Unorthodox Consequence, Can't Stop Thinking About It

[zh97]

I was driving with my 10 year old daughter on a main road in our city. We pulled up to an intersection and saw a mother kind of "scuffling" with her daughter (around the same age as my DD) trying to get her to hold a sign. The girl looked nervous and held the sign- bristol board size, while the mom sat back in the shade in her lawn chair. The sign read- very clearly- I was caught stealing, I'm a thief.

I put myself in that girl's shoes and was so embarrassed for her. I can't imagine experiencing that myself! But, then it created interesting conversation for my daughter who, being ten, has her own unsavory moments. We talked about choices and when considering our options, how to choose the best one. Maybe we could think about whether or not we would be okay with that action to be written on a bristol board for anyone to see. If not, than maybe it is not the best option.

I'm still so sad for that girl. I get being creative, but this just seemed abusive. I considered talking to the mom but was at a loss as to what to say.

[MusicianDad]

I know from previous debates on the subject that parents who don't see anything wrong with that kind of punishment won't have their minds changed by someone point out the 101 problems with the punishment.

Personally this kind of stuff makes me ill.

[ollyoxenfree]

That is awful. I feel badly for that child.

Public shaming is such a 16th century response. It's still popular though. Isn't that why so many people tune into the news to watch "the perp walk" when a high profile criminal is arrested? It's not surprising some parents think it's a useful discipline tool.

[Satori]

I would assume it wasn't the first time she was caught stealing and the mother was at her wits end and felt maybe this may help her daughter straighten up her act.

[BedHead]

I can't imagine my kids EVER doing that, even if I'd tried to force them. When my dd got caught shoplifting a couple/three years ago, she got handcuffed and taken to a holding cell. I figured that was good enough.

[chiromamma]

Originally Posted by Satori

I would assume it wasn't the first time she was caught stealing and the mother was at her wits end and felt maybe this may help her daughter straighten up her act.

Satori...You are being generous. I mean that sincerely.
I'm kind of old fashioned when it comes to how I'd like my kids to behave but...
I see this punishment as a form of public humiliation. Kids and adults screw up. We are all deserving of dignity as human beings. Adults are never required to suffer this type of humiliation no matter how severe the crime. This type of punishment is vindictive and wrong.

[MusicianDad]

Originally Posted by chiromamma

Satori...You are being generous. I mean that sincerely.
I'm kind of old fashioned when it comes to how I'd like my kids to behave but...
I see this punishment as a form of public humiliation. Kids and adults screw up. We are all deserving of dignity as human beings. Adults are never required to suffer this type of humiliation no matter how severe the crime. This type of punishment is vindictive and wrong.

Not only is it wrong, but it has previously been determined to be inherently ineffective since the focus is on self and not that actual wrong act.

[Satori]

Originally Posted by chiromamma

Satori...You are being generous. I mean that sincerely.
I'm kind of old fashioned when it comes to how I'd like my kids to behave but...
I see this punishment as a form of public humiliation. Kids and adults screw up. We are all deserving of dignity as human beings. Adults are never required to suffer this type of humiliation no matter how severe the crime. This type of punishment is vindictive and wrong.

Originally Posted by MusicianDad

Not only is it wrong, but it has previously been determined to be inherently ineffective since the focus is on self and not that actual wrong act.

Gotta love MDC and the assumptions people jump to. I did not say I agreed with her, I stated what I personally would think as to the reason why she did it if I were to see that happening. I did not offer a judgment on if I approved or not, simply compassion from a mother with a very difficult child herself who understands that sometimes our kids push us to the point that we do things we wouldn't normally do.

[MusicianDad]

Originally Posted by Satori

Gotta love MDC and the assumptions people jump to. I did not say I agreed with her, I stated what I personally would think as to the reason why she did it if I were to see that happening. I did not offer a judgment on if I approved or not, simply compassion from a mother with a very difficult child herself who understands that sometimes our kids push us to the point that we do things we wouldn't normally do.

No one said you agreed with her. Only that you are being very generous in your own assumptions about why the mom was doing it. And you are, really. You may not agree, but you are offering a justification of sorts. One that I personally don't agree with. I was very much a problem child for a while and neither parent felt the need to publicly humiliate me. *shrug* So I guess "pushed to the limits" doesn't really fit as a possible explination.

[Labbemama]

Welllll, my dd was caught stealing recently in the mall.
We have to go to court and she's banned from the mall for a year. (That's actually a bonus for me because I hate going to the Mall and I didn't want to take her there in the first place.)

But anyhow my point is having to call me and tell me she got caught shoplifting was bad enough. She'll go to court and get a sentence and I'm not trying to advertise my dd was caught stealing!!! Not to mention we all make mistakes. My daughter learned her lesson by the time I got the 5 minutes to the mall. I beat the police there! (Which worries me about their response time) But anyhow she calls and says "mom I did something stupid" and I'm like freaking out and go "How stupid?" and she just says "Come to the mall."

So we're on our way home and "Been caught stealing" by Jane's Addiction is on the radio. And thru my tears I sang along. She was waiting for me to lecture her. Honestly I couldn't stop CRYING. The look on her face was enough. She knew how mortified I was and how wrong she was to do what she did. And that to me is the point of a consequence that is reinforced just enough that the person learns the intended lesson.

She was grounded for the weekend and I said how can I trust you to go on a trip out of state when I can't trust you to go to the mall? but other than that, we'll see what consequences she gets (and that really means me ) because there will likely be a fine and probably some community service which would be good for her.

They didn't book her that day, the police were to busy so they released her to me. I have to take her back like a month later juvenile detention to be booked!!! Now that will be humiliating.

But no need for a sign. My daughter would probably like to paint the sign though and it would likely say don't steal from Spencer gifts. I doubt she will steal again and ppl will have to wonder why she is picking trash on the side of the road I guess.

She assumed I wasn't going to let her go to homecoming because what she stole was accessories for her outfit. But given what we are going thru I don't think she would have stolen had she had allowance money. We have some child support issues. So she steals two things valued at $13.98 and she gets prosecuted and my ex owes $1300 and does all the stuff he does and gets away with it.

I probably should have taken away the dance.

[harrietsmama]

I wouldn't take away the dance, I like the way my grandparents handled stuff with me, behavior chain it and look to see what solutions you can find to prevent it. I think more than ever teens need help learning how to plan ahead or problem solve and I think in many families it gets brushed aside or over looked - not saying yours, just in general.

[MaterPrimaePuellae]

Are you certain it was her mom? Because I have heard of certain judges imposing exactly this sort of sentence on teenage offenders, and there was a social worker who was there to enforce that they were holding up the sign.

[littleteapot]

Don't know... I'm with Satori. Sounds over the top but you never know 'til you're there.

[ArielMomma]

Originally Posted by chiromamma

Adults are never required to suffer this type of humiliation no matter how severe the crime. This type of punishment is vindictive and wrong.

That is not exactly true. Some cities are starting to post the pictures and names of, "Johns" on billboards and websites as an in-your-face shaming campaign against prostitution. Other cities have started making, "Johns" go to a school designed to shame-them-straight.

[Labbemama]

This should probably be another thread but I know someone who teaches "John" school and there is a lot more to it than shaming them for instance education on STDs and talk about addictions.

I did let her go to the dance. I think they should make her dad stand beside her with a sign that says, I neglected my responsibility to my children for 3 months. It burns me up that he's essentially stealing the food from our kids mouths purchasing toys for himself and my kids steals less than $20 worth of junk and she gets arrested, meanwhile he's playing his new xbox 360 like a teenage boy.

It's funny because she was reading the Scarlet Letter and talked about how they used to punish people by making them stand on the town platform with a sign.

[AbbieB]

Not that his is right, or would even help, but as I read the OP all I could think was how I would love to walk by this situation and start pointing fingers at the mom and shout something like, "My daughter made a mistake and know I'm making it worse."

[SAHDS]

Originally Posted by MusicianDad

Not only is it wrong, but it has previously been determined to be inherently ineffective since the focus is on self and not that actual wrong act.

I couldn't agree more. I am always sad when I see children labeled. When my child does something wrong, I try to address the issue, not shame them or tell them they are 'bad'. If a child lies, they should be taught that lying is wrong and why, not that they are bad because they are a liar. If they steal, they should be taught that stealing is wrong (although, yes, most know this) and why, not that they are bad because they are a thief.

Originally Posted by Labbemama

I beat the police there! (Which worries me about their response time)

Really? I'm guessing a child shoplifting at the mall isn't a high-priority call.

[kimellett]

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[kimellett]

Originally Posted by MaterPrimaePuellae

Are you certain it was her mom? Because I have heard of certain judges imposing exactly this sort of sentence on teenage offenders, and there was a social worker who was there to enforce that they were holding up the sign.

That's my guess, too. Maybe it was her mom, and the judge said the mom had to be there to supervise her. I've seen this punishment for adults, but I don't think it's appropriate for a kid...especially in this case. ???

[darcytrue]

Originally Posted by ollyoxenfree

That is awful. I feel badly for that child.

me too. I probably would have voiced my opinion to the mom from my car.