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do some kids just need to cry (OR) let's talk naps - Page 2

post #21 of 119
Thread Starter 
I really want to get across the idea that I am not holding down to a bed or anything crazy like that, I am just holding her in my arms when she is VISIBLY tired and when she tries to get down I just don't let her and she does get mad but very quickly falls asleep after that drinking her baba while I am holding her in my lap the whole time, soothing her and kissing her and rocking her.

I feel very torn about the crying, like I said, it goes against everything I have been doing her WHOLE life, but I can't argue with the results either.
I mean today, for example, she was visibly tired, being irrational about her lunch, wanting it one plate then another and pitching a fit when I finally just put the leftovers in the fridge.
I got her baba ready and her blankie and put her in my lap and she started to drink her milk and then wanted to get up again but I didn't let her, she cried for about 60 seconds and then settled back in and fell asleep within 5mins.....

Yes there is the possibilty that she doesn't need a nap everyday and if it seemed like it wasn't going to happen I would def. let her down and figure out what to do from there, but I can't imagine many days where it would be a good idea to let her stumble around exhausted until 7-8pm......


I really want to do the right thing here!
post #22 of 119
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavenly View Post
Sorry, I will be the dissenting vote. I do not believe in physical restraining a child unless there is a really good reason to do. I know myself I completely panic if someone tries to physically restrain me. It is a completely horrible feeling! If I am picturing this right you are holding her completely still while she screams and freaks out? What website am I on again?
It would be more helpful if you gave me any ideas about what to do instead? If you have better ideas I will try them!
post #23 of 119
Have you tried doing quiet time instead?

We've done it in a few different ways. We've done stories on the couch where I read books and we just cuddle for ~30 minutes. We've also done it where we lay down in my bed with the lights out/low and read some books and then "rest". We've also, on days where she needs to rest but just can't, put on a movie and she sits with a blanket on the couch and vegges.

Being quiet and still for 20 to 45 minutes was enough to get us through the afternoon. At first it meant she went to bed earlier, but as she adjusted to not napping and got used to it and went back to her normal bedtime.
post #24 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisteeesmama View Post
I really want to get across the idea that I am not holding down to a bed or anything crazy like that, I am just holding her in my arms when she is VISIBLY tired and when she tries to get down I just don't let her and she does get mad but very quickly falls asleep after that drinking her baba while I am holding her in my lap the whole time, soothing her and kissing her and rocking her.
This is what we do at night sometimes. If DD is really tired she gets wired and has meltdowns every 10 minutes, but she just can't stop moving. If I hold her it makes her angry, but at the same time calms her down. She'll look at me screech and flail for a minute or two, then sigh and go back to the boob for a minute or two and then repeat. Usually after 10-15 minutes she stops crying and just boobs to sleep. I'd rather not do it, but it gets her to sleep when she can't herself there, I'm not leaving her alone and if I let her stay awake she'd be crying just as much and be tired to boot.
post #25 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisteeesmama View Post
Yes there is the possibilty that she doesn't need a nap everyday and if it seemed like it wasn't going to happen I would def. let her down and figure out what to do from there, but I can't imagine many days where it would be a good idea to let her stumble around exhausted until 7-8pm......


I really want to do the right thing here!

She will adjust. Everyone I know went through 1 to 2 weeks of a tired cranky kid as their kid dropped their nap. It doesn't seem to matter if that happens at 2 or 5. Their bodies need to adjust. I've met more than 1 kindergarten kid who was dropping their nap and was a mess for a week or two.

I would say that you might do more harm than good in making sleep something you fight about with her. I know that we fought with DD for longer than we should have because everyone told us that she was "too young" to drop her nap. And it seriously affected how easily she went to sleep at night. Once we stopped fighting it took awhile for things to return to normal. But they did. Somedays she'd fall asleep on the couch and I'd mover her to her bed. Other days she'd just rest and would be fine. And there were days where she was miserable.
post #26 of 119
I think you are doing fine, mama. My DS is just a couple of months younger than your DD and he DEFINITELY still needs his naps. I know all children are different, but if she's having meltdowns and is exhausted until her normal bedtime then she's clearly not ready to drop her afternoon nap.

You aren't leaving her to cry, you aren't holding her down on her bed, you are cuddling her and loving her and encouraging her to fall asleep. I don't know what else you could do?
post #27 of 119
Well I just wanted to say that some kids who get on sensory overload need some decompression. Sometimes being held, while the kid might emotionally get irritated and want to be let go, their bodies might need some help in that department. That pressure to decompress and calm down enough to let their body stop long enough to sleep. What about trying to snuggle with her under a heavy blanket reading some books if you have a hard time with the crying, otherwise, if the naps are continuing and the time it is taking her to fall asleep is decreasing, sounds like you are on the right track. We hold infants tightly and rock and bounce them, even if they are screaming and crying, why not older babies. 22 months is still a baby in many ways.
post #28 of 119
gees, a minute or two of protest is hardly crying it out and five minutes of holding them is hardly tieing them down. clearly she needs the sleep (or she would not be sleeping)...not every child knows how to wind down on their own.
post #29 of 119
Another thought I had...hyave you considered moving her nap time up some? it sounds like she is getting over tired.
post #30 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyka View Post
gees, a minute or two of protest is hardly crying it out and five minutes of holding them is hardly tieing them down. clearly she needs the sleep (or she would not be sleeping)...not every child knows how to wind down on their own.

That's the exact same argument I've heard from every person I know who does CIO.

Why don't we give kids a bit more credit and figure out that in general they will sleep when tired without being forced to.

Many people have good success with creating a quiet sleepy environment and then doing a quiet time in which their child rests or eventually falls asleep.
post #31 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisteeesmama View Post

I feel very torn about the crying, like I said, it goes against everything I have been doing her WHOLE life, but I can't argue with the results either.
I mean today, for example, she was visibly tired, being irrational about her lunch, wanting it one plate then another and pitching a fit when I finally just put the leftovers in the fridge.

I just wanted to mention that that behavior is very typical for a two-year-old, tired or not. My 2.5 yo, who can sleep 12+ hrs at night, and still acts this way at times when I am certain it's not due to lack of sleep. I don't ever have to make him go to sleep, though, he tells me when he's tired and will often just go up to bed and lay down. But again, we don't have set bedtimes or naptimes b/c it's what works for our family.

I also agree with JL83 that at some point the transition from napping to not napping is going to happen, and it likely won't be without melt-downs. Whether or not your LO really needs that daily afternoon nap is hard to say, of course, but as for it now being a struggle when she used to go down without any issues - that makes me think she at least wants to give up napping some days.
post #32 of 119
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
That's the exact same argument I've heard from every person I know who does CIO.

Why don't we give kids a bit more credit and figure out that in general they will sleep when tired without being forced to.

Many people have good success with creating a quiet sleepy environment and then doing a quiet time in which their child rests or eventually falls asleep.
I should have mentioned before that I have done a quiet time routine which just ended in her getting up, running out of the room, laughing, going downstairs etc. THis was not my first choice at all!


And to the pp who said she may actually need an earlier nap, that is a good idea and I will try that, too.
post #33 of 119
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer's Wife View Post
I just wanted to mention that that behavior is very typical for a two-year-old, tired or not. My 2.5 yo, who can sleep 12+ hrs at night, and still acts this way at times when I am certain it's not due to lack of sleep. I don't ever have to make him go to sleep, though, he tells me when he's tired and will often just go up to bed and lay down. But again, we don't have set bedtimes or naptimes b/c it's what works for our family.

I also agree with JL83 that at some point the transition from napping to not napping is going to happen, and it likely won't be without melt-downs. Whether or not your LO really needs that daily afternoon nap is hard to say, of course, but as for it now being a struggle when she used to go down without any issues - that makes me think she at least wants to give up napping some days.
I guess it's just something that I know as her mom, that it is about tiredness and not being able to think clearly, versus just wanting to play around etc.

So what would say about the fact that she has then been sleeping for about 1 1/2 hours each time I have done this? And I don't think it's because the crying exhausts her because it's so short, she cries longer than that SEVERAL times a day about other things.....
I'm not trying to be snippy at all, just trying to sort this out in my head.

Thanks for all the input so far from everyone!
post #34 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisteeesmama View Post
I guess it's just something that I know as her mom, that it is about tiredness and not being able to think clearly, versus just wanting to play around etc.

So what would say about the fact that she has then been sleeping for about 1 1/2 hours each time I have done this? And I don't think it's because the crying exhausts her because it's so short, she cries longer than that SEVERAL times a day about other things.....
I'm not trying to be snippy at all, just trying to sort this out in my head.

Thanks for all the input so far from everyone!
Maybe it means she does still need that nap? or sometimes does. It's hard to say, obviously, when it's not your kid - and even when it is!

Really, I wouldn't worry what anyone else thinks. If it's working for your family, then that's all that matters.

Maybe in a few months you will hold her and she won't fall asleep? Then you will likely follow her lead and let her stay up. I would just do whatever you feel is right - which may change often
post #35 of 119
Just wanted to chime in and say it sounds to me like you're doing the right thing for your LO. Some children go through stages where they do need more help to go to sleep, and it sounds like your DD is going through one of those stages. I'd be willing to bet that you won't even have to do this much longer as she learns to recognize being tired and becomes more willing to go to sleep on her own. I agree that moving her nap up to an earlier time might help, too - she definitely sounds like she's OVERtired by the time you put her down for her nap.

You know your daughter's needs best!
post #36 of 119
I personally do not think it's ok to restrain a child against their will for 10-20 to make them sleep. It seems very cruel. I do not see it as "helping" your child to go to sleep, so much as forcing them to. I do see this as CIO, JMO. I guess I see it as the same as forcing a child to eat, rather than trying to find respectful ways to encourage them to eat. Perhaps a new routine is in order, my dd went through a roughh napping patch at the same age, I adjusted her routine, now we brush her teeth, I read to her while rocking her and she goes to sleep while I read to her. Sometimes I have to adjust the timing or read a little longer than usual, and sometimes she goes out really fast.
post #37 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
That's the exact same argument I've heard from every person I know who does CIO.

Why don't we give kids a bit more credit and figure out that in general they will sleep when tired without being forced to.

Many people have good success with creating a quiet sleepy environment and then doing a quiet time in which their child rests or eventually falls asleep.

I had a child who really had trouble sleeping. she spent the first 18 months of her life sick and underweight and pretty much screaming her head off because I believed that kids would sleep when they were tired. Once I pushed the issue a little (and yes she cried a bit but she was going to be crying either way, I did not do CIO though) she started sleeping about 12-15 hours a day (she was 18 months and had never slept more than 6 hours in a 24 hour period) she double her weight in a few weeks, grew several inches, and became the happiest child on the planet. She also started speaking which she hadn't done since she took her first step. Not all kids can figure out how to wind down and get to sleep. really they can't. Not all of my children needed this kind of help but Lily did. and she is 9 now and I still feel terrible for how long I let her suffer for my ideals and philosophies. When all she needed was a little help.

again we are not talking about strapping a kid down and letting them scream themselves to sleep. we are talking about part of an overall routien that lasts a few minutes as we hold and love on our babies and sooth them to sleep.
post #38 of 119
Another vote for thinking that sometimes you really do HAVE to stop them from moving. My DS will reach a point of tiredness where he simply refuses to stop moving - because he knows if he stops, he WILL fall asleep. And he doesn't want to fall asleep, so he just keeps moving. DH and I can spot it too - he gets this super-tired look on his face, gets super winey and will run from you and just generally refuse to stop moving. At one point, I did generally have to hold him and rock him and listen to him cry for a few minutes just to get him calmed down enough that he could/would fall asleep. Now he will generally lay down and rest and fall asleep while we read stories. But he didn't used to, he used to need help.
post #39 of 119
Young kids need their sleep or they can't learn (just like a momma without a full nights rest at work, count her absent thank you). That poor baby needs sleep and you, as a good mama knows it. My kids fought sleep every second since they were born. BUT, if they were tired, a slow rocking and a kind song put them down.

Little babies need sleep and the funny thing about these ornary creatures is that they will say they don't! Well, as a smart woman with wisdom you know they need it. So hold them and sing and watth those eyes sling closed.

What I know? You are a good mama that knows their baby needs sleep. Keep on!

BABIES NEED A NAP! And I thank you to the mama's that work that extra shift workig towards it. You rock!!!!
post #40 of 119
You've already been given tons of really sound advice, from both sides.

My ds2 is going to be 2 on November 1st. (noooo! Not yet! It's too soon! ) In my experience, age 2-2.5 is around the age when all of mine dropped their naps. Most days I can get ds2 to nap if we're in the car or I pop him in the Ergo while I do dishes or something.

I can also get him to sleep if the big kids are otherwise occupied (I homeschool), but it's a little later in the day than I like for him. If he naps at 12 or 1, then he's up by 3 and will go to bed around 10. Otherwise, he's up till 11:30 or 12! Ack!

Anyway, follow her lead, pop her on your back and do some dishes, whatever it takes. You're not leaving her to scream her brains out by herself in the crib. She's ok.
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