He's fighting the boob

[JordanKX]

Today is day 3 of lil man fighting the boob (he's 6.5 weeks). It's kinda hard to describe. He finds the boob, is definitely happy about it. But after a few minutes, while staying latched on, he opens his mouth into a scream. Then squirms like he's in pain, a few more sucks, scream, let's go of the nipple. Screams again -- now apparently because he's realized the boob is gone, roots around like a mad man til he's found it again. Latches, and a few minutes later....

He's not crying like this before a feeding, so it'd seem coincidental that feeding immediately causes gas pains.
Each time I squeeze the boob to make sure there's milk coming out... yep.

We do supplement bf and formula bottles, so maybe he's deciding he doesn't like the boob. But why would he yell while still latched on?

Any ideas?

[athensmama]

My first thought is that maybe he is not happy with the rate of flow. Babies have to work harder to extract milk from the breast whereas coming from the bottle it comes steadily with little effort.

[goldfinch]

This could be totally wrong, but... do you think his ears might be bothering him so that sucking is painful? Random, drive-by guess here.

[Heba]

Originally Posted by athensmama

My first thought is that maybe he is not happy with the rate of flow. Babies have to work harder to extract milk from the breast whereas coming from the bottle it comes steadily with little effort.

Yes this. Can happen with babies who have taken a bottle - they're fine early on in the feed when the flow is pretty fast, but when it slows down they get impatient.

[boobs4milk]

Originally Posted by athensmama

My first thought is that maybe he is not happy with the rate of flow. Babies have to work harder to extract milk from the breast whereas coming from the bottle it comes steadily with little effort.

this is what is happening with us. i was told it was frustration because she is used to the bottles. now that we are getting closer to all bf, she only does this after we've given her a bottle.

eta: she also fight latch on some and we've noticed this improving as wwe lessen bottles. it's just frustration that the milk isn't pouring out. then i get letdown (overactive) and she gulps so much that she pukes. can't win over here.

[tulipan]

boob-fighter

This is my first reply to any electronic forum ever!

I'm having exactly same issue with daughter, 3 months, and have been for some time...it's possible your let-down/eject flow is too strong at first...I read somewhere to put the babe on top of the boob so it's not overwhelming...this also helps with gas sometimes. She often lets out a big fart!

Good luck and keep at it!

[bender]

Maybe silent reflux?

[HikeMama]

Are there any signs of thrush? white patches on his tongue or in the back of his throat?

[pure]

Try the other side. When my baby would do that I would switch sides and he would settle in.

[JordanKX]

Originally Posted by HikeMama

Are there any signs of thrush? white patches on his tongue or in the back of his throat?

Well, now that you mention it, his tongue does appear white splotchy. But I just figured that was formula remnants. Perhaps I should do some thrush research?

Thank you all SO much for your comments.

I think there must be a flow, because there are times (after a few minutes) that it seems he takes too much and pukes. So maybe too bare in the beginning, and too much later on.

And I thought we were just getting in a great rhythm. It does always seem to be something.

[HikeMama]

General thrush info:

http://www.webmd.com/oral-health/tc/thrush-symptoms

If you think it's thrush, I'd call the ped to try to take care of it ASAP. Keep us posted!

[JordanKX]

I don't want to try to scrape his tongue, so says research that if thrush, it'll cause further irritation. But his is just white stuff on the center of his tongue - not anything like the thrush pictures I've seen. No diaper rash. And he doesn't do the screaming thing if I give him a bottle.
But, I suppose that doesn't rule it out. Thank you for the info - I'll keep you posted!

[boobs4milk]

there's a difference in milk tongue and thrush. most likely, your babe just has milk tongue. i know that i freaked the first time i saw that on my oldest and took her to the ped only to learn that it was normal.

amelia really fought latch on this a.m. when she's really hungry it gets worse.

[JordanKX]

This morning brings a different question...

Could there be a FLAVOR issue?
I just wonder because he nurses through the night with no problem. So maybe there's something during the day that he doesn't like? Does breast milk change FLAVOR? I feel like such an idiot... :-) Thanks!

[HikeMama]

breastmilk changes flavor. Are you eating something in the morning that maybe he doesn't like? Coffee?

[JordanKX]

No caffeine. And not because he's had digestive issues, but just preemptively, I've stayed away from dairy and super spicy, try to limit onions and broccoli, other things I've read could be icky for him. I'm not too picky on my diet - yesterday I had waffles (a staple left-over from pregnancy), a super-potato with cilantro and bacon, and chicken and salad for dinner. Just your basic day of food. I drink water and diet soda.
But there is a marked difference at night.. he just nurses and nurses no problem. It's not til the daytime that he does the crying thing while nursing. He cried out at this morning's 10am feeding. It's so frustrating (for us both), I end up giving him a bottle. And I hate the idea of that becoming the norm, yk!

[HikeMama]

Are you feeding him on a schedule or on demand? Maybe he just plain doesn't want it at the time you're trying to nurse him?

[zenproof]

Originally Posted by JordanKX

No caffeine. And not because he's had digestive issues, but just preemptively, I've stayed away from dairy and super spicy, try to limit onions and broccoli, other things I've read could be icky for him. I'm not too picky on my diet - yesterday I had waffles (a staple left-over from pregnancy), a super-potato with cilantro and bacon, and chicken and salad for dinner. Just your basic day of food. I drink water and diet soda.
But there is a marked difference at night.. he just nurses and nurses no problem. It's not til the daytime that he does the crying thing while nursing. He cried out at this morning's 10am feeding. It's so frustrating (for us both), I end up giving him a bottle. And I hate the idea of that becoming the norm, yk!

THIS IS EXACTLY what I am going through right now. We are also DDC buds. My guy is 6wks - and this has just started in the last 3 days. It is so weird. He will get on just fine - flow is happening - he is sucking and swallowing (not drowning), and then about midway into the feed he just turns bright red and goes apeshit - as though suddenly he was sucking on daggers! i take him off - try to burp him thinking maybe its gas - b/c he is gassy - and then put him back on. he'll go agressively for a minute, and then same deal again.

I don't feel like it is OAL or not enough milk issue - i would know if he wasn't getting any - or too much. and it also seems different than GAS b/c when he has gas, he usually arches his back and head (with my nip in it!! ). this is really odd. sometimes i'll try and switch breasts, and the same thing will happen. he starts, gets going, then starts screaming.

I feel terrible for him -a nd its the worse to think its your milk thats making him so upset.

I'll be watching this thread for replies. I'm also battling some serious nip issues - burning - bright pink - he does NOT have thrush according to the ped, but could be asymptomatic.

I'm on APNO - but doesn't seem to be helping much.

off to tend to screaming babe...

GOOD LUCK!

eta* also, he doesn't do this at EVERY feeding. yesterday he did do it for 3 feedings in a row (during the afternoon) - last night he was fine - today - he has done it once. SO ODD!! i can't figure it out.

[LadyCatherine185]

My DS did exactly this when we were dealing with silent reflux. We tried Zantac and it did not work, so we tried Prevacid, and after 2 weeks the screaming and breast rejection stopped. He also nursed fine at night (with reflux, they are more relaxed at night and the reflux doesn't bother them as much). It could also be nipple preference for the bottles. I would stop those if you can.

[sahmmie]

I has this exact problem with two of my newborns. Both had severe reflux. Check out this website for information on infant reflux. www.infantreflux.org Good luck. I know how frustrating it can be.