A few questions about Waldorf - Page 2

[kittywitty]

Originally Posted by iloveaidan&finley

Ok, so I'm not crazy! I'm not into the anthroposophic/religious aspect of it either, so I'm just going to ignore it when I can. I think we'll adhere to the Christopherus this year and next year do more of a blend once I get used to homeschooling.

That's a good idea. I flip-flop about unschooling and Waldorf a lot. We are child-led except for some OT things my ds does need to practice. They helped me pick out Christopherus after complaining they hated narration from our CM days and missed Waldorf. They tried OM and hated it, and Enki is too much $$ and work, but they looked at the Christopherus website and samples and we looked at blogs using different waldorf things and they knew what they wanted. We are in a bit of a rut right now, but they like it far better than anything else we've tried.

[pampered_mom]

OP - Maybe given the fact that you'd like to blend a number of different learning styles you might want to just start with the Christopherus "Waldorf Curriculum Overview" vs one of the actual curriculums. It gives a good overview both on a year by year track and a subject by subject track....including suggestions for other books/resources.

I have both the overview and the Christopherus Kindergarten book and have really enjoyed them both. I think the "Overview" might give you a good framework to start from so you could do what works best for your family. I've also seen it for sale on the waldorf curriculum supply group on Yahoo for a decent price (although I was charged *way* too much for the condition of the one I bought from a member there - I just chalked it up to one of those learning experiences!).

[tankgirl73]

Hey, pampered mom, that's exactly what I've decided to do. I've ordered the Christopherus Waldorf Curriculum Overview, as well as Joyful Movement and Form Drawing for Beginners. I also threw in their grade 5 Botany unit study, since DS would be grade 5 by their grade reckoning.

Not only since they don't have a complete grade 5 curriculum yet, but because we're mixing and matching... some CM and some Montessori, like the OP is wanting to do, and also some "remedial" stuff like starting Form Drawing from the beginning, not jumping in at the grade 5 level.

So I appreciate hearing from someone who has the Curriculum Overview, to reassure me that it's a good way to get a framework to start from.

[kittywitty]

I just bought the Overview for $15 on Amazon used and have been reading it today. As much as I love their full curriculums, I think all I really needed was this Overview! It's very comprehensive and helpful and much more complete even as an overview than some other waldorf curriculums I've used/perused.

[tankgirl73]

at more positive reviews of the Overview. It's making me feel SO relieved that I didn't just waste a bunch of $$$ with my hastily-researched and much-struggled-with decision to buy it!

[harmat]

Originally Posted by Holiztic

So what am I missing. I see some overviewy stuff, some FAQ answers, a few reviews, a few articles, and a place to buy things. What do you see?

On the left hand side you click on Schools OR Homeschools, and the list expands, with a bunch of stuff to read. (Approach, Content areas, Grades, etc.)

[LuxPerpetua]

OOh, I'm so glad that the Christopherus Overview book is mentioned. That's on my Christmas list along with the Waldorf science book and Joyful Movement. I may have to wait until my birthday for the Kindy book unless I can find a kind soul who will sell it secondhand.

[LuxPerpetua]

Not meaning to sidetrack, but I have a question for the mamas who already are in the thick of Waldorf homeschooling but don't follow Steiner to a T. Do you follow the recommended age guidelines for certain material or do you follow your child's lead? I'm asking because at nearly 4 my dd is way advanced. According to traditional Waldorf, I shouldn't start dd in 1st grade until age 7.5 if we follow a traditional school year session of starting in September (she has a December b-day). That just seems so long for a child to wait, especially MY child. I'm really all for not pushing academics but I foresee her really wanting to get into academics before that age. I want her to fully enjoy her childhood but there's also a part of me that doesn't want to her be so far removed academically from her age mates, especially since I think she'd really like it and we will be required to do state testing. Obviously, we're kind of early thinking about this, but after reading over the Christopherus website I'm contemplating starting Grade 1 at 6.5. I'm just curious what others' experiences have been, if you wouldn't mind sharing.

[annettemarie]

I play it by ear. My first kid ended up in public school because I tried too hard to follow Steiner guidelines. Now I try to follow my kid. For the most part, I find that my children fit in really well with his ideas about ages and stages and academics. But depending on the child and the birthday, I've had to tweak some stuff.

But again, I'm not a purist.

[onyxravnos]

Originally Posted by LuxPerpetua

Not meaning to sidetrack, but I have a question for the mamas who already are in the thick of Waldorf homeschooling but don't follow Steiner to a T. Do you follow the recommended age guidelines for certain material or do you follow your child's lead?

i try to follow waldorf guidelines... i feel they are good and right BUT
should i get a child just so interested in something that wasn't yet 'age appropriate' for waldorf I would run with it anyway as much as the child needed. I definitely do more then would traditional be in a waldorf preschool but always to the comfort level of ds.

[tankgirl73]

I'm going to reply though I'm not "in the thick of it" yet... My understanding of Waldorf is that you pick the grade based on the year when your child turns that age. So you do grade 1 the year that your child turns 7... so 6.5 would be the right age to start grade 1, with a December birthday.

I could be wrong about that, not sure exactly where the cutoff would be... My son has a May birthday and they (Christopherus) have told me he would be grade 5 by their system, which would mean he would have been 7 the May *before* starting grade 1. But May is very different from December.

Anyway, my impression has been that there are many non-strict Waldorf-ey homeschoolers who start a bit earlier than "recommended". I think any system that prescribes absolute guidelines based solely on birthdays wholly disregarding the individual is nonsensical. If you look at infants and toddlers, you can't say "all children 12mo should be practicing walking for 1/2 hour per day, all children 18mo should recite these simple verses" -- we know that they develop these skills at different rates and it's all normal. It's just common sense (IMO) that there are different rates of development over the entire early childhood years.

That being said, I still think there is some value in the Waldorf philosophy... in that it can be a reminder not to over-emphasize academic-type learning too early. Or, to put it another way, not to de-emphasize physical and practical skills learning, because you're too busy reading and writing and rithmaticking. This time should still be primarily a time of "body" education. But if a kid is ridiculously precociously gifted, you can't STOP them from going ahead.

[scheelimama]

Originally Posted by tankgirl73

I'm going to reply though I'm not "in the thick of it" yet... My understanding of Waldorf is that you pick the grade based on the year when your child turns that age. So you do grade 1 the year that your child turns 7... so 6.5 would be the right age to start grade 1, with a December birthday.

I could be wrong about that, not sure exactly where the cutoff would be... My son has a May birthday and they (Christopherus) have told me he would be grade 5 by their system, which would mean he would have been 7 the May *before* starting grade 1. But May is very different from December.

[kittywitty]

Originally Posted by LuxPerpetua

Not meaning to sidetrack, but I have a question for the mamas who already are in the thick of Waldorf homeschooling but don't follow Steiner to a T. Do you follow the recommended age guidelines for certain material or do you follow your child's lead? I'm asking because at nearly 4 my dd is way advanced.

I play it by my kids. Ds is 7.5 and doing grade 2 work. But it's mostly child-led. I don't require work, though since he requested this program and agreed to do it with me, I do expect him to put some effort into sticking with it this year. I probably should have waited, but he was way ahead math-wise and started reading fluently, and I was 6.5 when I started 2nd grade. He is doing just fine. I don't consider it too challenging academically where he can't keep up. My 8 yo is doing 3rd grade and it's not challenging enough for her in some ways (though there are tons of ideas to make it more so in the curriculum). I think the point is not to push if they aren't ready. But every kid is different and I don't stick much by ages myself.

[chrissy]

i'm just joining your thread, hope it's okay if i tag along!

i have an almost 8yo (turns on 11/14) and he is in 2nd grade. i'm getting ready to bring him back home to school and i am SO excited.

we started last fall out homeschooling and used Christopherus 1st grade. i really really liked it. i had used Enki and then bought a used copy of OM grade 1, and i really preferred Christopherus to either of those. even still though, i think it would be impossible for me to find 1 thing that would be totally perfect for me and our family.

i am kind of feeling like the op though that it might be too much for me this year to totally make up my own perfect curriculum.

i have a good friend who is using Christopherus Grade 2 and she is going to let me borrow it for a couple of days to look at it.

i'm not sure if i will end up ordering it myself yet or not. i did just order a few more Classical things from Amazon, so we'll see.

i LOVE a lot about Waldorf, but i don't think we could ever be, or even aspire to be, a totally Waldorf family.

i think there used to be a Waldof-inspired hs'ing thread. somebody ought to start that up again.

[Madame Pomfrey]

You might find it easier, but as time has passed I have often been challenged to figure out what really IS my child's lead. Sometimes I can figure it out and others I just go with what feels right.

Do I just disagree with some aspect of Waldorf/MI/relaxed/inquiry or the way they are being translated by some book? I go with my gut - that's okay!

Or am I picking up signals from my child that seem to override a philosophy I believe in? If so, I consider the reasons for the Waldorf/MI/relaxed/inquiry way & figure out why he needs something different, so I can follow his lead - that's okay too!

There's no way to predict it. When the time comes, just believe in your ability as a mom to decipher the signals. Your confidence will allow you to tune out everything but the child, and THAT's the key to being child-led.

Have a great day!

Lucie
making waffles for sleepy U2/tech fans - staying up til 2 with my teen wasn't exactly Waldorfy was it?

[dandelionmom]

I use the Waldorf approach in homeschooling my 2 daughters, ages 6 and 13, and use a combination of Oak Meadow and Live Education. I really love Oak Meadow as a base, and since I do not have Waldorf teacher training, it is extremely helpful in laying out the day. It structures the day in a way that is very similar to a Waldorf school with circle time, songs and verses, recorder, knitting and crochet, using main lesson books and natural supplies such as beeswax and clay, and utilizing story and fairy tales throughout. I also really love that they offer a complete Waldorf high school curriculum through 12th grade...one of the only Waldorf homeschooling curriculum's that do. I piece together and purchase the curriculum through eBay or Amazon, instead of purchasing it through Oak Meadow. It may take awhile to collect all of the books necessary for the year, but it saves a ton of money!

Live Education is incredible. Completely well worth the money. It is very traditionally Waldorf, created by Rainbow Rosenbloom with Anthroposophical theory and a strict Waldorf approach in mind. I particularly love the grade 6 math, which teaches Sacred Geometry in depth. Live Education does not, however, offer a structured schedule for the day like Oak Meadow does. This is why I use a combination of the two. Live Education is extremely strict about re-selling their materials...not really sure why...and you have to go through an interview process and they place your child in the appropriate grade level. They do have a wonderful online community and great educational support though.

Blessings,
Kelly

[Holiztic]

Originally Posted by dandelionmom

Live Education is incredible. Completely well worth the money. It is very traditionally Waldorf, ... Live Education is extremely strict about re-selling their materials...not really sure why...and you have to go through an interview process and they place your child in the appropriate grade level. They do have a wonderful online community and great educational support though.

Blessings,
Kelly

So you mean they do an interview, and separately they place the child in the appropriate grade level, yes? (Not an interview to place the child) Meaning the interview has nothing to do with the grade level placement, right? If they are strict Waldorf, all they need to ask for grade level placement is birth date. So does that mean they won't let you buy materials that are ahead or behind the age-based grade placement? Correct me if I've got it wrong!

[dandelionmom]

Originally Posted by Holiztic

So you mean they do an interview, and separately they place the child in the appropriate grade level, yes? (Not an interview to place the child) Meaning the interview has nothing to do with the grade level placement, right? If they are strict Waldorf, all they need to ask for grade level placement is birth date. So does that mean they won't let you buy materials that are ahead or behind the age-based grade placement? Correct me if I've got it wrong!

Well they allow anyone to buy their curriculum, but they do an interview to find out about the family and to find out about the homelife...just like a Waldorf school does. As far as grade placement goes...I have 2 Profoundly Gifted children who are above grade level by multiple grades. When I originally bought the curriculum I thought I would get the curriculum a couple grades above, but after having the interview with Rainbow it was decided to only go 1 grade above...he was even very hesitant to do that. I can understand why, though, because much of the curriculum is designed for the emotional and spiritual level of the child, not so much the academic level. So, 1st for a regular curriculum would be different from 1st in a traditional Waldorf curriculum.