4 year old won't let me go

[sunma]

I have a fabulous 4 y o dd. When she was an infant, I was the primary everything, and valued my dh for letting me be so. She used to go with him places. Then she didn't want to. Then she did. Now she won't go to the store, the park, on a bike ride ANYWHERE with her dad. She adores him more than ever. When he goes somewhere, she misses him. She plays with him as long as I am in the house. But she won't go anywhere without me. And she won't "let" me leave. All this was fine with me, I figured I could wait it out, she is so pleasant to be with. And then she started not always being pleasant in the last month. And I was getting snappy. And that's not O.K. with me. The first time, I told her that as long as she's pleasant to be around, I have no problem doing the 24 hours a day, but when she's not, I do.
I am not O.K. with this anymore, because I feel like it's telling her that she has to walk the line and be perfect or else. But I actually really do need some time to myself.
And pleasant or not, I find myself stealing time to myself by tuning her out. So not o.k.
The thing is, she is not particularly clingy, she is very social, she just likes to have me just in case.
I have no idea what this is about. Maybe it is normal, but if not, I am sure it is me projecting something. I have always been able to set boundaries in the rest of our lives, but maybe I have some abandonment issues.
Any gentle ways to deal with this?

[St. Margaret]

I've heard that at 4yo, kids start to realize that there's something going on while they're not there-- like, life is going on for you when you're away from her. And they don't want to miss out on potential fun! I don't know if that helps at all, but maybe it could give you some new angle to try. I hear you on not wanting to snap and not wanting to tune her out, or make her feel like it's not okay to have bad moments. I would keep pushing some alone time for you. If it's easier for you to leave, do it that way, or maybe once she's out with dad she'll be so distracted she'll be fine. I would keep trying. That's hard.

[Dandelionkid]

Well, it sounds like you need to take some time for yourself. I know it is hard when they cry when you leave- I have definitely been there. At the same time, I feel that I burden the kids unfairly when I give in to their demands to keep me home 24/7. I don't know if that makes sense. When my dd5 or ds3 cries for me not to go to the gym in the evening, I try to make it easier for them but I don't *not* go because of their demands. I don't want them to feel that they have that much power over me- I think that creates a burden for the child.
I also refuse to feel guilt about the hour or so that I am gone because parent guilt also creates an unneeded burden on kids, imo.
In any case, it sounds like you are working through some of your own issues right now (aren't we all!), and I am sure you will come up with a plan that works for all of you.

[denimtiger]

What, exactly, happens if you DO leave? Some separation anxiety and tears are pretty normal for a four-year-old who would prefer to have a parent around. It doesn't mean that she's not actally emotionally okay when you're gone.

Having to be together 24/7 always is not really a normal state for ANY kind of relationship. And you are saying that you need some time for yourself, and you DO to have your own mental health, as well as being able to healthfully interact with your daughter.

What you're doing in telling her you'll stay if she's pleasant to be around IS setting her up to see you leaving as a punishment, and that your wanting to be with her is conditional. While I do think it's okay to teach kids that people prefer to spend time with people who are pleasant, you're both going to have consequences if she thinks that anytime you leave it's because of her behavior.

The more time you spend with her when you need time to yourself, the less pleasantly you are going to see her... tiny annoyances can get very big when you're exposed to them constantly with no break. It also gets very easy to blame her for your own emotions ... your own feelings of guilt for wanting to leave and go do something else transfer to it being her fault, because her behavior makes you want to leave.

I think you already know this, but leaving a child for periods of time to do what you need/want to do is NOT abandonment. You need to set the boundary here and let her know that sometimes you are going to do things without her, and she is going to do things without you, and that is OK. You love each other, and you'll be so happy to be back together later, but right now, you both have other things to do.

It's okay to model taking care of your own needs to your daughter, and show her that healthy people do take time for themselves and recharge themselves mentally and emotionally. Someday she may have a friend who wants to monopolize all of her time and emotionally blackmails her by getting upset when she leaves. Do you want your daughter to have a model of healthful power in that situation, or guilt?

It's not her that doesn't "let" you leave... she's 4, she can't block your way and she doesn't have a gun. It is your own guilt that keeps you in the house and that you need to examine. Should a mom feel guilty for going shopping alone when her child is well-taken care of and safe and knows that mom will always return and be there for her? Yes, the child may get upset, but she will not be scarred for life. Seeing a mom with unhealthy boundaries, or having a mom who has neglected her own needs and is becoming easily agitated could do a lot more harm.

[Ruthla]

I think it's time for you to set a firm boundary here. You ARE going to leave her with Daddy sometimes, whether she's happy about it or not. Don't tie this to her behavior- whether she's delightful or annoying, you need a break and that's that. You need a break for you, and it has nothing to do with how she acts. It's not a punishment- it's just something that Mommy is going to do. Period.

If she cries when you leave, he'll comfort her. If she starts clinging to your legs when you walk out the door and won't let go, he'll pick her up and physically restrain her while you leave. If she cries the whole time you're gone (which I highly doubt will happen- chances are she'll be fine within 5 minutes after you leave) then he'll continue to comfort her while you're out.

She WILL be OK with Daddy for a few hours. You need to have absolute confidence of this, no matter how she acts when you say goodbye.

[Dandelionkid]

Originally Posted by denimtiger

. Seeing a mom with unhealthy boundaries, or having a mom who has neglected her own needs and is becoming easily agitated could do a lot more harm.

Love this.

[notneb]

Originally Posted by Ruthla

I think it's time for you to set a firm boundary here. You ARE going to leave her with Daddy sometimes, whether she's happy about it or not. Don't tie this to her behavior- whether she's delightful or annoying, you need a break and that's that. You need a break for you, and it has nothing to do with how she acts. It's not a punishment- it's just something that Mommy is going to do. Period.

If she cries when you leave, he'll comfort her. If she starts clinging to your legs when you walk out the door and won't let go, he'll pick her up and physically restrain her while you leave. If she cries the whole time you're gone (which I highly doubt will happen- chances are she'll be fine within 5 minutes after you leave) then he'll continue to comfort her while you're out.

She WILL be OK with Daddy for a few hours. You need to have absolute confidence of this, no matter how she acts when you say goodbye.

What Ruthla said!!

Just go! Your DD will be fine, she and your DH will have a closer relationship, and you will be a better mama for taking some time to meet your own needs.

[orangefoot]

I'm sorry, I was nosy and clicked you past posts. This is an ongoing situation that you are getting less and less happy with I think?

All my children know that I will always come back for them wherever I go and however long I am gone for. Have you talked about that with her? Does she think that if you go away you won't come back?

Your dd is a 4yo with two loving parents. No harm will come to her if she is with her daddy and no harm will come to you if you are away from her.

My younger children have a very close bond with their dad because he has been running our own business since they were little so he has had a lot of time to be with them.

I think it is important for little people to know that they can rely on either of their parents to be there for them and if you have been everything to her up to now, she needs time to spend with her dad to find out that he can do everything for her too. Our children and dh have their 'things' which they do when I'm not there. They eat crazy snacks or all do the washing up together, they all squeeze onto the sofa and watch movies or dance to ABBA.

Start planning times when you will go out on a weekly basis. Pick a day and something that you want to do and just go out. Tell her you will be back and that you still love her even when you can't see her. She and here dad will start to get their own things going on together and hopefully she will look forward to the times they are together without you.

She can't make the break but you can so it will have to be you who does it! Be firm and be kind but do follow through.

[GuildJenn]

When my son goes through these kinds of phases I give him a bracelet of kisses (beads) to remind him that he always has my love. A little token (doesn't have to be new or shiny) or a note for her pocket might help.

[Gunter]

just wanted to acknowledge that leaving/staying is a hard thins sometimes. i am glad that you have people speaking wisdom into your life and that you are so thoughtful about your babe's needs and your own.

[JL83]

I think it's OK to set limits with a 4yo.

[sunma]

Can't even begin to say how helpful these replies have been.
So, DD has always been a mama's girl, but she has always enjoyed DH. She used to go with him. And then she'd go through clingier periods and come out of it. We spent a month taking care of my dad out of town a few months ago and she was amazing, patient, etc., but I was all she had. I think it kind of threw her into an I am dependent on mama thing (the irony is that she is incredibly independent, it's not like she hangs on me, she just likes to know I'm there). I tried posting earlier today, but my internet was down, I was going to say then that I had posted here before about this same issue and got more of the it's a stage kind of reply, which was helpful then, but I think I just realized that it's beyond that now, it's become an issue. And that's why I posted again. And the answers here were hugely helpful.
So first, hugely helpful, obviously I need to take time for myself. I read the expression once, The tea pot has to be filled to fill the cups. The big thing here for me is not to feel guilty. I don't think guilty about it, but I do feel guilty (I mean, I don't think I'm doing wrong, but I still feel bad). I think being aware of that will help.
When I do leave, she does cry, but not for long. She does try to guilt me about it though. I don't buy into it, I let her know that I missed her too, but I came back.
I really think the idea of it for her is bigger than me going. When I leave, my husband actually does have to physically restrain her (she runs out of the house and climbs into the car).
So I have grown up with parents that did the if you do this, I won't talk to you for a few years and when I realized that I was essentially saying this to my daughter, I tripped. I made it very clear that I love her no matter what, and while I don't appreciate the unpleasantness, I would not leave her. I told her that when I go it is because I need mama time no matter what. She got that (though she told me she would give it to me while we were both home).
She is a great communicator, but I really don't like to over talk things. I think now I just have to go. I am going to tomorrow. And I don't have anywhere to be, but I do need to shop, and usually I take her because I enjoy her and she can go, but I think I need to get going on this.
I LOVED the parallel of someday she may have a friend (or a husband) that does the same thing and I am modelling the behavior for that. I can't believe I missed that before. I've used that same example when talking about how I treat her or why I don't allow her to mistreat me. Thank you for that. Really hit home.
Also, I love the "it's just something mama is going to do." Less drama, less talk. (I also grew up with excessive talk until you see my point of view or else til 4 am)
And Orangefoot, not nosy, actually really thoughtful that you would go deeper, amazing really.
She does know I'll be back, she knows her dad takes good care of her, she is fine shortly after I am gone.
Let me say, the biggest thing here is that hearing it from like minded parents is huge for me and in such thoughtful and though provoking ways. And that I have to do it. And do it now.
Thank you so much for that.
I think it will be so healthy for her not to have the burden of being in control of this. I didn't realize she was. And it will be so healthy for me to take some time to myself.
And reading my reply here, I am realizing all this "issues" I have that I was so unaware of. Can I get over it already, please? Oh, and also, I think I have a control issue, too, in the food department. I have to remind myself, telling her dad what not to feed her is worse for her than red dye (but Kool aid is still not allowed )
Thank you again. Tomorrow I'm outtie.

[orangefoot]

Go and have a good time!

[abi&ben'smom]

Have fun!

[sunma]

I just wanted to update...
I had been practicing going and it did get easier... Until one day, in October, we were at a friend's and I told her we needed to go. SHE suggested that she stay and I go. Never happens, she never goes for that. So I left (for 5 minutes only, because we really did have to go home and have dinner, but I wasn't leaving that opportunity!) And ever since, she just says it's no big deal. She still most of the time would rather stay with me, but it's just not a huge issue anymore. Actually, now she REALLY wants to go to kindergarten.... not home school kindergarten...
Thanks so much for the feed back. Huge.

[kimellett]

I love a happy ending!!! I used to have to tell my 4 yo DS I was going to mop the floors and do the dishes when he was gone so he wouldn't think I was having too much fun without him. Now he LOVES to mop the floors, so that no longer works.

[TiredX2]

Moved to The Childhood Years

[LynnS6]

Originally Posted by sunma

She does know I'll be back, she knows her dad takes good care of her, she is fine shortly after I am gone..

This speaks volumes -- it's not you being gone that she doesn't like, it's the thought of separation that bothers her. Once it's over and done with, she's OK.

If it helps, there are days when I have to peel our 5 1/2 year old off my leg to get out the house. It doesn't help that I WOH, so she doesn't see me as much as I'm sure your dd does. But there are times when I need to go without her, and it's hard on us both. I try to keep these to a minimum, but sometimes, they happen!

Enjoy your outing!