Writing a paper

[crazyeight]

I am writing a philisophical paper on circ (anti obviously!). Yes this is a philisophical issue i figure since abortion is one suggestion by the teacher and ethics/morals are part of the debate not to mention the huge variable of the no right or wrong answer (well you know).

So I have these things to prove wrong so far:
Look like father figure
Cleanliness
Look like peers
Ignorance (ok i would rather have something else here)

I would like another 3 popular reasons of why people choose to circ plus if anyone has any specific supporting evidence (please don't link to papers that are similar to an opinion since i don't want to get close to plagerism! but med advice is very very welcome as well as a couple of PERSONAL (not friend of a friend of a friend) stories maybe?

I'm pretty sure this paper will practically write itself as I have a few of these things already started in my head but i need to "clean up" my whole thought process and provide supporting evidence.

Also if there are any FGM information I would like that too since I will also be equating that in my paper to RIC. Now I need a nice firey title.....:evil grin

I'll also be adding in the sensativity issue but not sure under which argument but I only have 1 or 2 very small links to info on this so more would also be welcome!

[Fyrestorm]

On MS boards I hear "it's ugly" A LOT

There is also the it's what Americans are used to argument

And the famous they won't remember/it doesn't hurt them argument

And lets not forget, it'll only have to be done late and it hurts more then lie.

[LaffNowCryLater]

I think most do it b/c "its ugly" or "dirty" but usually they won't admit that and will cite lackluster health claims to do it like penile cancer, STDs, and UTIs as a coverup for their true intentions.

[OperaDiva]

Definitely use the "it's healthier long-term" as one of the topics you prove wrong. My son could have died from a completely routine circ due to bleeding afterward, I posted the whole story here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1158645 Feel free to use my son as an example of why not to circ.

[QueenOfTheMeadow]

Just a reminder. Per TCAC guidelines:

The discussion of or reference to religion is outside of the scope of this forum. Any posts which bring any aspect of religion into the discussion are not appropriate and will be removed. Respectful discussion of a religious nature regarding circumcision, alternatives, etc. may be hosted in the Spirituality forum. The Spirituality forum is a debate-free zone. Members maintain a list of helpful websites in a Web Resources thread for further information about religious issues.

Thanks!

[SlackerDad]

These were especially insightful, I thought:

Quote:
Originally Posted by OperaDiva
I mostly lurk here, but just wanted to suggest another possibility for why a circ'd dad may want their son circ'd, as I strongly suspect this may be my hubby's case. His issue was not locker room teasing, but thinking that me not wanting our son to look like him meant that I was unhappy with how he looked. I love him, and have never been with an intact guy so it really is a non-issue to me, but guys are so sensitive about stuff like this, so I thought I'd mention it as a potential talking point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenP
Hmm, this seems to assume that when the man says "I want my son to look like me" that he actually, literally means he wants the kid's penis to look like his. Really, all the man means is "I want the kid circumcised, because I am."
To take it further, what he really means is, "If I do not circumcise my son, it means that maybe there is something wrong with circumcision, and since I am circumcised I cannot deal with that idea, so I will have my son circumcised so that I can go on believing that circumcision, and therefore my circumcised penis, is jolly good. Even better if, by circumcising my son, I can believe that he and I are part of a grand cultural and family tradition. Anything, just so I can continue telling myself that I am happy to be circumcised and never have to face the idea that I may be missing - or missing out on - something!"

It isn't actually about the looks. Just about making sure the surgery is done to the kid so that the dad can feel good about what was done to him.

Jen

As an intact man who has grown up in a generation almost universally circed, I can add that (a) the supposed locker room teasing never happened to me; and (b) the sensitivity issue is very much for real, even if the scientific data so far is slim. I can't even handle having the cloth from my underwear brush against me when I'm retracted, so that would seem to me to prove beyond doubt that circed penises must be less sensitive. Plus the kind of stimulation that feels really good to me is (from what I understand indirectly) much slower, gentler, and subtler than what circed men like.

[beru]

re: ignorance

Ignorance is relevant if you think about how parents (and healthcare professionals!) are ignorant of the complex physiological structure and function of the foreskin. One reason parents make the choice to circumcise their sons is because they equate the foreskin with a skin tag or mole. To them, it is valueless and insignificant. They can accept that the "benefits outweigh the risks" because they don't understand that the loss of the foreskin is the loss of a body part.

"It's just a piece of skin."

[crazyeight]

thanks all keep it coming!

beru~ ignorance is certainly valid but i'm trying to keep key points as talking points and i can throw in ignorance in ALL of it! i'll keep in mind the uselessness factor/skin tag type thing though.

slackerdad~ thanks for the quotes and your own info. having a little phycobabble in a philosophy paper is good right?!

opera and laffnow~ thanks for that info. i forgot stds, hiv, masturbation reasons.

now i guess i should actually start writing...

[PuppyFluffer]

There is the issue of bodily integrity and who owns the child's body - the parents or the boy himself? Is it ethical to perform cosmetic surgery on a non consenting child?

The ignorance of the functions of the foreskin are huge. Watch this video:
http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...o/prepuce.html
All you ever needed to know about the function of the foreskin!

[Ron_Low]

The main reason people give that drives me crazy is "Why not?"

And of course the answer is that it's HIS body, it's risky, and it's a valuable sensual organ.

[jessjgh1]

Let's not forget as a counter arguement that intact is actually doing NOTHING.

(This was prompted because of Ron Low's 'why not' for cirucmcision, and I immediatly thought... why? Because circumcision is actually surgery and intactness is just the default).

Hows the writing going?

JEssica

[crazyeight]

got started on my writing today and got 7 pages so far (double spaced) and my paper only has to be 5 pages so i am trying to wrap it up, reread and see if there's to much (if any) double subjects and rewrite anything to a more professional sound if needed. i'm really happy with the flow and how it's comeing out. seems like it would be a great semi quick read that touches on many subjects. i'm debating on whether to link it on my facebook (if it's possible) or what to do with it. my professor is actually asian decent and obviously he's pretty much the only one to read it unless i get it out there and it feels like such a waste.

[2lilsweetfoxes]

Upload it to your facebook after you turn it in and get it back. That way he doesn't put it against a "check for plagerism website" and it get flagged.

[crazyeight]

Well I finished my paper. It really only had to be 5 pages but heck...they aren't going to dock me for it right! lol. i hope the end is good enough. I was on a roll and wrote the first 7 pages in one day then had to put it off till today but it was wrap up anyways. Well crossing my fingers! Turn it in wed.

[beru]

sort of OT

Originally Posted by dhinderliter

Well I finished my paper. It really only had to be 5 pages but heck...they aren't going to dock me for it right! lol. i hope the end is good enough. I was on a roll and wrote the first 7 pages in one day then had to put it off till today but it was wrap up anyways. Well crossing my fingers! Turn it in wed.

I work in academia and it actually can be a negative to do more than asked. Instructors have to grade essays, tests and papers and if they get 7 pages per student when they were expecting 5 then that's potentially 40% more time grading papers. I have one friend in particular at Dartmouth who hates this. He doesn't dock his students grades but it does leave a bad taste in his mouth and he is more likely to sort of grade down that student with more subjective things. It's a massive pet-peeve of his. He feels these students are "not following directions". However, I know many professors are a lot nicer about it...