the next two days people asked me "did that kid find his parents?" But not one of them stayed with him to make sure. Mommys don't leave lost kids until they are safe. Both my kids know this.

Stranger kidnappings are so rare that we have never really talked specifically about it. Keeping safe while you're at practices, using public bathrooms, outside playing, encounters with teachers and people at school; those are the things we focus on.

[First-Time-Mommy]

DH says take your kid to the police department or wherever accessible would show "missing children reports", bulletin board or whatever, and say, "some of these children have wondered off from their parents, and this is what happens. all it takes is a few minutes".

I personally wouldn't do that, but then again my parents raised me by saying I would go to the ugly farm(a place where they made you farm your entire life), if I misbehaved or wondered off.

Since she's only 3 just find a suitable way that isn't too harsh and be delicate. DH's idea isn't to be mean at all, just showing what can happen.

[NiteNicole]

I just had this come up yesterday. We were at my parents house and someone - ugh, long story, friend of a friend of my mom's stopped by to pick something up. She says to dd, "You're so cute, you just go with me" so dd says, "Ok, where are we going?" and just starts walking out with her. Oh ha ha ha. Very bloody funny.

So when we came home we had a little talk about how it's never ok to leave with someone she doesn't know and it's only ok to talk to strangers if Mommy (or Daddy, or grandparents) say it's ok. She should never leave with anyone for any reason, or take anything from anyone. Blah blah blah what to do if she gets seperated from me. Obviously this was a whole lot of info at one time and she's only 3.5, so we went back to the "just don't leave with a stranger" thing.

This is something we need to talk about because she's just so friendly.

[phathui5]

I would recommend the "Safe Side" DVD too.

[GuildJenn]

I totally get why it's bringing all this up for you. Here are my rambly thoughts.

I'm in the camp of people who kind of put stranger abduction into the category of lightning strikes (one of which recently killed a 5 year old here). I've told my son what to do if he's caught out in a lightning storm (crouch down, on the balls of your feet, if you can't get inside somewhere) and also what to do if someone tries to grab him or is bothering him (yell his head off).

We've also lightly discussed that you don't help people without asking a grownup you know first. And we too have the "if you're lost, find a mommy" rule. (Go Protecting the Gift.)

I've started to give him a bit more freedom, like at the grocery store I let him sit on the bench outside the grocery store while I put the groceries in the car (parked right outside, not across the lot or anything).

While he was sitting there a stranger came up to him and said good morning. So afterwards we discussed how it's just fine to say good morning to a stranger, but that if it makes you nervous or worried, you should say "I don't want to talk to you" and call for your parent. And then we talked about the yelling if someone tries to grab you.

I firmly believe that kids should talk to strangers and in fact that we all should talk to strangers. It's just that we also need to learn judgment. And while my son's 4, he doesn't have any necessarily, and that's fine. I never make him talk to a stranger he's uncomfortable talking to, so that he can find his way. I'm thinking about whether I've ever modelled being unhappy with a situation talking to a stranger, but I don't think I have had occasion to. I have modelled hanging up on telemarketers.

But generally I'm all for talking to each other… in my opinion it's our lack of community that is the biggest danger really. Having been abused as a child, it was many times strangers who gave me courage and hope to get out and move on.

We've also talked a bit about good touch and bad touch, again, just naturally.

I don't really have any expectation that at 4 he will actually do these things properly. It's kind of a fear we just have to live with, and something we discuss as things come up.

[abiyhayil]

DH came home with a good idea recently. He suggested teaching to yell 'This is NOT my mom/dad' if someone tries to take him instead of screaming since many people avert their attention from screaming children assuming it's a tantrum. I think it was a really good idea!

[texmama]

Originally Posted by abiyhayil

DH came home with a good idea recently. He suggested teaching to yell 'This is NOT my mom/dad' if someone tries to take him instead of screaming since many people avert their attention from screaming children assuming it's a tantrum. I think it was a really good idea!

great idea. I'll have to tell dd that

[~PurityLake~]

Originally Posted by meemee

she also had a v. strong intuition about people and i encouraged that wholeheartedly. if she didnt want to go near someone, she wanted to walk on the other side of the road i would let her. whether she was able to express that in words or not.

i never made her say hi to people if she didn't want to.

I totally agree with respecting her feelings. This is what I do with my daughters.

Originally Posted by meemee

plus i dont buy into the stranger danger anyways.

for all i know the 'stranger' might come in the form of 'cancer'.

Or the bad person is a trusted family member or family friend or neighbor or babysitter.

Originally Posted by meemee

i think we all have a sense of danger. during childhood i think we parents kinda squash that under the guise of socially acceptable behavior. i recognize what my dd has was how i was when i was a little girl. my people instincts were dead on as a child and its pretty sharp these days too. i also had pretty good 'rabbit ears' for danger that i no longer have as strongly as i did when i was a kid and that is irreplaceable.

i think we are all born with great instincts. but somehow they get squashed somewhere in childhood.

I think that's true, too.

Originally Posted by abiyhayil

DH came home with a good idea recently. He suggested teaching to yell 'This is NOT my mom/dad' if someone tries to take him instead of screaming since many people avert their attention from screaming children assuming it's a tantrum. I think it was a really good idea!

That's a good idea. The problem with my children, is they mix up words in sentences and that would likely come out 'This is my mommy' because they'd forget to add the word not, just like when they tell daddy when he leaves for work, 'Don't get mommy a kiss and hugs' because they forget to say the for part of the word forget.