What to do

[DharmaDisciple]

For now my dd Jasmine (9) is in school and is staying till the end of her year unless she can't bear it any more. I know the Educational Welfare Officer (a bit like an educational social worker) will be looking at her attendance possibly wanting to meet with us as her vague stomach aches means she has missed lots of school.

Now I have to make a big decision about my son Theo (aged 5) and whetehr I want to really home educate him.

His class has 31 children and they have a waiting list for this popular small friendly school. If I pull him out to home educate him he will lose his place at that school probably forever and can never go back to this village primary school.

This is a bigger decision than I thought it was going to be! It is a one way decision. Theo really wants to be home educated, he really has not settled into school and asks me every day when is he going to be at home. I don't know whether to leave him in longer and see if he settles.

The only reason I can think of for me pulling him out and wishing I hadn't is for the reason of socialisation. I remember many nights looking at Jasmine sleeping (happily) and crying to myself because my choice to home educate her had left her socially isolated with just 2 friends, this was a big factor in sending her to school.

Now I see though she still has just 2 friends and a few playground friends but she sees no more out of school than she did when she was at home, school hasn't made that much difference as there are cliques in school that are hard to break into. Socialisation is a big factor when you live rurally generally but more so if you home educate.

He has 2 lots of Sunday school that he goes to and the local park where kids play. He has made some friends at school but think this will wane if he leaves.

I need to know Theo will have friends to play with his own age, schooled peers will forget all about him once he leaves the school. The homeschool group is 35 mins away and they meet weekly for some things, monthly for others. Jasmine never made friends there last time, even though we went to regular things the children always varied so although they played there friendships were never formed.

How do I make such a big decision? I don't have a deadline to make this decision but was thinking of pulling him out at Christmas. The school says I can apply for 2 weeks holiday leave to try home ed, but how can I make a decision in 2 weeks.

What do I do?

[Geerbabe]

I think most kids are fine with a couple of good friends. They don't need to be surrounded by dozens of kids their own age to be happy.

[pigpokey]

Mine are younger but it some ways it is really up to me how often they see their chums for unstructured play so that they can form true friendships. I have to do the inviting, cultivating, etc.

[Needle in the Hay]

I guess I don't see what's wrong with a young child having two friends. I don't see why that would be something to cry about at night (and I say this seriously, I'm not trying to poke fun at you).

I am not sure why a 9 yr old with frequent "stomachaches" and a 5 yr old who asks daily when he can come home need to be at school since you are willing to homeschool them. Obviously they don't feel that school is the answer (it's not clear that they even had a problem with their level of social activity).

I am also a little confused how a class of 31 is small, but I have the feeling that is because of missing info (like maybe there are 31 kids at his grade level but not all in one class).

I am only asking this stuff because it can help to talk it through. I'm guessing there must be more to it.

[seashells]

I didn't even know most girls had more than a couple of friends, whether they go to school or not.

What is socialization? It's the process of learning to interact with others on a social level - being empathetic, knowing yourself (and thus not being prone to do rash things to follow the crowd), doing and saying things that are helpful and interesting to others rather than annoying or destructive.

There is nothing about school that inherently teaches any of these things. In fact, there are ways that school goes against these things - peer pressure being a good example. Peer pressure isn't good socialization. Kids don't teach each other to be polite. Some teachers might, but if you're looking to raise polite kids, relying on a school teacher is a major gamble. They don't have much time to dwell on this. Kids don't teach each other to know themselves. Really, socialization is optimally done with a couple of friends and loving parents (you and the parents of the friends) guiding them to understand politeness rules, empathy, resistance to pressure, etc.

[DharmaDisciple]

Originally Posted by Needle in the Hay

I guess I don't see what's wrong with a young child having two friends. I don't see why that would be something to cry about at night (and I say this seriously, I'm not trying to poke fun at you).

I am not sure why a 9 yr old with frequent "stomachaches" and a 5 yr old who asks daily when he can come home need to be at school since you are willing to homeschool them. Obviously they don't feel that school is the answer (it's not clear that they even had a problem with their level of social activity).

I am also a little confused how a class of 31 is small, but I have the feeling that is because of missing info (like maybe there are 31 kids at his grade level but not all in one class).

I am only asking this stuff because it can help to talk it through. I'm guessing there must be more to it.

I think I cried when it all felt a bit too much, I thought school would be the answer but it is not.

I asked dd with the stomach aches (she has been checked by the Dr and is fine) if she wants to homeschool and we decided to leave her for a bit to see if she settles as she says she will miss her teacher and friends. I am hoping to pull her out at the end of the year unless we can't get to the bottom of the aches if so I will pull her out as she is fine at home. The school agreed to let her come home for her hour lunch, that seems to be helping.

You are right a class of 31 is huge. They have two teachers but Theo is overwhelmed by it all, he is very quiet and finds it all a bit too much. He hates the free play and would be very happy sat at his desk doing work, he loves doing work and they don't do enough for him there.
Thanks for your reply, it is helping me.

[DharmaDisciple]

Originally Posted by seashells

I didn't even know most girls had more than a couple of friends, whether they go to school or not.

What is socialization? It's the process of learning to interact with others on a social level - being empathetic, knowing yourself (and thus not being prone to do rash things to follow the crowd), doing and saying things that are helpful and interesting to others rather than annoying or destructive.

There is nothing about school that inherently teaches any of these things. In fact, there are ways that school goes against these things - peer pressure being a good example. Peer pressure isn't good socialization. Kids don't teach each other to be polite. Some teachers might, but if you're looking to raise polite kids, relying on a school teacher is a major gamble. They don't have much time to dwell on this. Kids don't teach each other to know themselves. Really, socialization is optimally done with a couple of friends and loving parents (you and the parents of the friends) guiding them to understand politeness rules, empathy, resistance to pressure, etc.

The children with the best social skills I have seen are the homeschooled ones by far. I love the way they converse with adults with ease and respect. My dd is a confident social child and was homeschooled for the first 8 years.

[DharmaDisciple]

Originally Posted by Geerbabe

I think most kids are fine with a couple of good friends. They don't need to be surrounded by dozens of kids their own age to be happy.

This is kind of the way I was leaning! My children are also very happy in their own company.

[DharmaDisciple]

Originally Posted by pigpokey

Mine are younger but it some ways it is really up to me how often they see their chums for unstructured play so that they can form true friendships. I have to do the inviting, cultivating, etc.

I have the phone numbers of a few boys in the village I am just worried the parents won't let them come round to play with the 'weird' family. But I know the onus is on me to help make the friends for them.

[Marimami]

I'm so sorry you're struggling with all this. For what it's worth, we had DD in a lovely, private, holistic school whose approach I agreed with in theory. It took me a while and a good bit of soul searching to realize that it just wasn't a good fit for DD. Her teachers didn't really see the issues I did, which made me question myself a bit. But, in the end I decided to really listen to DD, observe her behaviors, and go with my instincts.

We pulled her out of school in March, and my only regret is that we didn't do it sooner. Don't feel like you have to wait until December, or the end of the year. Those are somewhat arbitrary time frames based on your understanding of school breaks. But, it doesn't really matter to the kids in the big picture. I almost waited until the end of the school year, thinking it was only 3 more months, but I'm very glad we didn't wait.

Holli

[heatherdeg]

Originally Posted by seashells

I didn't even know most girls had more than a couple of friends, whether they go to school or not.

What is socialization? It's the process of learning to interact with others on a social level - being empathetic, knowing yourself (and thus not being prone to do rash things to follow the crowd), doing and saying things that are helpful and interesting to others rather than annoying or destructive.

There is nothing about school that inherently teaches any of these things. In fact, there are ways that school goes against these things - peer pressure being a good example. Peer pressure isn't good socialization. Kids don't teach each other to be polite. Some teachers might, but if you're looking to raise polite kids, relying on a school teacher is a major gamble. They don't have much time to dwell on this. Kids don't teach each other to know themselves. Really, socialization is optimally done with a couple of friends and loving parents (you and the parents of the friends) guiding them to understand politeness rules, empathy, resistance to pressure, etc.

... every word.

FWIW, my 5yo is a social ANIMAL and asks daily to go back to school (we pulled him Sept'08) because he believes it will be "playing with friends all day". But when in school, he's always the problem child and it was truly wearing down his self-esteem, confidence and mental health. I'll deal with the daily asking to go to school vs. what being at school would do to him long-term. And he has plenty of friends that he sees on a regular basis (several hours weekly)... it's just never enough for him.

[DharmaDisciple]

My worry is that I take him out and he won't have friends. Because the boys all hang out at school and make the deep friendships there, and the homeschool group doesn't seem to have many his age. We went to the homeschool group with Jasmine for years and she never made more than a passing friend. It doesn't help that it is a city group and they NEVER leave the city for the 30 in drive to our house for playdates.

I have the phone numbers of 6 boys from school who are Theo's age that I could keep in touch with and arrange playdates with, I just don't know if this will mean they will be his friend and reciprocate the playtimes. I know he will see them in the park in the Summer.

I worry that it will be us being at home in the day, then a couple of times a week seeing children, whether this will be enough for him.

[weliveintheforest]

Are there other community activities they can be involved in? Girl Guides/Boy Scouts, sports etc... they could meet other kids that way and even if they don't become best friends they will at least be socialising.

[DharmaDisciple]

He goes to Sunday Club, then swimming on Wednesdays, then on Thursdays he goes to Pilots (church run fun club) Next September when he is 6 he can join Beavers on a Monday (young cubs). They are all based in our village (except for swimming) so he will see children then. In Summer the park is always full with children.

[calynde]

Originally Posted by DharmaDisciple

He goes to Sunday Club, then swimming on Wednesdays, then on Thursdays he goes to Pilots (church run fun club) Next September when he is 6 he can join Beavers on a Monday (young cubs). They are all based in our village (except for swimming) so he will see children then. In Summer the park is always full with children.

My son is 7 and we homeschool in a place where essentially nobody else does, and I would say that you actually have a LOT of local activities! That's great!

I worry about similar things sometimes to be honest, but what I think it boils down to is how committed are you to home ed? If you feel in your heart and in your instincts that it's the right path for your family, then having to work a bit harder to find playmates/friends shouldn't be a deal breaker, IMO.

Every decision in life has certain advantages and disadvantages and this is no exception. I personally think the advantages to home ed far outweigh the downsides, but you do have to be dedicated enough to it in principle to be strong enough to ride out some of the more uncomfortable waves that come up from time to time.

You may have to work on cultivating friendships in creative ways, but at least they will be friends of your choosing.

Also, I wouldn't fully give up on the home ed group in your area. You never know what might come of it!

[DharmaDisciple]

I am committed to home educating, it is something I really want to do.

Unfortunately I try to cover all different scenarios before I take this leap and the biggie is the social aspect. Will my son have any friends to invite to his birthday party next year? WIll he care?

I have to say that in 2008 I spent over half the year in hospital and ds missed a lot of nurturing time, I think home ed would give him that time back and help him feel secure that mama is here and it is all okay.