Could someone admit to not being perfect either please! - Page 3

[jujyfruitbaby]

This is true, Seasons. Which is why you have to consider where you are and what the situation is. Yes, if you're in a very vulnerable position socially/legally, you must mind the Ps and Qs. You also have to think about where you are geographically and in terms of bosses. I would not, for instance, be happy working for Swiss watchmakers. Yes, I can be on the dot if necessary. But I don' t like how that kind of vigilance feels, and I don't like how it looms over the rest of what I do. Similarly, I know how to wear a suit and cross my legs at the ankle, but I much prefer old shorts and Earth shoes. So I find ways to live that accommodate, as closely as possible, who I be.

School -- well, there I have no real choice. Kid's gotta go to school. However, I also know that in the scheme of the school's things, chronic few-minutes-late tardiness, with occasional more serious tardiness, is a minor issue. I also know that the teachers are largely hopeful about homework. The big picture's that the kid is clean, polite, bright, learns well, has friends, and is well ahead of the curve, and that I'm clearly interested in and participating in her education. So I am 99.9% sure that the teacher won't even bring these things up with me.

So maybe my tardiness is not such a good example of telling the system to deal; I'm just recognizing and working within the tolerances of a system whose rules I don't approve but am stuck inside. But I do think that in Seie's case, where she's outside some of the system's tolerances, there's good reason and good chances if she says firmly: "Look. I am doing all I can. You will have to respect that and work with it. I appreciate that you see problems, and I do too, but given the circumstances it's the best we'll get, so let's concentrate instead on other areas of Seiekid's school performance," they will accommodate her, because to do otherwise would be too expensive for them. If the whole picture is shading into a DHS situation, then yes, she has cause to worry. But otherwise, she and her kids will pass through that school, and eventually out, and the teachers know that, too.

[Teensy]

I am very, very imperfect. I could fill many pages with all the ways I do things less well than I would like, or even am just plain terrible about (don't even get me started on the shame I feel about all the screaming I do at my kids).

But that being said, I used to be late all the time to everything (I was the one friends knew would be 15 minutes late to anything), but now I rarely am (sometimes, but not constantly like I used to be). Here are the things I had to change:

1. I had to realize how disrepectful I was being to others. My time wasn't more important than their time. I had to admit that I had been acting that way.

2. I started actually timing how long things actually took. The "ten minutes to get somewhere" turned out to be 17 minutes when I actually looked at the clock in the driveway and upon getting there. I was underestimating everything by a large amount and the cumulative effect was very bad.

3. I had to stop my habit of doing "just one more thing" before leaving the house - no more starting a load of laundry or unloading the dishwasher. Yes, it is nice to get things done, but not at the expense of making others feel I am rude and unappreciative of their time.

4. For the days that I have to get my kids to school and myself to work, it is the night before that makes all the difference. Although I sometimes still collaspe into bed without doing my evening routine (promising myself that I will get up early enough to get things done), I regret it every time. If I want to get out the door in a timely fashion (without the previously mentioned screaming), I have to have the backpacks packed and in place, shoes in their place, coffee maker filled up and set to auto, lunch boxes packed, water bottles washed and filled with ice (I add water in the morning), my clothes picked out, kids clothes picked out, purse and travel mug set out ready to go.


If you want to change this one area (I'm sure you'll have other areas remain imperfect, just life the rest of the (honest) human race), I would recommend that you make a list of everything you need to do the night before and do it all every night, plus leave at least ten minutes earlier than necessary for 21 days. They say it takes 21 days to make a habit, so make this your new good habit for the fall.

But do stop beating yourself up!

[Holland73]

Originally Posted by jujyfruitbaby

But I do think that in Seie's case, where she's outside some of the system's tolerances, there's good reason and good chances if she says firmly: "Look. I am doing all I can. You will have to respect that and work with it. I appreciate that you see problems, and I do too, but given the circumstances it's the best we'll get, so let's concentrate instead on other areas of Seiekid's school performance," they will accommodate her, because to do otherwise would be too expensive for them. If the whole picture is shading into a DHS situation, then yes, she has cause to worry. But otherwise, she and her kids will pass through that school, and eventually out, and the teachers know that, too.

I think you need to go back and read the OP. Seie's child's teacher is not giving her a hard time, just sharing with her the fact that *her son* is having a difficult time with the tardiness, which he had already expressed earlier to Seie.

DS was so embarressed and didnt want to go in. And it was my fault. The teacher comes out and tells me (appropriately so) that DS really doesnt like to be late.

Personally, if my ds ever felt "so embarrassed" that he wouldn't want to go into his classroom... I would be busting my a** (and putting some of the responsibility onto him to help, as we are a family, a team, who works together to solve our problems) to make sure he was on time.

Which why so many people are giving her wonderful tips and advice on how to do it.

[josybear]

this is in no way directed to the op, i'm just interested in this spinoff discussion that is happening.

Originally Posted by Teensy

1. I had to realize how disrepectful I was being to others. My time wasn't more important than their time. I had to admit that I had been acting that way.

this is how i feel when somebody is late for meeting me. is my time so much less valuable than their time? should i have to sit and wait when i have other things i could be doing? i tend to not make plans with friends that are often late, not rehire babysitters that don't arrive at least a few minutes early, and not bother attending events that take a while to get going. it's not that i'm anal about time (i hope) it's just that i have so little of it and so i really resent outside forces robbing me of it. i feel disrespected when people waste my time like that.
it follows that i can't be late for things without being a hypocrite. i'm on time for things (most of the time, that is. i won't pretend i'm perfect) and i hope that other people will be, too.

this was a major issue with ex. he was ok with making me wait around all day for him to get moving, get somewhere, get something done, etc., until i completely distrusted him and didn't rely on him for anything at all. his chronic lateness and unapologeticness seriously eroded our relationship over time.

[Ellien C]

Not a single mom, but honest-to-betsy I only bathe my 6 yo on weekends and I only brush her long hair once a week. There's not time during the week to bathe and she fights brushing tooth and nail. She can do it herself on weekdays or it doesn't get done. I brush it out on weekends after we shampoo. And yes - it's long and it gets really knotty by Friday. To be honest, if she came to me with a brush I would help her, but brushing is NEVER her idea. We only brush teeth once a day at night!

[lilyka]

well, i can only speak to the place where I work, we hire people of many ethinic back grounds, some of which do not even speak Englich. ages 14-84. all leavels of education.people making everything from minimum wage to 6 figures. starter positions to running a muti million dollar business. No one is allowed to be late for anything. if you are you get fired. end of story. not the first time but if it happens consistantly and if you are unapologetic for it you should not expect to last long. I do not have the luxury of having a "come as I please" job. i suppose they exist. i can't think of what any of them are though. if i have an appointment with my lawyer, Dr., electrition etc I expect them to be on time. I expect my babysitter to be on time. so no matter who I am hiring for what, how much I am paying them or what ethnic orgin they are I expect them to be there when they say they will. and their promptness and how sorry they are for their lack of promptness will make a difference.

as for different cultural feelings on time, i had to giggle. my priest, when announcing Sunday schools start time said "it starts at 9. promptly. thats american time. "

[neverdoingitagain]

Interesting. (I'm chronically late too, its something I struggle with)


I've been recently wondering about stuff like tv-free, car-free, telephone-free, off the grid. Now I'm thinking the most amazing thing to be, would be clock-free. Can you imagine a life without clocks? There would be no "on-time" "late" "overdue". You would sleep when you were tired, wake up when you were awake. You would visit for as long as you wanted, or as little. Either way, long enough.
I know it would be incredibly difficult in reality. I'm addicted to my clocks. They're everywhere. Being chronically late makes me hyper aware of the time, all the time. What a relief it would be...

[Seasons]

Originally Posted by neverdoingitagain

Can you imagine . . . . You would sleep when you were tired, wake up when you were awake. . . .
I know it would be incredibly difficult in reality.

FWIW, I haven't ever used an alarm clock, nor coffee. And I managed college, grad school (including 7am daily racquetball games), two decades so far of a career (with prompt start times and tons of meetings), dd's school dropoff before work. I just think it's really, really, really important to get enough sleep!

That said... well, you already know what I think about being late.

[sunflowers]

Regarding the issue of the OP and being a single parent: One thing some of us have to consider is that chronic tardiness can cost us custody of our children. I have known parents who lost primary custody because they could not get their kids places on time. Specifically school. It is unfortunate that we have the added concern that being late for Kindy more than once a month can do that but it is a reality for those that have more contentious coparenting relationships. The OP did not indicate this was an issue for her situtaion but it certainly could possibly become one.

On the side discussion:

I do not have the luxury of having a "come as I please" job. i suppose they exist. i can't think of what any of them are though.

I actually do have a job that is more flexible than most. If I am an hour late, no big thing. But I do not work in a typical office, I do not interact with the public regularly. I run instruments and generate data. As long as the instrument is running and the data is reported on time, nobody cares what hours I work. I do spend the majority of my work week during regular business hours, though, because my coworkers and other people in the company appreciate being able to contact me at a resonable hour if there is an issue, question, or rush job.

[Savoir Faire]

Originally Posted by Seasons

You should apologize when your choices (here, not to follow school rules) negatively affect other people:

To not see these obvious consequences of your choices is... naive at best. Hence the efforts of well-meaning folks in this thread to not only give practical tips to help chronically tardy moms, but also to explain why one person's chronic tardiness DOES impact others.

My mom is chronically tardy. She was when I was younger and I HATED IT. Even now, as an adult, she's late and it is RUDE. She just doesn't try to get to places on time, be it the doctor, dentist or hairdresser. She doesn't try hard to get to places on time when I really need her help. She's my mom and I love her, but it isn't fair to other people.

Nobody is perfect, but it doesn't hurt to at least try to be considerate.

[One Art]

To add onto my previous post: I offered my thoughts/questions because while I live in the U.S., I live in a place that exists outside the predominate U.S. cultural norms. Where I live everyone and everything is late. The train runs by my house, always late. Theater performances, about 10 minutes late. Movies at the movie theater, the same. People get to work 10-15 minutes late. Appointments anywhere - doctor/dentist/counselor, etc. are at least 15 minutes later than scheduled. My daughter goes to a school where about half (and I'm not joking) the kids in each class arrive late. Last week I got my daughter to school 10 minutes late one day, and I was worried about it and asked her if her teacher said anything, or if she felt uncomfortable walking in late. She looked amazed that I'd ask such a question and said "Sally was wayyy later than me." Here, the people who are on-time, or early, are the minority, and are constantly frustrated. They are in sync with another way of being and functioning. It is seemingly impossible for them to readjust their internal clock to being late like everyone else. I wonder how possible/impossible it is for late people to adjust the other way? I'm not implying an answer one way or another, just asking a question. I think a lot of important issues have been brought up (for example, respect, and timing things to see how long they actually take), but I'm wondering if there is something more basic, and not rationally based, that is at the root of this for some people?

[Savoir Faire]

Oh...and just wanted to add, a few tricks could probably make your life much easier. It has taken me a long time to even START getting where I want to be, organized-wise, but it is slowly working. I have ADD and it just makes things one big jumble.

As people said before about the laying out of clothes, keeping things in certain places, lunches made the night before, VERY IMPORTANT. Find yourself the biggest calendar you can and keep everything listed there.

Streamline meals (spaghetti mondays, pizza saturdays) to take some of the stress of you.

As for leaving, always leave 10 extra minutes before you leave for last minute diaper changes or potty trips. Have a buzzer go off and everyone at the door with whatever they need.

Might want to look into some books on this subject...hopefully they can make you feel better.

[neverdoingitagain]

Originally Posted by neverdoingitagain

Interesting. (I'm chronically late too, its something I struggle with)


I've been recently wondering about stuff like tv-free, car-free, telephone-free, off the grid. Now I'm thinking the most amazing thing to be, would be clock-free. Can you imagine a life without clocks? There would be no "on-time" "late" "overdue". You would sleep when you were tired, wake up when you were awake. You would visit for as long as you wanted, or as little. Either way, long enough.
I know it would be incredibly difficult in reality. I'm addicted to my clocks. They're everywhere. Being chronically late makes me hyper aware of the time, all the time. What a relief it would be...

Crap, I realized after I posted that I was in the wrong forum Sorry, I didn't realize this was the single parent forum! I just read it from the new posts.

I should also add to my above post that I was chronically late. Now I'm rarely late. Instead, I now have anxiety attacks about time.
Anyway, good luck OP. I hope you find some solutions. It does take a toll when you're late, doesn't it

[jujyfruitbaby]

Wow, this is an interesting conversation. Yes, I've found that in other countries where I've worked, nobody, but nobody, wandered in before 9:30 or so. Then they'd read the paper and have some coffee before settling down to work, go out for lunch around one and make a meal of it with beer or wine, come back and work till somewhere between four and six, then wander off home, or stay late if there was a project deadline. But no, there was no "time to start work" unless you were a bank clerk or worked in a shop or something like that. And the idea of starting work or school at 7:30 or 8 in the morning -- no, people just didn't do it, because it was normal in the culture for adults to go out at night and have late dinners, drinks, take in a show, etc.

Oh, there are so many things I think are more important than punctuality. Teeth, yes, I think teeth are generally more important than punctuality. The people you're being punctual for can't give you a new set of teeth. Serious conversations. Time to finish things properly. Time to taste food. Time to walk. Sleep.

Yes, if a friend tells me it's important to her that I be on the dot because her life's so crammed and she's got so little power over it, of course I'll do it. But if it's just because she's an anxious person who can't bear lateness, or views it as having a moral dimension, or if she just rushes around and can't relax...well, we probably won't be friends long. I'm trying to think if any of my friends turn up bang on time, and no, not one of them does. I bring a book or some work if I expect to be early or on-time.

Well, I'd better get to work; the original deadline was over three months ago. Of course, they didn't manage to get a contract to me until a month and a half ago.

Oh -- and Holland, I understand that you find it disruptive when people come in late. But I must gently remind you that you chose to work in a clockwork system. Dd's daycare manages to teach children important skills all day long while people and animals come and go, no drop-off time, no pick-up time. If I could send her to an elementary school like that, I certainly would. As it is, I can't. The watch-tappers rule the roost and keep the money. So -- unless it's going to land me in hot water, or dd is in psychological agonies, the school can bend a bit, & does.

[Holland73]

Originally Posted by jujyfruitbaby

Oh -- and Holland, I understand that you find it disruptive when people come in late. But I must gently remind you that you chose to work in a clockwork system.

No need to gently remind me... I have absolutely NO problem working in such a clockwork system.

BUT... the people coming in late have also chosen to enroll their student at our clockwork system school, as most public schools tend to be such systems. Therefore, they should abide by (and respect) that clock system.

Additionally, this morning when TWO students came walking in 5 & 10 minutes late and I had to stop my students' read aloud twice, it was not just me who found it disruptive. My 20 1st graders were very frustrated and very vocal about their frustration.... and rightly so! It is NOT fair to those who did arrive on time.

[jujyfruitbaby]

Originally Posted by Holland73

No need to gently remind me... I have absolutely NO problem working in such a clockwork system.

BUT... the people coming in late have also chosen to enroll their student at our clockwork system school, as most public schools tend to be such systems. Therefore, they should abide by (and respect) that clock system.

Seriously, Holland, the minute the state's willing to relinquish the per-capita tax money and say "Here, go educate her as you see fit, so long as she passes the tests," I'd be on it, and sleeping better, too. Until that happens, or a mysterious rich relative drops a bag of money on us, there's effectively no choice about enrolling her in public school. I don't have time (and probably haven't the temperament) to homeschool, and I can't afford to pay others.

For most people here, public school is not a choice; it's just what there is.

Additionally, this morning when TWO students came walking in 5 & 10 minutes late and I had to stop my students' read aloud twice, it was not just me who found it disruptive. My 20 1st graders were very frustrated and very vocal about their frustration.... and rightly so! It is NOT fair to those who did arrive on time.

I have to say, I find this curious. I'm sure what you say is true, but teachers and students are always in and out of my daughter's classroom, and, as I mentioned, they're open-plan rooms. They hear the other classes clearly -- singing, talking, laughing, doing lessons on a schedule different from their own. I can see it being a problem for children with learning disabilities, and frankly it seems noisy and distracting to me, but whenever I've been in there, I've noticed no frustration or agitation on the part of children or teachers when someone comes into the room. Do people have to make a big production to get into your classroom -- open up a big squeaking door, walk in front of you, something like that?

It might help that the first 15 minutes of each day at her school are time for getting settled and then sitting in a group to look at the calendar and talk about the day. They don't come in and head right for librarylike silence. I wouldn't be surprised if that has something to do with the likelihood that kids will come in a few minutes tardy.

[Seie]

THis is going in unforseen interesting directions

First - We haven't been late for school since I posted the original post.

For the whole time-discussion then I suppose I am somewhere in the middle. I dont think its great to be tardy. I do think its fair to respect other peoples time. But on the other hand I think there should be respect going two ways. I try to be on time - I respect that it is importent for some people. But if I am late I expect people to respect that I may have a good reason. We are different and we should try to meet both ways - not just one.
I dont think being a few minutes late is the end of the world really - and I prefer living in a world where it's not all that important. Since it's important to my son to be in school on time, I do my best that we can get there - on time. But if something happens and we are late. Goodness it really still isn't the end of the world.

I know I am disorganised when it comes to the physical world. But I also know that I am a heck of a lot better parent than some of the "perfect" parents with big fat, clean and organized houses, big cars and long working hours. I spend TIME with my kids. I listen to them. I am interested in their world. I am loving. I set boundaries - healthy reasonable ones. I support them and comfort them when they are sad - etc. All the gentle parenting stuff. I generally feel I am pretty balanced and a good mother.
The other day I heard a couple picking up their son - parents looked very normal and average. The kid was crying ( a boy my sons age) and I heard the dad tell him "Dont cry, you aren't a baby are you." It's possible their kid is on time - I dont know. But I still feel like the better parent to be honest.

I guess my intention was with the first post that I know I am not perfect. But I am a good mother regardless. It's refreshing to hear others own up to their imperfections too. (cause you know we all have them)

[Holland73]

Originally Posted by jujyfruitbaby

For most people here, public school is not a choice; it's just what there is.

Everyone has a choice... public, private, homeschool, etc. NOW, those options may not be accessible to everyone... but they are still options, which allow for choice.

I have seen parents find (and raise) the money, in additional finding options that were not initially offered to them, when they were motivated to find them.

Originally Posted by jujyfruitbaby

It might help that the first 15 minutes of each day at her school are time for getting settled and then sitting in a group to look at the calendar and talk about the day. They don't come in and head right for librarylike silence. I wouldn't be surprised if that has something to do with the likelihood that kids will come in a few minutes tardy.

I have absolutely no expectation for librarylike silence, even during read alouds. They are 6 year olds! Besides, the best learning they get is when they are talking and interacting with me and their classmates.

FTR: Our school has to "lie" to parents that school starts at 8:40 and I pick students up at 8:40 and give them until 8:52 to chat with me and each other and get settled before we settle in for THEIR chosen read aloud. Now, in all honesty, school technically begins at 8:52, but we have so many problems with tardies that we were hoping this would help.

[Seasons]

Originally Posted by Holland73

FTR: Our school has to "lie" to parents that school starts at 8:40 . . . .

Who does that help? Geez. (Not mad at YOU, but at the chronically-late parents who make lying seem necessary - and who make you-and-the-prompt-kids wait around. I'm sure all of you have a better use for 12 minutes a day than waiting for latecomers. And in accomodating latecomers' rule-breaking, they won't learned to follow rules.) I canNOT stand when things - meetings, social events - start the "real activities" late to wait for latecomers. The latecomers get to choose how I have to spend my time?

[lillacfaerie]

I haven't read all the posts, but I just want to tell the OP that you are just like my mom, and my mom is great! I was late for school everyday of my life! My mother was a whirlwind of fun and creativity. She was by far the most fun mom in my community. She never freaked out if we wore dirty shoes in the house. She never freaked out if we broke something accidentally. She never yelled at us to clean our rooms. She encouraged us to be creative and spontanious, but at the same time, she taught us how to be gracious and loving towards other living things. And you know what? I think I have grown up to be amazing in unpredictable situations. I am extremely flexible, and have a reputation in my field for being easy going and willing to try new things. This has served me extremely well.
I have a tendency to be a neat freak around my own house (probably some reaction to my upbringing), and I'm actively trying not to be. I want to be a fun mom, not a mom who gets worked up over inessential things. So you get your kids to school late; who really cares? I know it annoys your son, it annoyed me too when I was a kid, but I still loved my mom and thought she was awesome! Especially when I went over to other kids houses and was afraid to walk across their bright white carpets!
Now, the lateness is clearly bothering everyone, so try not to be late. One of things that helps my mom is to keep saying to herself "just leave the house, leave the house" It's getting out the front door that's the problem.
You are a great and fun mom! Your kids will love you for it, I promise!