Anyone not able to get health insurance? - Page 3

[Poddi]

It's depressing to read a thread like this. My parents live in US and I know my mother is mostly working for insurance. They don't really need her salary and she hates her boss, but the insurance plan is wonderful. She said she'd cling onto it as long as possible as almost nobody else will cover my dad's huge number of pre-existing conditions. (*The med he took last year cost $4000 a month.)

I'd say try to save some money for health care in a separate account for the next few years, and hope nobody need it. But if you can, get disability insurance and life insurance for yourself. It's important and shouldn't cost too much for your age.

[BetsyS]

Originally Posted by Kaleanani

Surely not everyone's plans include working for a corporation nor do all the self-employed out there able to afford the high rate plans themselves. I'm trying to find out what they do, to see how I can help ourselves.

I do think that this is most peoples' two options. My stepdad is self employed (my mom doesn't work). Their insurance is over $1000/month, for the 2 of them. Healthy people, no maternity coverage (don't need it). Very limited well care.

The health care/insurance in this country stinks right now.

[Noelle C.]

Originally Posted by goldingoddess

this is exactly why we need healthcare reform that includes a public option.

This times infinity!!

We're being priced out of health coverage. With a pay cut my fiance had to take, when our baby is born, the increase in premiums will give us the following choices:

Pay for insurance for all of us, but have no money for food.

Insure only our baby, sock away the rest, and eat.

We seriously, literally, truly can not afford an increase in premiums if we want to eat every day. It's horrific that those least likely to be able to afford coverage are those who work and pay taxes so others can have coverage. Health care shouldn't only be for the poorest and the wealthiest and the lucky.

[Noelle C.]

Originally Posted by Kaleanani

...But for reasons I mentioned above, I have no plans to get a job for insurance purposes. I am working on getting insurance OUTSIDE of having an employer.

Surely not everyone's plans include working for a corporation nor do all the self-employed out there able to afford the high rate plans themselves. I'm trying to find out what they do, to see how I can help ourselves.

...The thing is, I just have no plans on working for a company for the sole sake of health insurance, at least not right now. Period.

You need to understand that these are really the health insurance options most people have. You either get it through an employer (and plenty of people work solely for the health coverage), or privately. I don't know if you're looking for a government program that will give it to you for free, but if you are able-bodied and your reason for not working is your husband can't/won't take care of his own kids, you're not likely to find a program that will take pity on you and let you have free health care. It doesn't require leaving the home for him to watch the kids.

Since you are able-bodied, regardless of your reason for not wanting work right now, your choices will ultimately boil down to getting a job for the insurance, paying for it privately, or going without it relying on free clinics in your area. It doesn't matter if the free clinic in your area isn't up to your standards. It's free. Take it, get a job, or buy private. The options suck, but it's life. It shouldn't be this way, but this is America, and health and life somehow aren't rights.

[chiromamma]

Originally Posted by Noelle C.

You need to understand that these are really the health insurance options most people have. You either get it through an employer (and plenty of people work solely for the health coverage), or privately. I don't know if you're looking for a government program that will give it to you for free, but if you are able-bodied and your reason for not working is your husband can't/won't take care of his own kids, you're not likely to find a program that will take pity on you and let you have free health care. It doesn't require leaving the home for him to watch the kids.

Since you are able-bodied, regardless of your reason for not wanting work right now, your choices will ultimately boil down to getting a job for the insurance, paying for it privately, or going without it relying on free clinics in your area. It doesn't matter if the free clinic in your area isn't up to your standards. It's free. Take it, get a job, or buy private. The options suck, but it's life. It shouldn't be this way, but this is America, and health and life somehow aren't rights.

No. Not most people. These are the options most Americans have. Other industrialized nations realize the importance of providing basic health services to their citizens. It's disgusting and ridiculous that we don't. We need socialized health care yesterday. 62% of bankruptcies are tied to medical costs. Of those bankruptcies, 80% had insurance. It's only going to get worse. The current "health care reform" is designed merely to keep from pissing off the pharmaceutical and insurance companies.

[Selesai]

Originally Posted by chiromamma

No. Not most people. These are the options most Americans have. Other industrialized nations realize the importance of providing basic health services to their citizens. It's disgusting and ridiculous that we don't. We need socialized health care yesterday. 62% of bankruptcies are tied to medical costs. Of those bankruptcies, 80% had insurance. It's only going to get worse. The current "health care reform" is designed merely to keep from pissing off the pharmaceutical and insurance companies.

That's all well and good, and I agree with you about reform. But Noelle was telling the OP what the REALITY of her current situation is (and the current situation of many other Americans). Prospective health reform is, to the OP and any other real person, just prospective until it ACTUALLY happens. Until then, the options Noelle outline are all that people have, and all the rest is philosophy.

[honey-lilac]

Originally Posted by Noelle C.

You need to understand that these are really the health insurance options most people have. You either get it through an employer (and plenty of people work solely for the health coverage), or privately. I don't know if you're looking for a government program that will give it to you for free, but if you are able-bodied and your reason for not working is your husband can't/won't take care of his own kids, you're not likely to find a program that will take pity on you and let you have free health care. It doesn't require leaving the home for him to watch the kids.

Since you are able-bodied, regardless of your reason for not wanting work right now, your choices will ultimately boil down to getting a job for the insurance, paying for it privately, or going without it relying on free clinics in your area. It doesn't matter if the free clinic in your area isn't up to your standards. It's free. Take it, get a job, or buy private. The options suck, but it's life. It shouldn't be this way, but this is America, and health and life somehow aren't rights.

OK, I'm totally not going to debate with you whether or not my husband can take care of the kids. If you don't want to take my word for it, I'm not going to go into details, not on a public forum. Let's leave it at that my husband cannot take care of his kids, not because he's a UAV or because he'd rather be out partying but because he cannot take the stress. Of his own kids. Yup, that's right - even though it sounds ludicrous, it's true. Regardless of whether or not you think that's an adequate reason or not, it's the case. Yes, it's sad. Yes, it's hard. Yup, that's life. So we're back to square one - need childcare if I'm going to work.

I'm not trying to get free state help here although I wouldn't feel the least bit guilty taking it if it was offered. We qualify based on income for MANY services (food stamps, this and that) and I wouldn't feel right having things handed to me that we are already taking care of ourselves. We already buy food, we're already well fed, just because we qualify for free food. It's not eating steaks and kiwi all day, but we don't go hungry. Food stamps are a safety net, and we don't need it right now.

There's a difference between wants and needs. I WANT more money to play with, but you're right, it's life that you have to spend it on necessities instead. If I break my arm, it's not like I *want* to have it fixed - I *need* to have it fixed. If I had wanted to go the money route, I wouldn't have turned down several good paying jobs after college. But health care? I *do* think that's a basic right. People are being sold their health and lives back at HUGE prices that people can't afford to pay on their own, forcing people to work for those corporations and all the rest. People shouldn't be FORCED to give up their talents, their callings, etc. in case they don't happen to be particularly marketable, and go to work for Big Business just so they don't have to worry about being covered if their health goes bad. There are plenty of doctors around, there are plenty of resources around, I think everyone should be covered. Period.

I know lots of people make the choice to go to work for health insurance. I don't applaud them, I pity them. (Well, I applaud them too; but not because they are "making the right choice" but because they are doing something that is difficult; there's a difference.)

I was never anti-capitalist before, in fact I grew up in a rather conservative home and never felt particularly called to rebel against that. But in the last few years I've been doing a lot of thinking and I'm turning quite anti-capitalist. We are so lucky that we have the option of doing our own thing in America, in name. No one is going to shoot us for talking trash about the government, no one is going to imprison us for picking the wrong religion. Everyone is equal. Or rather, it seems that everyone is equal as long as they do their part in working a 9-5 job or else are a genius entrepreneur who really hits the market jackpot and makes a killing off their independent pursuits. Then they're heroes. If you want to do something that isn't making a lot of money, (moneymoneymoney) then you are considered to be scamming off all the good people who WORK for a living. Going 9-5 is not the only work that is worthwhile. (Or whatever the hours are, ywkim.)

OK, rant done.

And just for the record... notice how my whole thread started out. We're trying to buy insurance privately. We got turned down for one plan and I wanted to see what our options were. That's it. I wasn't saying that I demand state health care even though we don't qualify. I said that SINCE I don't want to use free clinics - which are really shoddy and I am literally scared to go to some, one I went to while pregnant was in an inner city neighborhood where you had to walk into a basement through a gang of loitering teens who leered at you and make rude comments, and then the doctor's office itself was literally filthy, and after waiting for six or seven hours they told me they couldn't even do the service I needed because they didn't have any doctors who could do it... I was shocked. It's not like I'm "too good" for charity. I question whether anyone here would be willing to go there for care, with the likelihood that oops, they can't do the care anyway. So yeah, I'd rather get insurance.

I want to PAY money to get health insurance. We could afford some plans even though it means making HUGE sacrifices on our already bare-bones lifestyle - the amount we were quoted was already a third of our income, and I was told here on this thread that it was actually a really good price. (Some people quoted health insurance plans that were larger than our WHOLE income.) We are now in the process of appealing that and if that gets turned down we have other options. In my own private opinion, I think working for health insurance is a disgusting choice to give people. That opinion has clearly shown through the thread, and I'm not ashamed to admit it.

BUT I'm trying to work WITH the system instead of against it. I'm trying to find legitimate ways to get covered. That's it. I'm not here to whine about how unfair life is, I'm here to find solutions.

[lolar2]

I can think of a few other choices, which might work for you.

One, whatever government programs you DO qualify for in your state, get on them. Get on food stamps. Put away the money you save, for health care.

Two, apply through a broker or ehealthinsurance.com for six-month "short-term" plans. Do not apply as a family. Apply for each of you individually, so that if one of you is turned down, the others won't be. This should buy you some time.

Three, apply (through a broker or online, again) for long-term plans, for each of you individually.

[Kino]

I'm in a similar situation though my background is very different from most people it seems.

I have a long history of chronic illness and have discovered it is far cheaper to pay out-of-pocket, even ER-wise, than to have insurance. I consider a ten thousand dollar treatment cheap. I am also willing to go into debt concerning healthcare if that is the case. Medical bills have only ever been the kind of debt I've had.

Along my path I have met too many people still needing to declare bankruptcy (or go into huge debt) even with "good" insurance where they never thought the majority of expenses wouldn't be covered.

I am somewhat interested in "emergency" insurance though... and the HSA as I consider my savings account that anyway. That's where all the savings ends up going!

Sadly other than that I don't even think I qualify for insurance anymore with all my "pre-existing" conditions.

[Noelle C.]

Originally Posted by chiromamma

No. Not most people. These are the options most Americans have. Other industrialized nations realize the importance of providing basic health services to their citizens. It's disgusting and ridiculous that we don't. We need socialized health care yesterday. 62% of bankruptcies are tied to medical costs. Of those bankruptcies, 80% had insurance. It's only going to get worse. The current "health care reform" is designed merely to keep from pissing off the pharmaceutical and insurance companies.

Yes, and we're talking about Americans in America trying to get health care. Other countries providing health care means nothing here. It doesn't get us in the door to see a doctor, and it doesn't get with chemo, or prescriptions, or surgery.

We DO need a public option, but it needs to be something ALL people can access, not just those deemed to be poor enough by some bureaucrat's out-of-tough idea of what it means to be poor. That blue-collar worker or McDonald's/Burger King burger flipping working two jobs to make ends meet may very likely make too much money to qualify, be seen as wealthy enough to afford several hundred a month in premiums, if not four figures.

But we are in America, and somehow it's unAmerican to have health care for all. Universal or a public option don't get exist, so the options for most people to get coverage are to get a job with benefits, or try to find a private coverage they can afford. What we SHOULD have available matters jack when it's not available. What we have available is what we have available.

[Noelle C.]

Originally Posted by Kino

I have a long history of chronic illness and have discovered it is far cheaper to pay out-of-pocket, even ER-wise, than to have insurance. I consider a ten thousand dollar treatment cheap. I am also willing to go into debt concerning healthcare if that is the case. Medical bills have only ever been the kind of debt I've had.

Along my path I have met too many people still needing to declare bankruptcy (or go into huge debt) even with "good" insurance where they never thought the majority of expenses wouldn't be covered.

I am somewhat interested in "emergency" insurance though... and the HSA as I consider my savings account that anyway. That's where all the savings ends up going!

Sadly other than that I don't even think I qualify for insurance anymore with all my "pre-existing" conditions.

Are we the same person? I've also got a long medical history from a chronic illness, and it's now at the point where we're paying more in premiums and deductibles in a year by far than the cost of medical care I've received. It'll be cheaper to go out of pocket. We're being priced out of insurance through my fiance's work, so will be canceling after our baby's born and putting the premiums and what we otherwise are used to spending into a high-interest-bearing account that we have. Our baby will get coverage though.

It's a sad fact that many people don't realize there are ceilings to what insurance will cover. My parents found this out the hard way with me as a teenager. I was deathly ill, died twice and was resuscitated, once after a very long time, and they found out insurance capped off around the $500,000-mark, leaving the rest to them to pay for. Bills easily exceeded that in one year. This doesn't count the medical supplies needed on a daily basis that ran anywhere from $20 to $50, depending on what dressings needed to be changed that day. They still paid so much out of pocket despite having what was considered phenomenal health care coverage.

If you go bankrupt, it doesn't matter how many tens of thousands you spent before that. It's all lost. It shouldn't be this way, especially not in America of all places. Any country that hails itself as the world's superpower should be taking care of its citizens. We're paying the taxes to take care of people in other countries. Some of that tax money needs to be spent making sure people HERE aren't dying of curable diseases.

[chiromamma]

Originally Posted by Noelle C.

Yes, and we're talking about Americans in America trying to get health care. Other countries providing health care means nothing here. It doesn't get us in the door to see a doctor, and it doesn't get with chemo, or prescriptions, or surgery.

We DO need a public option, but it needs to be something ALL people can access, not just those deemed to be poor enough by some bureaucrat's out-of-tough idea of what it means to be poor. That blue-collar worker or McDonald's/Burger King burger flipping working two jobs to make ends meet may very likely make too much money to qualify, be seen as wealthy enough to afford several hundred a month in premiums, if not four figures.

But we are in America, and somehow it's unAmerican to have health care for all. Universal or a public option don't get exist, so the options for most people to get coverage are to get a job with benefits, or try to find a private coverage they can afford. What we SHOULD have available matters jack when it's not available. What we have available is what we have available.

What you say is a true and harsh reality. And it's not O.K. The attitude of just suck it up and get the job for the insurance just funnels more money into a corrupt system and ultimately stalls real reform. No thanks.
I am in a similar situation as the OP...DH is self employed and I'm an independent contractor. Our useless high deductible insurance cost us $1000 a month. The 10K deductible would force us into bankruptcy. We cancelled. We put those premiums towards an emergency fund....and groceries. It's just unrealistic to suggest a mom with 2 under 2 get a barista job for the health care when most places aren't hiring right now. I wouldn't be surprised if Starbucks is only hiring baristas for 15 hours a week.

[vbactivist]

Originally Posted by Kaleanani

In my own private opinion, I think working for health insurance is a disgusting choice to give people.

most people work for money or pay of some sort. health care costs money. i guess I don't see the difference in expecting people to work to put food on their tables, or a roof over their heads or pay for medical care. I don't see how expecting them to work to pay for soemthing they need is disgusting? I am speaking about able bodied adults.

[honey-lilac]

I think you misunderstand what I'm trying to say. I don't think WORKING is a bad thing, not at all! If you're an able bodied adult, you darn sure better be working at something. Work is a MAJOR component of life, and can be satisfying and one way of making meaning in our lives. I love to work. Of course, we all know that society values some forms of work but completely devalues others. I fail to see how [serving high-priced coffees to strangers, doing some repetitive paper-pushing cubicle job, etc] is more important than [raising children, creating beautiful art, doing ministerial work, whatever]. One set of people gets to be rewarded for their work by being called responsible, productive citizens, and they get health insurance because they're doing the right thing. The second set of people are given grief and told they're not worth health insurance. (Then again, if you take care of other people's kids, that's OK, that's still productive. Take care of your own and you're lazy and don't deserve health care.)

Where I think the disgusting part comes in (and perhaps that was not a careful choice of words) is that people are forced to give up their time with their families, not work with their God-given talents, etc to work jobs that they hate, for no benefits other than to *maybe* get covered if they get sick. Maybe. It's like paying off a Mafia member for protection. Hey, it sucks that they want your money, but if you want their protection you better pay up. That's life. There's no guarantees they'll make good on their promises to pay for your healthcare, but if you don't pay them you're screwed for sure - so just be nice and give them a huge chunk of your income, just in case it works out for you in the end.

What if food also cost that much? We need food, so why don't we pay prices for meal insurance, and then you can either go to a soup kitchen if you're poor, get your food from your employer-based meal insurance plan, or make the choice to go without if you can't afford private food insurance or qualify for income based soup kitchens? Oh, and if you grow your own food, that's irresponsible too and you might poison yourself?

I'm going off on a totally weird tangent, I realize. I don't know how to otherwise explain why I think the choice to work ONLY for health insurance is bad. If you disagree, then that's cool, you're in the majority, apparently.

Time is really short. LIFE is really short. If you look at it in one way, if you're slaving away your life without spending time with your kids, to get health insurance, but you miss your kids growing up... do you come out better in the end if you get sick and get your life extended by a few years because you're getting health care? None of us know whether or not we will get sick, none of us know when we will die, that even with the best health care we will live... None of us know what fate holds in store. But what we have the most control over is the immediate - so for me I'd rather spend the time I have right now with the people that I love, and doing the best that I can, and trying to make a difference in the world now, rather than worrying about landing a corporate job so I *may* get something out of it in the end. That is my CHOICE - and thank God that in America we DO have choices. It is a true blessing. I can rant about the health care system and I can not like it but I realize that I'm lucky to be able to rant without consequence (except grating on the nerves of a few people on MDC ).

[EFmom]

I had a breast cancer diagnosis about 5 years back. I had much testing, a sentinel node biopsy, 8 rounds of chemo, a lumpectomy, 8 weeks of radiation, a year of Herceptin, and will be on Tamoxifen or an aromatase inhibitor for five years. The sum total of this treatment was, I would estimate, nearly a million dollars.

I fortunately have excellent health insurance through my employer. I did not lose my coverage after getting sick. The sum total of what I paid for all this was about $300 in co-pays.

Nobody wants to think this could happen to them, but it certainly could.

I absolutely think the present situation with insurance sucks for the vast majority of people in this country and firmly believe it needs to change.

But right now it is what it is. Wishing it were different doesn't make it so. If it's worth the gamble for you, I genuinely hope it works out for you. But it's not one I would take.

[chiromamma]

Originally Posted by Kaleanani

I think you misunderstand what I'm trying to say. I don't think WORKING is a bad thing, not at all! If you're an able bodied adult, you darn sure better be working at something. Work is a MAJOR component of life, and can be satisfying and one way of making meaning in our lives. I love to work. Of course, we all know that society values some forms of work but completely devalues others. I fail to see how [serving high-priced coffees to strangers, doing some repetitive paper-pushing cubicle job, etc] is more important than [raising children, creating beautiful art, doing ministerial work, whatever]. One set of people gets to be rewarded for their work by being called responsible, productive citizens, and they get health insurance because they're doing the right thing. The second set of people are given grief and told they're not worth health insurance. (Then again, if you take care of other people's kids, that's OK, that's still productive. Take care of your own and you're lazy and don't deserve health care.)

Where I think the disgusting part comes in (and perhaps that was not a careful choice of words) is that people are forced to give up their time with their families, not work with their God-given talents, etc to work jobs that they hate, for no benefits other than to *maybe* get covered if they get sick. Maybe. It's like paying off a Mafia member for protection. Hey, it sucks that they want your money, but if you want their protection you better pay up. That's life. There's no guarantees they'll make good on their promises to pay for your healthcare, but if you don't pay them you're screwed for sure - so just be nice and give them a huge chunk of your income, just in case it works out for you in the end.

What if food also cost that much? We need food, so why don't we pay prices for meal insurance, and then you can either go to a soup kitchen if you're poor, get your food from your employer-based meal insurance plan, or make the choice to go without if you can't afford private food insurance or qualify for income based soup kitchens? Oh, and if you grow your own food, that's irresponsible too and you might poison yourself?

I'm going off on a totally weird tangent, I realize. I don't know how to otherwise explain why I think the choice to work ONLY for health insurance is bad. If you disagree, then that's cool, you're in the majority, apparently.

Time is really short. LIFE is really short. If you look at it in one way, if you're slaving away your life without spending time with your kids, to get health insurance, but you miss your kids growing up... do you come out better in the end if you get sick and get your life extended by a few years because you're getting health care? None of us know whether or not we will get sick, none of us know when we will die, that even with the best health care we will live... None of us know what fate holds in store. But what we have the most control over is the immediate - so for me I'd rather spend the time I have right now with the people that I love, and doing the best that I can, and trying to make a difference in the world now, rather than worrying about landing a corporate job so I *may* get something out of it in the end. That is my CHOICE - and thank God that in America we DO have choices. It is a true blessing. I can rant about the health care system and I can not like it but I realize that I'm lucky to be able to rant without consequence (except grating on the nerves of a few people on MDC ).

[cravenab00]

Originally Posted by Kaleanani

I think you misunderstand what I'm trying to say. I don't think WORKING is a bad thing, not at all! If you're an able bodied adult, you darn sure better be working at something. Work is a MAJOR component of life, and can be satisfying and one way of making meaning in our lives. I love to work. Of course, we all know that society values some forms of work but completely devalues others. I fail to see how [serving high-priced coffees to strangers, doing some repetitive paper-pushing cubicle job, etc] is more important than [raising children, creating beautiful art, doing ministerial work, whatever]. One set of people gets to be rewarded for their work by being called responsible, productive citizens, and they get health insurance because they're doing the right thing. The second set of people are given grief and told they're not worth health insurance. (Then again, if you take care of other people's kids, that's OK, that's still productive. Take care of your own and you're lazy and don't deserve health care.)

Where I think the disgusting part comes in (and perhaps that was not a careful choice of words) is that people are forced to give up their time with their families, not work with their God-given talents, etc to work jobs that they hate, for no benefits other than to *maybe* get covered if they get sick. Maybe. It's like paying off a Mafia member for protection. Hey, it sucks that they want your money, but if you want their protection you better pay up. That's life. There's no guarantees they'll make good on their promises to pay for your healthcare, but if you don't pay them you're screwed for sure - so just be nice and give them a huge chunk of your income, just in case it works out for you in the end.

What if food also cost that much? We need food, so why don't we pay prices for meal insurance, and then you can either go to a soup kitchen if you're poor, get your food from your employer-based meal insurance plan, or make the choice to go without if you can't afford private food insurance or qualify for income based soup kitchens? Oh, and if you grow your own food, that's irresponsible too and you might poison yourself?

I'm going off on a totally weird tangent, I realize. I don't know how to otherwise explain why I think the choice to work ONLY for health insurance is bad. If you disagree, then that's cool, you're in the majority, apparently.

Time is really short. LIFE is really short. If you look at it in one way, if you're slaving away your life without spending time with your kids, to get health insurance, but you miss your kids growing up... do you come out better in the end if you get sick and get your life extended by a few years because you're getting health care? None of us know whether or not we will get sick, none of us know when we will die, that even with the best health care we will live... None of us know what fate holds in store. But what we have the most control over is the immediate - so for me I'd rather spend the time I have right now with the people that I love, and doing the best that I can, and trying to make a difference in the world now, rather than worrying about landing a corporate job so I *may* get something out of it in the end. That is my CHOICE - and thank God that in America we DO have choices. It is a true blessing. I can rant about the health care system and I can not like it but I realize that I'm lucky to be able to rant without consequence (except grating on the nerves of a few people on MDC ).