Your thoughts about chicken pox

[lovebeingamomma]

No judgement on non-vaxing moms I totally respect that decision I was just wondering...

If it's SO hard to find chicken pox, if everyone just stopped trying to go get there kids to get it, wouldn't it just cease to exist all together? I know there are more risks in getting it as an adult, but there are also risks in getting it as a child. I would think it would be come extremely rare if non vaxng moms would stop seeking it out. Again no judgment, but it's something I always think about when I see the chix pot party threads. So please set me straight and explain to me why you think it makes sense to keep it alive.

[SuburbanHippie]

I want my kids to become immune to chicken pox. The best, most natural way to become immune to chicken pox is through catching wild chicken pox. If everyone caught chicken pox naturally, there would be constant exposure for adults (like a booster) so the chances of having shingles would diminish.

Also, your theory would never hold up unless everyone lived in a bubble. People travel all the time to foreign countries where chicken pox is prevalent. You can carry diseases without having any symptoms so it's not easy to know who is carrying it.

[kiwiva]

Also, it is a live vax so you you can spread it for a bit after being vaxed as well. And if someone has shingles they can give you chicken pox if you are not immune (my sis got cp as an adult from my mom having shingles). You can get shingles whether you've had cp or the vax. The vax does not convey 100% lifelong immunity, so those who either don't become immune after being vaxed or don't get boosters and lose immunity will have the opportunity to get it either by travel or the above.

It will stay alive whether we go out seeking pox parties or not.

[Marnica]

Your assumption is incorrect.....even if people stopped seeking out CP, it would never die out totally....the plague is still around. Now if people stopped vaxing.....then eventually this mild self-limiting disease would peter out and become rare like the plague because most people would get it and have lifetime immunity. This is why most infectious diseases that there has been a vaccine for were all on the way out before the vaccine ever came to be. This is the natural evolution of disease.
The risks for CP in children (and other infections kids get like measles) has far more to do with the immune system of the host and how the disease is treated..

[lovebeingamomma]

good thoughts thank you. I wouldn't think it would die out completely, as I said, just become very rare. I realize I said cease to exist but you're right that would never happen.

[jessjgh1]

I would love to see what people making these decisions THOUGH would happen after the vaccine and compare them to what we have actually seen
That's one way my 'brain' thinks about the issue...
If the people implementing the policies really made good public policy decisions... one thing they might have realized when first recommending mandatory cp vax would be to inform people that there is a sheddding factor after the vaccine and advise people to limit their contact, especially with populations at risk.
The natural cycle between shingles and chicken pox has now been disrupted.
We've seen an increase in shingles in younger people and might expect an increase in chicken pox in adults or teens. So they have had to add the chicken pox booster shots. Now there is the new shingles vax too.
It doesn't really seem to me the result was acceptable, predicted, or justified, given the (in)severity of chicken pox and the known natural cycle with shingles. Now we've 'replaced' one problem with another and added 3 shots to the lineup.
It is just too easy to see all the $$ with the increase in vaxes, boosters and now shingles vax- and for chickenpox?

Jessica

[k9sarchik]

It will never die out completely because the US is the only country with CP vaccine for school entry. It is wild throughout the rest of the world and even other few countries that vax for it only have it as a voluntary vax.

It is strictly a $ making vaccine. It does more harm then good and has caused the US to have an epidemic of shingles which causes more deaths and suffering then CP has ever done.

This vaccine infuriates me!!

[zinemama]

In my experience it is not hard to find or get chicken pox. I certainly didn't have to seek it out. My 3yo came home with it all on his own.

[PlayaMama]

Originally Posted by Marnica

...then eventually this mild self-limiting disease would peter out and become rare like the plague because most people would get it and have lifetime immunity.

how long has chicken pox been aroun? wikipedia says, "Chickenpox was first identified by Persian scientist Muhammad ibn Zakariya ar-Razi (865–925)..."

that doesn't really seem like it's "petering out". i would imagine that it's different than the plague in that it rarely kills it's host and thus, it doesn't lead to the same immune-or-dead type immunity that the plague offered.

and, ftr, i'm not dead set on keeping it alive, i won't vax my kids for it but i'm not necessarily going to seek it out. i had it as a teenager and it was extremely mild.

[alegna]

Chickenpox will never go away- it's a brilliant virus. With shingles erupting in previously infected (or vaccinated) people it keeps itself in circulation no matter what.

Tons of CP around here anyway.

-Angela

[Ritske]

I believe Marnica meant it would be as rare as the plague is now. No one really talks about the plague because it's not widespead, but it is still out there. I'm pretty sure she wasn't comparing them, just saying the chances of coming down with them would probably be the same if the vaccine never existed.

[Jugs]

Hmm, I wouldn't say it is accurate to use the plague as a comparison for chicken pox. The plague is directly attributed to poor living conditions and exposure to rodents; it died out as sanitation and animal-control measures improved.

[Ritske]

The plague is not actually dead. But I'm sure if they ever make a 'good' vaccine for it, we'll hear all about how it's killing people at a remarkable rate.

[Jugs]

Sorry, I meant "died out" in the loosest sense of the term; it is still around, but certainly not common.

[Gitti]

Originally Posted by lovebeingamomma

I would think it would be come extremely rare if non vaxng moms would stop seeking it out.

We did not seek it....well, actually we did, three times but it did not want to work for us - No chicken pox.

Now suddenly our 3 yo grandson came down with cp and we know not one single other kids who has it. Go figure!

He only had about 30 pox and no fever at all. He slept one afternoon and scratched one pox. That was it.

His brother still shows no sings of it.

Why would we even want him to have chicken pox?
Because we believe there are 7 childhood diseases (infections) that every child should have in order to build an immune system strong enough to ward off all other much more serious diseases, such as asthma and allergies, MS, juv. diabetes, cancer and more.

http://thorax.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/55/5/383

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0111073504.htm

http://www.*********/w/donegan.html

In 1994 Dr Michel Odent published a retrospective study in which he compared the incidence of asthma in 243 children who had been vaccinated against pertussis with 203 who had not.

Vaccinated children were over five times more likely to suffer from asthma and twice as likely to have had ear infection than unvaccinated ones.

In 1997 another retrospective study of 1934 patients born between 1975 and 1984 from one general practice in Oxfordshire showed that children vaccinated against pertussis were 75% more likely to develop asthma, hay fever and eczema later in life.

[PlayaMama]

Originally Posted by Ritske

I believe Marnica meant it would be as rare as the plague is now. No one really talks about the plague because it's not widespead, but it is still out there. I'm pretty sure she wasn't comparing them, just saying the chances of coming down with them would probably be the same if the vaccine never existed.

but i think the point is that chicken pox reappears in a population as shingles. as far as i know people don't experience relapses of the plague that cause new people to develop the disease.

i'm just saying it's not a very accurate nor valid comparison. pick a different disease with a similar pathology and i may find the argument more inspiring.