Last night my husband said he wanted a divorce BUT says he still loves me but I have "hurt him to many times and he does NOT want to try any more". Ah this situation is such a big mess!!! No matter how many times I have asked him to "give me another chance" and offered to do Marriage counseling he just says he KNOWS that no matter when or how far in the future I WILL hurt him again and he is NOT willing for that to happen.
BUT basically he has agreed to live in the house for awhile and be "open" to any sort of loving feelings he may again have toward me BUT this is NOT giving me a second chance he knows it will not work. I am going to go to counseling to deal with my crazy past history that is weighing heavily on our marriage and my ability to be emotional which is his major problem with me. (and me going to counseling is something that needs to be done anyway) But I can't help but hope that I will again be able to look upon life in a positive way and be the sort of person I once was AND with that he will see that am working toward a better me which means a better US.
I am just wondering what you all think of this arrangement and how I should proceed. He won't kiss me but he will hug sort of more just out of obligation toward the mother of his children. I just can't stop crying and I know I need to use this time as an opportunity to possibly bring us back together and fill his needs once again. I just don't want to Screw this last slim chance up (even though he says it is not a chance I can see it in his eyes that their is a tiny window of opportunity still there since he says he still Loves me.)
HELP!
Andrea
Your stbx (soon to be ex) has made it clear that he does not want to try. That he is not willing to work on the marriage and that he wants a divorce. And that he won't give you another chance (as if he has no fault at all. And just in case you didn't get the sarcasm, he is as much to blame for the demise of the marriage as you are don't let him lay all of the blame on you). He has made it clear that it's over.
Are you going to listen and start dealing with reality?
Here's my advice. You can take it or leave it. I am a woman with a past, too. I was horribly abused, etc., etc. (not to make light of it but this is about you, not my details
)
YOU have to get help for you. The best thing you can do is to tell him you love him but you realize you need help whether or not he divorces you. And YOU have to believe that. This is about you living life to the fullest and being able to raise your children without passing junk onto them.
Yes, get into counseling. Read, read, read books on the help you need. And then.... herd cats!!!!!! Yes, you heard me right! When does a cat want you the most? When you are calling "here, kitty, kitty, kitty?" Uh-uh! If you are the only one in the whole room who hates cats, that cat will seek you out and rub up against you!
Leave your dh alone. Respect him, talk to him kindly, love yourself and your children but don't force him to be affectionate with you at all. It's not fair and you will push him even further away.
But another thing... if he's not willing to agree that your problems are his problems, too and won't go to counseling with you to support you, you might as well ask him to leave. I don't care what you are dealing with. The day he married you, your problems became his problems and vice versa.
Originally Posted by AbigailGrace
Here's my advice. You can take it or leave it. I am a woman with a past, too. I was horribly abused, etc., etc. (not to make light of it but this is about you, not my details
)
YOU have to get help for you. The best thing you can do is to tell him you love him but you realize you need help whether or not he divorces you. And YOU have to believe that. This is about you living life to the fullest and being able to raise your children without passing junk onto them.
Yes, get into counseling. Read, read, read books on the help you need. And then.... herd cats!!!!!! Yes, you heard me right! When does a cat want you the most? When you are calling "here, kitty, kitty, kitty?" Uh-uh! If you are the only one in the whole room who hates cats, that cat will seek you out and rub up against you!
Leave your dh alone. Respect him, talk to him kindly, love yourself and your children but don't force him to be affectionate with you at all. It's not fair and you will push him even further away.
But another thing... if he's not willing to agree that your problems are his problems, too and won't go to counseling with you to support you, you might as well ask him to leave. I don't care what you are dealing with. The day he married you, your problems became his problems and vice versa.
And pray...
*hang in there mama*
THANKS! This is great advice! Last night we read a book out loud together in bed sort of lying next to each other. Then I said I love you and kissed him on the cheek good night to go to my room with my 14mth old. He grabbed my hand and said he cared about me and then I kissed him again on the cheek and told him he did not need to say anything "just be here" and then said good night. It still felt cold but I can't help but hope. I am calling counselors today.
my ex did something similar. One day he left and said he wanted a divorce. I was 8 weeks pg at the time and he finally agreed that he would stay in the house but that he was no longer mentally married to me... I thought ok thats a start and we can work on making it work. He only stayed for about 5 days... and those few days were rough. he would not speak to me. he would not touch me. Even when I cooked dinner through the insane morning sickness his favorite meal he refused to eat it. He ended up leaving for good.
Originally Posted by BakerALM
THANKS! This is great advice! Last night we read a book out loud together in bed sort of lying next to each other. Then I said I love you and kissed him on the cheek good night to go to my room with my 14mth old. He grabbed my hand and said he cared about me and then I kissed him again on the cheek and told him he did not need to say anything "just be here" and then said good night. It still felt cold but I can't help but hope. I am calling counselors today.
So good to hear! It sounds like he really isn't convinced he wants to leave you. Good luck and keep us posted!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by organicpapayamama
my ex did something similar. One day he left and said he wanted a divorce. I was 8 weeks pg at the time and he finally agreed that he would stay in the house but that he was no longer mentally married to me... I thought ok thats a start and we can work on making it work. He only stayed for about 5 days... and those few days were rough. he would not speak to me. he would not touch me. Even when I cooked dinner through the insane morning sickness his favorite meal he refused to eat it. He ended up leaving for good.
So sorry to hear this. It's hard because there's never any way to figure out what's really going on in someone's head. Do they really mean divorce or are they just threatening to get your attention? I have been divorced and whether it's something you want or something they want, it's never easy.
and take care of yourself. do what YOU need to do.
dont expect anything out of him. the little scene you described was sweet. perfect.
dont get needy and demanding.
might not make a difference but if you do separate, it will be much more cordial.
it is a v. v. confusing time for parents. to me it shows his confusion. two little kids. responsibility. probably freaking him out.
dont get upset by the things he does.
the main thing is taking care of yourself. there is something about independent women men find fascinating.
and while taking care of yourself you might find you really help yourself and that no matter what happens in future, you and your kids will be ok. you will lose the fear of the future.
Thanks Girls! I cried almost constantly today, in my kids music class, in the car everywhere! Ah I feel so lost...
Also I talked with his brother for about an hour today. He is VERY close to his brother and he is hopeful we can work things out. He thinks we both need personal help before we can really work on us. He thinks that for my husband to be saying that it is ALL my fault is just unrealistic and really self centered. Since he knows what our life has been like (at least from looking in from the outside) he can see that their are SOOO many outside factors that have reaked havoc on our lives which he said would cause anyone to basically have emotional breakdowns. I am hopeful that when my husband talks to his brother he may see a different prospective and be a bit just a bit more open to finding different ways to work on healing verses throwing it all away and starting "fresh". I can only hope!
If you reversed the post- I would be your dh and you would be my dh.
When you are hurt, there has to come a point where enough is enough and you do whatever you need to to protect yourself. Giving someone another chance, when you feel vulnerable and have gone into preservation mode, is nearly impossible.
And allowing someone to hurt you, especially someone you love, starts to feel rather icky after a long time and you can't do it because all you see behind and ahead of you is the hurt and the broken promises.
This is just a perspective- I have no idea what has happened in your life, but the above is how I felt when dh and I went through hell back in the spring. BTW- we managed to make it through but it took a lot of trust on my part to even consider going ahead. We used marriagebuilders to help us and I admit, it really was beneficial.
Originally Posted by Aeress
If you reversed the post- I would be your dh and you would be my dh.
When you are hurt, there has to come a point where enough is enough and you do whatever you need to to protect yourself. Giving someone another chance, when you feel vulnerable and have gone into preservation mode, is nearly impossible.
And allowing someone to hurt you, especially someone you love, starts to feel rather icky after a long time and you can't do it because all you see behind and ahead of you is the hurt and the broken promises.
I do think this is how he feels, loss of trust in me to have the ability to meet his emotional needs the way he needs them met. I understand but am having trouble (with all the BOMBS that life has dropped on us) doing what he needs me to do the way he needs it done. I keep trying and failing and then it looks to him like I never tried and he gets frustrated and hurt. Also I have a lot of "issues" to work though and I know the feelings I have inside myself are hindering my ability to be the emotional partner that he needs to feel loved and whole. I hope its not to late.
OP--do you think you are being hard on yourself? It sounds like you are blaming everything on you. Let me tell you, I don't buy it. I did the exact same thing when my h originally told me he was leaving. After working on it for a couple of years, I came to realize that, in fact, it was not all my fault--not even close.
I had a past. I had issues. I worked on mine (still am). Our communication got better. He didn't change in some core ways. We are not together anymore. I now see how miserable I was. And we were just not that good together (although, at the time I thought we were).
Be gentle with yourself, get the help you need for you. If your h wants to stick around and grow with you, great, but "heal thyself" and just see what happens.
Big hugs!! THis part sucks so much. Very painful, but you will get through this!
Originally Posted by Aeress
We used marriagebuilders to help us and I admit, it really was beneficial.
OMG I should have read this YEARS ago I feel like a TOTALLY awful person never mind terrible wife. I hope he will be open to trying again the points that they make on the website are so true and it really shows me what a terrible job I am doing in this marriage!!
Originally Posted by Isamama
OP--do you think you are being hard on yourself? It sounds like you are blaming everything on you. Let me tell you, I don't buy it. I did the exact same thing when my h originally told me he was leaving. After working on it for a couple of years, I came to realize that, in fact, it was not all my fault--not even close.
When it comes to my lack of emotional support and caring toward him his points are valid. BUT what he wants to ignore is the reasons behind my emotional distance and lack of caring toward him. I(we) have had a MOUNTAIN of crap dumped on us basically every 6mths since we were married and I have not dealt with each of those instances before the next one came along. This just made me more and more distant and a emotionally unresponsive. But with my husband being the most sensitive person I know it has really taken a toll on him internally. I was not their for him since truly I have not even been their for myself, just barely getting by day to day by bottling up all my feelings (good and bad) just to be able to get through. He knows this but just says he just cant believe I will ever be able to "change" and again be able to show my emotions and care for him the way he needs caring for.
See if DH will do marriage builders- if not, do it for you.
It is a two way street, we both had a whole lot of stuff to work through. We opened a huge can of worms, from past childhood stuff to old relationships, to our current situation. It was eye opening and we tackled it one at a time. We are still working on stuff, but now, I can let dh know what I need, why and he understands what I mean, which is huge.
Originally Posted by Aeress
See if DH will do marriage builders- if not, do it for you.
It is a two way street, we both had a whole lot of stuff to work through. We opened a huge can of worms, from past childhood stuff to old relationships, to our current situation. It was eye opening and we tackled it one at a time. We are still working on stuff, but now, I can let dh know what I need, why and he understands what I mean, which is huge.
*hugs* thinking of you!
It is ALWAYS a two-way street! You really do need to go easy on yourself and realize he has a part in this as well. Men usually want to blame their counterpart because there not getting s-- enough. Of course, that's their intimacy. But women's intimacy starts 24 hours before the s--! So if your dh isn't giving you what you need, you have nothing to give back. It can be a vicious cycle that goes round and round. It doesn't help when you throw pregnancies, babies and nursing in the mix. (don't get me wrong, kids are great! But they change the mama's focus and it can be harder for the mama to focus any attention on her dh)
The bottom line, imho, is still that you both need to get help. You may have past issues but neither of you have the tools you need for a healthy marriage. Hang in there girl and just keep learning about how to be a better person for yourself.
Originally Posted by Aeress
See if DH will do marriage builders- if not, do it for you.
It is a two way street, we both had a whole lot of stuff to work through. We opened a huge can of worms, from past childhood stuff to old relationships, to our current situation. It was eye opening and we tackled it one at a time. We are still working on stuff, but now, I can let dh know what I need, why and he understands what I mean, which is huge.
*hugs* thinking of you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbigailGrace
The bottom line, imho, is still that you both need to get help. You may have past issues but neither of you have the tools you need for a healthy marriage. Hang in there girl and just keep learning about how to be a better person for yourself.
Thanks ladies! AH yesterday was a HUGE day. Good and bad!
I had my first session with a personal therapist. My DD2 came with me and my older daughter stayed with my mom. We talked for about 1.5hrs and I barely scratched the surface but strangely I felt AWESOME and AWFUL after I left. I felt empowered to change me and get help with my "issues" that have been plaguing me since I can remember but also felt the lowest of lows realizing that I may finally start to feel "good" about being me and still end up with a broken family.
I know I can't think about that and still get healthy but it is so hard. I miss my husband even though he is still in the house.
Actually yesterday I made the mistake of suggesting that he go and see someone independently of me and I pushed the issue a bit since I KNOW he has lots he needs to work though but this just made him MAD and then he started to say he should just not even come home at all!! So I shut up. I really need to just keep my mouth shut with him and do what I can do on my own to become a better person for me and hopefully he will be here long enough to see that we could be good for each other.
I love to be involved in theater and now I feel like I have brought the play home with me. I have to put on my best acting face and pretend to be "happy" so that we can still have some chance of working this out. I know being "happy" together will have to rub off on him. We ran around the field today with our older daughter and played tag, and laughed and made jokes like we never do. We had a "good" day. but I know by the way he is looking at me that NOTHING has changed.
He is off with his brother right now telling him what is going on. I have actually talked with his brother for about 3hrs since this all happened and he has not said more than 2 words to anyone. His brother wants us to work on it so I hope that another voice saying "please try" could help. I hope when he returns nothing is WORSE.
Oh, honey. I understand your impulse to appear happy and strong so as not to annoy your dh so that he doesn't leave you. What I hope you come to realize--therapy should help with this--is that you CAN'T, SHOULDN'T and DON'T DESERVE TO HAVE TO bottle in your feelings just to make him happy.
As PPs have pointed out, the problems in your marriage belong to BOTH of you. You are going through a hard time now and he needs to be sensitive to the effect of it on you, too, not just threaten to leave you every time you react in some way that he doesn't like.
I think you will come to realize this. You must first be true to yourself and everything else will be alright.
Originally Posted by La Sombra
Oh, honey. I understand your impulse to appear happy and strong so as not to annoy your dh so that he doesn't leave you. What I hope you come to realize--therapy should help with this--is that you CAN'T, SHOULDN'T and DON'T DESERVE TO HAVE TO bottle in your feelings just to make him happy.
As PPs have pointed out, the problems in your marriage belong to BOTH of you. You are going through a hard time now and he needs to be sensitive to the effect of it on you, too, not just threaten to leave you every time you react in some way that he doesn't like.
I think you will come to realize this. You must first be true to yourself and everything else will be alright.
THANKS!
That is sadly what happened this evening I had a complete mental breakdown with him and the kids around. I cried, made snark remarks, neglected the kids a bit, rushed everyone through dinner/bath and then bawled on the bed with my kids playing with daddy on the floor for about 30mins. I was overall a real "female dog" to him and not nice at all to either of the kids. It was my worst moment yet. I just could not take it anymore.
Ah I hate my life right now! Not to mention what I can see my life is going to look like in the future.
Can you believe we are in the middle of a 20 thousand dollar lead paint removal process in our house right now not to mention we only bought this place less than 2yrs ago. Not even sure if we tried to sell right now if we would even be able to pay off our morgage!!!!!!!!!
1. I was in a dating situation previous to my marriage where I had to pretend to be happy, because showing my real feelings would scare someone off. It lasted a while, I had some fun, but eventually I got tired of having to pretend that his actions did not hurt me, and I got tired of not being loved for me, and of the pressure to be happy if he was a jerk....and I ended it. It took a while though.
2. It is very very very normal for conflicting, mixed feelings to come up in/after therapy. I think going is a great way to love yourself and yes you DO deserve to love yourself and be your own best friend. You can even discuss the mixed feelings next time you go.
3. Be patient with yourself.
"Be patient toward all that is unresolved in your heart. Try to love the questions themselves. Do not now seek the answers which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them now. And the point is to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps, you will then gradually without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer." -- Rainer Maria Rilke
We had a good conversation last night for about 1.5hrs. I just did my best to listen and not tell him to "please come back" in some sort of needy crazy way. Every time he said "its over" I would just say I totally understand. He must have said it like 10 times and I would just say the same thing, "I get it". But strangely I could see DEEP down in side that he hates that it is over. He is really confused himself and would love to make it work but is just DONE with being hurt, he is in preservation mode. I told him that I get that it is OVER and I am not trying to get him back to "this marriage" BUT to be honest in the future (like a year or so from now) I hope that I will have worked toward a happier me which is really the problem between us. I am NOT happy with myself which makes me emotionally unavailable toward him, which causes him to feel lost, lonely and hurt. We have been (for our entire marriage) trying to fix the symptoms (him feeling lost lonely and hurt) not the problem (the way I feel inside causing me to hurt him) so I hope that once I work toward a happier, more positive me WE could again date and see where we will go. He did not want to say he was open to this but at the same time I could see he liked the idea of being with me as a loving person SINCE we have everything else going REALLY well in our relationship. All the other ducks are in a row but this just happens to be his #1 duck so it is causing the most pain. I just need this hope to keep me going right now though my self discovery and healing.
He said he is committed to living here and supporting me financially and as a friend though this process BUT I just need to lay off the getting back together talk. I told him I could do that. (I really need to keep my promise with this one.!!!)
We went pumpkin picking today as a family and had a good time. (well the big pink elephant followed us around everywhere but we both did our best to ignore it and just focus on the moment.) It was ok, sort of. I can deal since I am getting something in return, time for myself to pull my insides together. But still really SAD
He said he is committed to living here and supporting me financially and as a friend though this process BUT I just need to lay off the getting back together talk. I told him I could do that. (I really need to keep my promise with this one.!!!)
We went pumpkin picking today as a family and had a good time. (well the big pink elephant followed us around everywhere but we both did our best to ignore it and just focus on the moment.) It was ok, sort of. I can deal since I am getting something in return, time for myself to pull my insides together. But still really SAD
Oh girl, my heart goes out to you. I don't know if I could live in limbo like that. But as much as I love dh, I know I'd probably try. I wish I had some words of wisdom for you...
It really sounds like he trying to let you down easy. I'm so sorry
Don't fall for the game that there is a slim chance. He is toying with you. Personally I would withdraw from him emotionally and start piecing together a life without him. This isn't healthy the sort of game he is playing. Can he go elsewhere? He is being extremely selfish btw. He isn't "helping" you through this at ALL but making it harder!
You mention you withdraw which CAUSES him to feel certain ways. Well, has he tried to help you in whatever way (e.g., to do more around the house, plan a romantic night out, take the kids somewhere so you can decompress) or suggest y'all get help together to help (re)build your relationship wiht a strong foundation?
Maybe I missed something, but it just seems like you are taking all the blame and giving him too much control not looking at how he has contributed to the problems...
Maybe I missed something, but it just seems like you are taking all the blame and giving him too much control not looking at how he has contributed to the problems...
He is really a good guy but I have to say we have tried the same thing over and over again to "fix" the problem that is what I can fault both of us with. He says he "tried" for years to fix the problem which is true in his mind but what I always remind him of right now is that we have always tried the same things alone at home without any outside help (no counselors, no books, etc) WE just talk about it, and talk about it and talk about it. Then I try to fix it and surprise surprise we get some change for awhile and then wam bam right back to the same old thing. He is just sick of trying! I get it but what I am trying to remind him of is that we only tried the SAME thing for years and low and behold we got the same result, NO change! Not to mention life has droped crap on us honestly EVERY 6mths, huge mounds of it (for just a taste take a look at my signature) and that does nothing to help you deal with the current state of life it just makes things worse and drag on longer.
So what is so frustrating right now is that I am trying something different totally different by seeking outside help and he is DONE with trying. Honestly I am totally pissed off about it.
BUt what am I really goign to do. the best I can hope for is that I start to feel great about myself and he can't help but see that and then he initates some sort of rebuilding for our relationship. But I know I may be fooling myself BUT I can't help it.
Originally Posted by BakerALM
So what is so frustrating right now is that I am trying something different totally different by seeking outside help and he is DONE with trying. Honestly I am totally pissed off about it.
BUt what am I really goign to do. the best I can hope for is that I start to feel great about myself and he can't help but see that and then he initates some sort of rebuilding for our relationship. But I know I may be fooling myself BUT I can't help it.
mama i was in your shoes. ex said he would try but did not. he refused absolutely refused outside help. so i did my bit of trying. two years of it. it was really painful. however i will say i am glad i did. because when i wanted out i was absolutely sure i wanted out. my ex is a good man, and i cannot help but love the good side of him, even though i never get to see it no more. but man am i done with him as a lover or partner. i still do feel connected with him (in my own deep spiritual way) but i NEVER want to get back together with him ever. i love my life how it is now. i really do. its hard. but its a good hard. there is a kind of integrity in it. i really am having way too much fun. and the funniest part. which i never EVER thougth i would feel?!!! is how fun it is to be alone. how much i am really enjoying my company and doing the things i want to do. there is such a freedom to it. and i will never give that up. another man can come and join me. but if there is never going to be another man, i am still ok. i am living. really finally living and no one is ever going to take that away from me ever again.
Originally Posted by meemee
i love my life how it is now. i really do. its hard. but its a good hard. there is a kind of integrity in it. i really am having way too much fun. and the funniest part. which i never EVER thougth i would feel?!!! is how fun it is to be alone. how much i am really enjoying my company and doing the things i want to do. there is such a freedom to it. and i will never give that up. another man can come and join me. but if there is never going to be another man, i am still ok. i am living. really finally living and no one is ever going to take that away from me ever again.
this quote. Especially about integrity.
To the OP...
Please remember that it takes two to make a marriage work, it takes one to make it fail.
Right now, you're doing everything in your power to heal yourself. This will either help you be a better marriage partner to your dh or it will help you be a healthier single mama. Which outcome is unfortunately up to your dh. But either way, you will be healthier and even happier. And your children will be happier because of your health.
You are exactly right that your dh needs to be working on himself too.
As I've been following this thread, I can't help but think about my situation. But I was the one who filed. My situation is different in that I was dealing with definite abuse from my stbx toward me. But even with that, I told stbx that I would GLADLY stop the divorce in an instant if I felt that he was putting in an effort to change himself. Meanwhile I was going to counseling both with a DV counselor and a "regular" counselor because I knew that I needed to be as healthy (mentally as well as physically) as possible no matter what the future held.
I want to scream at your dh that he needs to be doing this too!!!!
Unfortunately, my stbx declared that this was a "two way street" except that his definition of that meant that he demanded and I followed through. I started typing an example and then deleted it because it frankly doesn't matter. Suffice to say that I filed because the current situation wasn't safe for me or my children. Instead of working to make the marriage safe, he decided that because I filed, I was obviously creating the problems in our marriage and so I needed to change and satisfy his demands. And I needed to hit a moving target because he couldn't keep his story straight from day to day or even sometimes within the same conversation. Seriously.
You are doing the opposite. Your dh has made it clear to you that there are problems and you are taking responsibility for your part and doing everything in your power to become healthier so that you can meet this issue head on and work through it with your dh. For that, I am so incredibly proud of you and hope that your dh begins to both see your efforts and also work to become healthier himself.
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