Feeling guilty eating TF - Page 2

[chattyprincess]

Duh silly me...I also wanted to ask what you guys think of livers...I have never eaten them but hear alot of people mixing them into ground meat (great thinking!). I have always avoided them mainly because I was never raised eating them and because I thought livers unhealthy because they processed all the "junk" in our bodies. Is it safe to eat while pregenant? if so how much???

[crunchy_mama]

Good livers are amazingly healthy for pregnant women!

[Magelet]

seafood wise, there are a lot of different types that are very healthy. salmon, sardines, anchovies, these are all very very healthy fishes, and low mercury. I love occasional tuna, but probably wouldn't eat it hardly at all if I was pregnant. Not being pregnant, I don't particularly worry about the mercury, but then I do only eat tuna maybe once every couple months (its so expensive). Many fish are very healthy though, and there are all kinds of fish that I've never even heard of. I rely on my amazing local fish monger for help choosing fish both for sustainability and health.

I think shrimps are nutritional powerhouses, as are oysters (don't know about smoked) and clams, but not being able to eat shellfish, I never bothered to research it.


Yes, liver (and all organ meats) are nutritionally packed, and very good for pregnant moms as well as everyone else. Livers process the toxins out of the body, not storing them if they're working well, but because they do process the toxins, most people I know who eat liver try to get the cleanest type they can (ideally animals raised with plenty of outdoor space, eating their natural diet (also organic), or as close as possible to that).


I love adding milk and cream to my oatmeal. It adds fat and protein. (and most important to me, loads of yum factor). Or add some nut butter either in it, or on it. Or maybe have a little oatmeal, and an egg or some meat? Oatmeal is a very healthy food too, particularly if you soak it, so I wouldn't berate yourself for liking oatmeal. I'd just add in protein as well.

[chattyprincess]

Thank you so much...I am so lucky and found a women on craigslist with a farm who sells amazing quality meats and eggs!!! All free range/grass fed (and really free range, not the in a barn not in cages free range. Actually outside with a coop and in and out as much as they like!!!!) 2.50 a dz for eggs???? COME ON!! That rocks (thats the price of normal eggs up here in canada!)
I still am struggling with being scared about this highfat diet. I worry that it will adversely affect my weight. I do not weight in regularly and have not stepped on a scale in about 3 weeks. So I am intresed to step on one at the gym tomorrow and see where i am at...who knows!? I just want to be healthy and this lifestlye makes logical sense to me but completely grates against everything I have ever been taught!
I bought a ton of seeds/nuts today to make a trail mix to snack on.
The biggest struggle so far eating a high fat diet?? I am not that hungry?!? I eat breafast, no snack and am only mildly hungry for lunch, a tiny snack and am only mildly hungry for dinner?? Im eating a ton less and am now concerned that if I don't eat more I won't get in my daily friut/veg!!! AGH!

[Magelet]

if your eating enough high quality fat, you don't need as many fruits and vegetables, imo. Clearly people did fine with limited vegetables in their diets, since over much of the earth, for part of the year the only produce availible would be preserved produce such as sourkraut, and maybe what stored, some dried apples, potatos, carrots, but not much. Indeed there are places where people traditionally ate almost no plant matter year round (the masai, inuits,) either because it wasn't their tradition or there simply wasn't any.

Fat is so vitamin dense, its a much better source for some vitamins, such as fat soluble vit A. which is very hard to absorb enough from veggies but easy from fat.

If your really worried, see if you can substitute veggies for grains. It makes sense that you would eat less, because fat is rich and filling as well as being nutrient dense, and makes you feel fuller.

Can you tell I am of the personal opinion that the food pyramid 5 a day is crock? Then again, who can eat that much food? 11 servings carbs, 3-4 dairy, 4-5 fruit, 4-5 veggies, 2-3 meat, (plus its too low fat of course) my G-d that is a lot of food! IRT fruits and veggies, I think eat as much as you feel a need to, eat ones your craving, dark leafy greens are particularly healthy, and its better to have a veggie/meat diet than a grain/meat diet, but don't stress it. *shrugs* Fruit is good dessert or snack or breakfast, but definitely more of a treat food though a treat which can be consumed in huge quantities if you so desire.

[KarlaC]

Originally Posted by crunchy_mama

I think the excess carbs, grains and sugar are more likely to cause excessive weight gain than anything else. I try to eat pretty TF and high fat. I do NOT count calories at all- I think as long as you eat to satisfaction and eat healthy whole foods that your body will regulate itself. I am about at 38 weeks pregnant and have put on about 35 lbs- last I checked. I am generally a small person, so this amount of weight gain is perfect for me. I have good size babies- very healthy pregnancies(low bp throughout-90-100/60- no swelling- etc) and feel generally pretty darn good- well I am not running marathons The fats/good ones are crucial for babies development. I purposely try to eat a higher fat diet myself.

I agree. I was slapped with the GD label early on & I just ate a good healthy diet. I gained 11 lbs total & my son was a healthy 8lbs 3 oz. Granted I was already overweight to begin with but I contribute my eating lower carb/good carb foods(sugar & grains also) to not packing on a ton of weight.

I was eating something every 2 hours also.

[Surfacing]

What an amazing resource this thread is, thanks Chattyprincess for posting it to our ddc.

[FairyRae]

Originally Posted by Magelet

Fat is so vitamin dense, its a much better source for some vitamins, such as fat soluble vit A. which is very hard to absorb enough from veggies but easy from fat.

Maglet, do you have any links on this? I'm learning lots about fat right now (and thinking the diet you described of mostly fat, meat and veggies sounds ideal) and would just love to read more on this! I don't feel like I know much about the nutrient content of fats and I want to learn more...

[chattyprincess]

Originally Posted by FairyRae

Maglet, do you have any links on this? I'm learning lots about fat right now (and thinking the diet you described of mostly fat, meat and veggies sounds ideal) and would just love to read more on this! I don't feel like I know much about the nutrient content of fats and I want to learn more...

I agree!!! My bff and I were talking nicely about "fats" last night. She thinks you should eat lower grain/carby diet (not counting fruit/veg) and just the min. amount of reccomended fat. She is truly knowledgable about all things to do with diet but I agree with her that this is such a hard concept to wrap our thoughts around. It completely goes against everything we have been taught!!! She mentioned that the body goes into a state of ketosis with too much fat and that it just stores unused fat rah rah rah....
I feel like I am doing the right thing but I keep feeling like I am trying to convince people the sky is green!!
I have read the weston price and bits of nt but is there any other source you guys know off hand that talks about large levels of fat being good??

ugh...sometimes learning what is best is so confusing!

For those of you who experience weight loss etc, how long after starting tf was this??

[chattyprincess]

I am getting pregnancy brain quite early this time around me thinks!!!
I compelety forgot to add that my bff I was speaking too was going on and on about how important grains are and that they contain certain nutrients that we MUST have and not that we need to eat a ton but we do need to eat a few servings aday of them. I was just wondering what you guys all think...?

[crunchy_mama]

dietery fat does not equal body fat. I know it is hard when that is what has been spewed by nutritionist. Going more Tf and dropping the grains(and adding more fats) I don't know hardly anybody that doesn't have nearly automatic positive response. Seriously. Just give it a try. There is tons of evidence on this, will try to post some sources later. But again just try a couple of weeks and remember especially being pregnant you have to have plenty of fat- cannot repeat that enough!!!

[crunchy_mama]

and what nutrients would that be? You hear that all the time, but no evidence. Besides the fact that grains contain phytates that make it near impossible to actually derive these nutrients from them- properly preparing does surely help this, but doesn't erase this fact. There are however nutrients that cannot be gotten anywhere except from animal foods.

[crunchy_mama]

Wanted to add sorry for the grumpiness- I am not operating at full brain power- besides being nearly 39 weeks prego I got woke up after only about 5 hrs of sleep last night by a hotwheel hitting the floor!

I followed the Brewer diet w/ my first pregnancy, which certainly isn't low fat, but I was much more fat conscious then than now. I did the grains and all that because I believed that line as well, that I had to have them, they had key nutrients. I can say without a doubt my last 2 pregnancies were much better healthwise following a higher fat/ lower carb/grain diet. Most people that give up on this diet it is not because they feel bad it is because it is hard breaking habits. (although if you are a major sugar /carb addict you can have some issue the first little bit adjusting). Also, I gained 55 lbs w/ #1 and 35# last time and this time.

[FairyRae]

Originally Posted by chattyprincess

My bff and I were talking nicely about "fats" last night. She thinks you should eat lower grain/carby diet (not counting fruit/veg) and just the min. amount of reccomended fat. She is truly knowledgable about all things to do with diet but I agree with her that this is such a hard concept to wrap our thoughts around. It completely goes against everything we have been taught!!!

I do think the push towards low fat is the major problem in lots of low-carb diets, including *some* paleo diets. Lots recommend low fat, but that is what makes them hard to stick to (you never feel full then), and that has folks running back to grains and high carby foods (mostly improperly prepared as well). Fats are very satiating, and are essential to our physical and mental health, from what I've read...I too am interested in reading details about the composition of fats (what makes them so good for us) but I know from my own experience that I *feel* soooo much better eating lots of them.

Originally Posted by chattyprincess

For those of you who experience weight loss etc, how long after starting tf was this??

IME, dropping gluten (plus some other foods my ds was sensitive to) and moving to whole foods was life changing, and I dropped 50 lbs quickly. But adding in TF techniques and good fats and later dropping grains all together enabled me to maintain a really good weight for *me*. (Along w/ clearing up any digestive difficulties I had and giving me tons of energy!) Getting rid of gluten was a major part of this, along w/ other grains. I did notice a difference in my weight IMMEDIATELY when dropping most processed foods (anything, for me, that included gluten/dairy/corn/soy--due to ds's food sensitivities--I don't think these are all 'bad' foods, just things my ds couldn't tolerate--they are in most processed foods which forced us to go the whole foods route though). Adding in good fats has helped me to lose more weight and eat less in general just b/c I feel more satisfied. Like crunchy_mama said, just try it and see. Dropping or at least limiting grains is a big part of this though (at least IME).

Originally Posted by chattyprincess

I feel like I am doing the right thing but I keep feeling like I am trying to convince people the sky is green!!
I have read the weston price and bits of nt but is there any other source you guys know off hand that talks about large levels of fat being good??

I was looking for some more details on the nutrient content of fats and found this link: The Benefits of Saturated Fats. It is from WAPF, but lots of proponents of TF and paleo diets agree high fat is best for health.

I've been reading Mark's Daily Apple over the past few days and am loving it (thanks crunch_mama and Metasequoia!)--here is one of his pages on fats: The Definitive Guide to Fats

I’ve been brazen enough to recommend saturated fats, found in animal products and some tropical oils, as part of a healthy diet, and I’ll say it again. Saturated fats serve critical roles in the human body. They make up 1/2 of cell membrane structure. They enhance calcium absorption and immune function. They aid in body’s synthesis of the essential fatty acids and provide a rich source of fat soluble vitamins.

Along w/ those fat soluable vits I just read they also contain trace minerals. I'm totally into reading more on all this!

ETA: Chattyprincess, check out this thread: http://mothering.com/discussions/sho....php?t=1155598 Even if you just browse it, there are lots of really awesome links about fats and grains/carbs and human dietary needs...(it's been blowing *my* mind and has me in a posting/researching frenzy! )

[crunchy_mama]

Here are some pro-fat links for you- that ought to keep you busy a little bit:
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/07/ma...g-fat-lie.html
http://donmatesz.blogspot.com/search...s%20and%20oils (Matesz and his wife wrote the TF /Paleo book Garden of EAting- which is actually low fat, however he has now came out to say that the research doesn't back up the low fat diet )

More specifically about grains:
http://www.marksdailyapple.com%2Fwhy...2F%23more-8991
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-grains/

[Magelet]

I don't know about other online sources about fat's being more rich in vitamins, though that WAPF link is great. Besides the WAPF articles, and NT, I've learned most of what I know about TF eating and nutrition from my coworkers and bosses at Three Stone Hearth (including Jessica Prentice, author of Full Moon Feast), from the lovely mama's on here, and in the blogosphere. Its definitely not scientificly proven to stand up to any close examination under the standards of any science other than nutrition, but NOTHING in nutrition has been "properly tested" scientifically. TF eating has the advantage of relying on thousands of years of anecdotal research, though of course its not exactly the same as any traditional diet.

WRT grains, I would absolutely say that the idea that there is something nessicary in grains you can't get elsewhere is poppycock. Until agriculture, harvesting grains was INCREDIBLY laborious, and they made up a tiny tiny tiny portion of our diets, if that. And its well aknowledged that general human health plumetted when we began farming. (comparing hunter gatherers to farmers in any given area). the biggest dietary change was less meat and way way more grains.

[chattyprincess]

Hi all, I wanted to update this and let everyone know how its goin!! About 2 weeks ago I went to the doc and was weight I was 196 (shhhh I am 5'9 ) well the last 2 weeks I have had a sick kid (not been sick myself) so I have not been to the gym or active in any way besides at my house. The only dif Is eating (in my opinion) a ton more fat...You ready for it??? I weighed myself at the gym today (first time) and I was...YOU READY!?!? 189...thats right somewhere in 2 weeks 7lbs went somewhere...no idea where...so apparently fat is my friend. And let me tell you how luxious it feels to eat the skin of my chicken guilt free...YUM! Thank you all so much for all your support and information...I cannot believe so many people fight eating fat when results like this seem effortless...