If you don't EC... - Page 3

[Sk8ermaiden]

I don't mind diapers. In fact, I have a serious love of cloth.

We are out and about every day. I like to spend a LOT of time on the go. I don't see this being very compatible with full (or most) time EC, and when we are home, I am sleeping, cooking, doing laundry or cleaning. Usually when doing these things, the baby is either being worn (on my back) or hangin' in the pack n play, leaving virtually no time for part time EC.

I know it doesn't have to take over your life - I have a friend who offers her baby the potty before and after naps and before and after feedings, and she catches a lot and she is thrilled. I think that's cool! But I have no desire to exert that amount of effort.

I breastfeed, even though I hate every single minute of it and can only do it with gritted teeth. I do it because the benefits to my baby are too long to even list. I am not going to expend that kind of energy to do something else I would hate when I could just NOT, with no long-term ramifications for my baby. My mom says I potty trained in less than a week, with almost no effort from her. That sounds way more like my kind of deal.

And on a shallow note, the number of times I have seen a mom post about "missing" a cue while wearing the baby? That is a level of grossness I am not willing to accept. It makes me gag just thinking about it.

I think everyone has their hill to die on, and you have to work as a person not to be sanctimonious about it. Mine are birth and babywearing, and I try very hard to understand and accept others' points of view (which is what I think the OP is doing).

[Limabean1975]

I understand so many of the reasons to NOT do EC - I had many of those thoughts about it some years ago and did not do it with my first. But the one I don't get is the idea of it grossing you out...???? How is it gross to have your baby pee or poo in a potty or toilet instead of it - poo especially - being mushed all over their bum and genitals and being so, so much harder to clean up that the quick wipe post-potty results in?

[Sk8ermaiden]

It takes me no longer to wipe my baby during diaper changes than it does to wipe myself. It certainly is not so, so hard to clean up.

[Talula Fairie]

I think the accidents are gross.

I thought potty training was gross too.

[Limabean1975]

Originally Posted by Sk8ermaiden

It takes me no longer to wipe my baby during diaper changes than it does to wipe myself. It certainly is not so, so hard to clean up.

I didn't say "so, so hard to clean up" but rather "so, so much harder to clean up" - comparing poopy bum-wiping post-potty to post-diaper.

I just realized what you are all saying about misses being gross- does not apply in my house - baby wears diaper for back-up for sure! Prefold with a belt at home; disposables when out. I go through 2 disposables a day, most days, and maybe 5 or 6 prefolds.

[Talula Fairie]

Well I guess that wouldn't be as bad.

I was just thinking of the accidents my kids had when they were being potty trained. I swear nothing is grosser than a big pile of poop on your floor. *shudder*

I have a bleach/water solution kept in a spray bottle for a reason.

[MamaMelis]

Originally Posted by Limabean1975

I understand so many of the reasons to NOT do EC - I had many of those thoughts about it some years ago and did not do it with my first. But the one I don't get is the idea of it grossing you out...???? How is it gross to have your baby pee or poo in a potty or toilet instead of it - poo especially - being mushed all over their bum and genitals and being so, so much harder to clean up that the quick wipe post-potty results in?

I'm venturing a guess that (since I am assuming WE all poop or pee in a toilet, a majority of the time, anyway) that it is not the act of a baby defecating in a toilet that is disgusting or not attractive, but the idea of one doing it all over me, or my floor, or their clothes, or their sling, or their highchair, or their carseat, or their whatever you choose that is rather.......off putting.....to some.

And while I can see how EC'ing a newborn or even an exclusively breast fed baby may be relatively easy or relatively non offensive to ones sensibilities when a "miss" occurs, I do not feel the same way about a mobile baby or one who is eating solids.

[Limabean1975]

It is my impression that most ECers use diaper back up..babies aren't pooping and peeing all over the house. And it's not at ALL about letting them eliminate whereever they may be, my goodness, that WOULD be gross! It's about letting them eliminate in an appropriate receptacle, when possible.

[savithny]

Originally Posted by Limabean1975

I didn't say "so, so hard to clean up" but rather "so, so much harder to clean up" - comparing poopy bum-wiping post-potty to post-diaper.

I just realized what you are all saying about misses being gross- does not apply in my house - baby wears diaper for back-up for sure! Prefold with a belt at home; disposables when out. I go through 2 disposables a day, most days, and maybe 5 or 6 prefolds.

See, at that rate you're going through the same number of diapers I did with my baby. My first, especially, only went a few times a day.

I have read plenty of EC stories from people who don't use backup at home, and whose days seem to include cleaning 2-3-4 "misses" off the floors, rugs, and furniture. A diaper change seems preferable to me over trying to get a pasty toddler poop out of the braided wool rug.

[Sk8ermaiden]

I also agree that back up would seem the obvious choice, but that does not explain the number of posts I've seen about baby pooping in the Moby wrap.

And I agree - I go through 2 disposables and 6 CDs a day most days.

I do have a question though. My baby, for the first 2 months, peed all the time, but pooped when eating. Not before, not after, DURING. How on earth would you work EC with that?

[jessjgh1]

Originally Posted by Limabean1975

It is my impression that most ECers use diaper back up..babies aren't pooping and peeing all over the house. And it's not at ALL about letting them eliminate whereever they may be, my goodness, that WOULD be gross! It's about letting them eliminate in an appropriate receptacle, when possible.

Yeah, that. Some ec'ers choose to have a lot of nakey time, or not use diapers at all, others (like me) went through a lot of diapers(-;
BTW, I've read the Inuit culture relies on EC - despite the frigid temperature. Actually makes sense because using water to clean off a soiled child would be extremely chilly. Ecing (given the right clothing) makes a lot more sense in such extreme temps.
Jessica

[jessjgh1]

Originally Posted by Sk8ermaiden

I do have a question though. My baby, for the first 2 months, peed all the time, but pooped when eating. Not before, not after, DURING. How on earth would you work EC with that?

Some people would just nurse dc with a prefold on their laps, to catch the mess. My dd would wait till she was done nursing. Many seem to pause from nursing, and if you have a little pot there it really just takes a second (with practice) to have them eliminate over a small bowl or little potty. And I'm sure some people would just nurse them with the dc over the bowl if it seemed to always happen... but I'd also say that if you KNEW this was going to happen (edited to say: as in, it often happened) you would try to potty the child before nursing or offer a potty when you switch sides (if you do that) and associated it with a signal so that it might 'cue' them to go at a more convenient time.

I KNOW it (maybe) sounds crazy and maybe hard, but it really isn't as hard as it perhaps seems.

And honestly, if you break down all the 'cues' and tips and tricks of breastfeeding, it might sounds just as 'hard' or difficult as ec. Before I nursed I never thought I'd be nursing a baby SOOOO often, or having my breasts available 24/7 at a seconds notice, or all the crazy positioning things I had to try for months before it became second nature etc.

Jessica

[jessjgh1]

Originally Posted by MamaMelis

And while I can see how EC'ing a newborn or even an exclusively breast fed baby may be relatively easy or relatively non offensive to ones sensibilities when a "miss" occurs, I do not feel the same way about a mobile baby or one who is eating solids.

Actually, newborn poop (imo) is a lot more likely to be a big mess if you miss.
Toddler poop really isnt very offensive if it does not get squished... really.
I do think the ettiquette around ec is an issue and I tended to be on the cautious side... I bet there are many people that didn't even know I ec'ed even if I was 'doing' it right under their nose, so to speak.

I didn't want to be a pest and keep replying, but just wanted to answer a few questions that seemed to be put out there...
Jessica

[stiss]

Originally Posted by Limabean1975

I understand so many of the reasons to NOT do EC - I had many of those thoughts about it some years ago and did not do it with my first. But the one I don't get is the idea of it grossing you out...???? How is it gross to have your baby pee or poo in a potty or toilet instead of it - poo especially - being mushed all over their bum and genitals and being so, so much harder to clean up that the quick wipe post-potty results in?

Agreed. It did take alot of work, but I'm so thankful I don't have to wipe smushed poop off my kid's butt, nor worry about diapers when we go out. It totally fits into our AP philosophy, too. I'm actually kind of surprised at how many people are more mainstream in the pooping department!

[Sk8ermaiden]

Originally Posted by jessjgh1

Some people would just nurse dc with a prefold on their laps, to catch the mess. My dd would wait till she was done nursing. Many seem to pause from nursing, and if you have a little pot there it really just takes a second (with practice) to have them eliminate over a small bowl or little potty. And I'm sure some people would just nurse them with the dc over the bowl if it seemed to always happen... but I'd also say that if you KNEW this was going to happen (edited to say: as in, it often happened) you would try to potty the child before nursing or offer a potty when you switch sides (if you do that) and associated it with a signal so that it might 'cue' them to go at a more convenient time.

I KNOW it (maybe) sounds crazy and maybe hard, but it really isn't as hard as it perhaps seems.

And honestly, if you break down all the 'cues' and tips and tricks of breastfeeding, it might sounds just as 'hard' or difficult as ec. Before I nursed I never thought I'd be nursing a baby SOOOO often, or having my breasts available 24/7 at a seconds notice, or all the crazy positioning things I had to try for months before it became second nature etc.

Jessica

Thank you, that does make sense, and I appreciate the answer.

It also further drives home that for me personally, EC is something I would never want to do. 1) The grossness of dealing with bodily fluids, in the living room, while feeding her. And then having to wipe her, and then wash your hands, and then, lucky me, I get to endure the agonizing pain of latch all over again!

But it IS hard. Really, really hard, and time consuming. The kind of thing that I would rather not have to do. But it has such benefits I just could not NOT do it.

I really do get EC. I understand the closeness of paying attention to your baby's cues, and the fact that your baby doesn't have to sit in mess. But it just seems like such an ordeal (and the more people on this thread try to explain that it isn't, the more of one it actually sounds like). My poor baby will just have to live with being changed as soon as she's wet/dirty.

[Limabean1975]

I'm amazed to hear of babies who only pee 5 or 6 times a day - WOW! Any baby I've known has peed way more than that- but I have not been *that* intimate with very many babies. The 5 or 6 prefolds I go through in a day have one pee each in them - I probably catch another 8-12 pees, maybe more? Sounds like those 5-6 pee a day babies are holding it a long time! Or maybe my kids are just frequent pee-ers - I do remember changing DS's diaper much more often than his peers, and not because I was super-vigilant about it, but because they were soaked.

[Proudmom2Teeg]

I tried EC when my son was four months. I never was never successful and stopped after awhile. I was discouraged thinking there was no way I could do this. Since then I have on and off tried by just allowing my son to be diaper free around the house...Yes ALOT of messes happened. My son is now 7 1/2 months and just yesterday it seems to be working for us both. I only missed two pees today.... I am hoping I continue..My husband thinks I am crazy and hates when he pees everywhere haha...

[Sk8ermaiden]

Mine went through a dozen diapers a day when she was a newborn, but now she goes through roughly 6 a day with one pee each (and the nighttime sposies catch whatever they catch). Mine is a SUPERSOAKER though. She can flood a disposable and have it running down her legs. SO maybe she does hold it!

[lach]

Originally Posted by lizzylou

Maybe I am missing something, but I've never really understood the benefits of ECing. Honestly it seems kinda gimmicky to me... along the lines of "teach your baby to read." So that's why I don't do it - my baby will learn to use the potty soon enough, and I don't really want to bother with it.

This. I think it's totally gimmicky. It's a modern day "noble savage" myth, and that has always squicked me out (I wrote my thesis partly on the history of noble savage mythology in American popular culture). I don't believe for a second that anyone in rural China or wherever it is that EC is supposed to be emulating wouldn't jump at the chance to use disposable diapers, if it were offered.

Originally Posted by Theoretica

Honestly? I thought the progression of modern culture was such that we don't NEED to allow infants to poo and pee wherever, until we (or they) get the hang of cues and whatnot. Just because it's DONE in underprivledged areas doesn't mean we need to replicate it. JIMHO, there's something to be said for the benefits of increased sanitation and modern human waste disposal expectations. But that's just me.

And this. "Traditional" ECing involved a whole lot of babies still lying in their own waste. Just in the dirt surrounded by flies, not in a diaper that can easily be cleaned.

Originally Posted by Talula Fairie

To be perfectly honest, the whole concept seems ridiculous to me.

And the comparison to breastfeeding I find completely offensive.

This and this, too.

You're welcome to it, but everything I've read about it makes me either giggle or roll my eyes. Basically I find it a rather silly romanticizing of a past that never really existed. Call me ignorant or uneducated all you want, and I'll have to beg to disagree... but I'm good with diapers, thanks.

[mambera]

Originally Posted by Drummer's Wife

I'm too lazy! really.

also, I don't mind diapers (for the most part) so I'm not in a rush to have independently toileting little ones.

Basically, while the concept is interesting to me, I have zero interest in doing it with my own children.

ETA: oh, and cute cloth diapered bums!

All of those, with 'lazy' being the biggest one. Plus I agree with the poster who didn't want to interrupt other fun activities for potty trips.

Also I WOH and my MIL, who is our daytime caretaker, won't even use CDs (I buy sposies just for her), never mind EC. And when I am home I want to enjoy my kid, not be running her to the toilet every minute.

My son was a screamer when ever he was wet. I do think I'm more sensitive to this because it really upset him to be wet.

And yeah, my kid would never let me know she was wet or dirty - I just change her every 2 hours, or when she smells. She hates having her diaper changed but absolutely does not mind sitting in a wet one.

Nevertheless I agree that sitting in a dirty diaper is a nasty idea, so I give her lots of diaper free time (she plays on a change pad over a big waterproof sheet on the living room floor) and I change her frequently.

I definitely do not see any specific benefit of EC for the child in the long term. And in the short term, if the child could always go diaperless, sure you'd be less likely to get a rash - but from what I can see you have to use diaper backup anyway, or the kid sits in a mess in the Moby - which is way way worse than sitting in a mess in a plush absorbent diaper with a stay-dry inner. .

I don't see an environmental benefit of flushing over cloth diapers either, plus you either have to use backup diapers or wash lots of messes off your clothing, floor, and furniture all the time.

So I guess I see it as a personal choice of whether you'd rather have diaper-hassle or EC hassle. I prefer the diaper hassle.