I called the highschool....

[kathymuggle]

Mods: I am intersted in hearing what Hsing parents have to say - which is why I put it here instead of the school forum. I often wish there was a subforum where we could discuss crossover issues in HSing/ schooling - because sometimes people do have a toe or thoughts in both worlds.

I called the highschool. It has been on my to-do list for a couple of months. My oldest will be in grade 9 next year-definitely high school aged if he chooses to go. I did want some info from them on:

a) Can he be French exempt as he has never really had French?

b) What do they think of part time enrollment (DS likes drama quite a bit - and it is possible he may want to take a course here and there piecemeal)

c) Do they want to work with me to arrange cyber school (the path he is most likely taking - his choice - he wants a formal highschool diploma). If I go through through the school board they get funding. I can do this independantly if they do not want to work with me.

Well! Here are the responses - and I would love to hear your thoughts, particularly on number 2. Would this be a deal breaker for you? The lack of flexibility on their part is annoying. It is particualrly annoying in a high school situation where individual classes are quite independant of each other. This is mostly for conversation purposes - I am not distressed over anything this morning (had my coffee and the world is looking good). I am also quite aware that it is my son who has to decide whether these things are deal breakers as he is a teen, and morevoer we can fight them on any decision if that is what he wants.

Here goes:

1. He can be French exempt and they think it would be easy to arrange

2. He can not do part time. If he was "identified" or had health issues it is remotely possible he could do part time. I told them I know of kids who had been to both the public school and middle school in this board part time - and she said they most liklely were identified or had health issues. My son went to public school part time for a few years, and I know the kid who went to middle school part time, and neither are "identified".

3. Long story short she does not want to work with me to arrange cyber school. Her words: Most of their boards e-courses are only in grade 11 and 12. Yes, he can take courses from other boards but the spots are filled by kids in their board first. He may be waitlisted. Most people only take a course or two online- not full rosters! She had objections to other e-learning scenarios as well.

Basically she was so focused on her agenda (which was "get him into the brick and mortar school") that she did not hear me even though I was quite clear. Ds will do some classes through cyber school - if we work together your school will get some funding, if I enroll him entirely independantly you will not get any funding. Work with me, woman! I will not be suprised if she is banging her head against a wall after she has had time to process the conversation and realises I was trying to get her school money

[Ravin]

None of it sounds very surprising. Public schools can vary WIDELY in how much they're willing to accomodate part time and other flexible options. My mom had a foster daughter who need literally 1 class to graduate. She was pregnant, and seventeen, and the PS insisted she'd have to go full time for a year and just fill up the time with electives and study halls.

They found an alternative program in the next city instead. It required a 20 mile drive each way, but was a better solution than what the PS was willing to do.

Here, there are specialty programs, e-schools, and other options within the ps districts, I think largely because they have to compete with the charter schools.

[kathymuggle]

The irony is I expected to hear that French was non-negotiable, but that part time and cyber school were options (as both options get them money compared to straight HSing).

Kathy

[Geerbabe]

I notice that you are in Canada, but I'm not sure what province. In BC any child can register for one course at a time (or whatever particular courses they are interested in) for grade 10-12, since that is how the schools are funded. Some kids even choose to register with a couple of different schools. There is also a website called LearnNowBC that is set up to connect students with cyber version of any class they would like to take for free.

If you're not in BC, you might think about writing to your MLA and suggesting that they adopt a more flexible approach modelled on what BC is doing.

Cheers!

[Momma Aimee]

I see you are in Canada, I am iin the US -- but here we have an option called duel enrollment .. i child is homeschooled and enrolled.

Many kids do this and homeschool most or all acidemic, and go to school for say sports, band drama or art -- though some tike higher math and science that way too.

this does vary by local district.

I take it THAT is not an option as opposed to being a "part time student" which here would be more of as kid who is in public school and working the other part of the day as opposed to homeschooling the other part of the dy.

??

[kathymuggle]

Hi,

I am in Ontario.

If I remember correctly, part time enrollment is permitted by the Ministry - but whether or not to do it is up to individual school board and school.

The things is: I know this board allows it. It may be possible this school does not allow it - or it could be possible this is something the guidance counsellor said off the top of her head/or because that is what she wants me to believe

I know I can fight this, but part of me is irked I should have to . First impression is they are not particularly flexible - and do I really want to work with a school that is not flexible? Of course, perhaps I should not judge them based on one conversation - but it was with their guidance counsellor! Of course, DS does not know if he will take any courses in a brick and mortar school, so all of this may be a waste of time. I think he would like it as an option, though.

I will research dual enrollment in Ontario (and see if terming it dual enrollment instead of part-time schooloing would make a difference)

[ReadyMom]

My nephew, who is in high school, lives with me. The main thing I have learned in my years dealing with the schools is that schools are mostly interested in getting you to bend to their will and are not very interested in working together with parents. I think it's a symptom of crowd control. There is no room for individualization when you are trying to get hundreds (or thousands) of kids and families marching in the same direction.

[Callimom]

Originally Posted by kathymuggle

Hi,

I am in Ontario.

If I remember correctly, part time enrollment is permitted by the Ministry - but whether or not to do it is up to individual school board and school.

The things is: I know this board allows it. It may be possible this school does not allow it - or it could be possible this is something the guidance counsellor said off the top of her head/or because that is what she wants me to believe

I know I can fight this, but part of me is irked I should have to . First impression is they are not particularly flexible - and do I really want to work with a school that is not flexible? Of course, perhaps I should not judge them based on one conversation - but it was with their guidance counsellor! Of course, DS does not know if he will take any courses in a brick and mortar school, so all of this may be a waste of time. I think he would like it as an option, though.

I will research dual enrollment in Ontario (and see if terming it dual enrollment instead of part-time schooloing would make a difference)

Kathy, can you try another school, either in the public board or in the Catholic one? Part time enrollment is completely possible. I'd talk to the principal rather than the guidance counsellor if you can, or use another "in". Do you know any teachers? Or any superintendents? Or guidance counsellors in other schools?

Is there a reason your son wants to pursue the diploma? I still have those notes from that meeting with Sarah R I was telling you about and a diploma actually makes it harder for homeschoolers to get into university. (College in Ontario is another story).

Anyway I wouldn't give up yet, but there may be other ways to get what you want.

Karen

[kathymuggle]

Hi Karen,

He wants to pursue a diploma because he thinks it is necessary for college/University. I have told him I do not think it is - but I am just his mom and what do I know Moreover, it seems just so much more striaght forward to apply with a diploma and he likes that ease.

I think it may be usefull for my son (and I) to talk to actual admission counsellors at local univeristies (Carleton and U of O) to ascertain how easy or difficult it is to get in as a HSer without a diploma. Perhaps if he hears it from another source he will be more inclined to trust that HSers can go to Uni without a diploma.

I did get some notes from you once (and they were very usefull - they talked about PLAR and outdoor education opportunities - both of which I think we will use ), but I do not think I got any notes from a conversation with a Sarah R. If you still have them, I would love a pm!!!

Thanks in advance!

Kathy

PS. There are other schools in the area - I may have to drive him but that is OK. It will probably only be a course here and there. I can also request what we want (when/if the time comes) in writing to the principal. I think it is harder to turn someone down in writing.

[Callimom]

Hi Kathy - you can start here and I will see what I can dig out from my notes. There is tonnes of info on her site.
The short version of her talk was that an OSSD actually makes it harder for hsing kids to get into university because it basically lumps them in with all the other (schooled) kids and they compete for a spot on marks only. A non-traditional route (with some careful planning) can mean that doors are opened for the non-traditional entrance track which means less competition, and a more personal admissions process.

hth
Karen

[blessedmum]

I am from the US so I don't know if this would be an option for you, but When I was in HS I enrolled in Community /junior college at the same time. Do you have those? You get college credit while in HS. I left High school with all my gen ed credits and transfered out to a regular university. As a transfer student you don't even need things like ACT/SAT when you apply to a university/college.
Just a thought!

[Callimom]

Originally Posted by blessedmum

I am from the US so I don't know if this would be an option for you, but When I was in HS I enrolled in Community /junior college at the same time. Do you have those? You get college credit while in HS. I left High school with all my gen ed credits and transfered out to a regular university. As a transfer student you don't even need things like ACT/SAT when you apply to a university/college.
Just a thought!

It's harder to get into Colleges than Universities here as a homeschooler. There are people working to change this but at the moment this kind of arrangement that is common in the US isn't available in Canada.

[Satori]

Do you have the option for a virtual public school like we do here in the US? Or access to a public charter school that will allow you access to a virtual education?

I just did a quick google search and I don't know where your at in Canada but both are options in many parts of Canada.

[ollyoxenfree]

Originally Posted by kathymuggle

Hi,


I know I can fight this, but part of me is irked I should have to . First impression is they are not particularly flexible - and do I really want to work with a school that is not flexible? Of course, perhaps I should not judge them based on one conversation - but it was with their guidance counsellor! Of course, DS does not know if he will take any courses in a brick and mortar school, so all of this may be a waste of time. I think he would like it as an option, though.

You're right, you shouldn't have to fight. Hopefully, they are more flexible than they appear after your first encounter. The guidance counsellor and other administrators may need a little time to process your suggestions.

I recently went through something similar. I asked the high school if accommodations could be made for a student - independent learning, cyber-schooling, or some other curriculum modification. The answer seemed to be no. When I met with them again, and pointed out the advantages for everyone, they were at least willing to consider it. The situation is different, because by then, he was enrolled at the school and they recognized that he was bored in the regular academic classes. Since the excuse for teaching at a slow pace was that they have to teach to the struggling students, the obvious solution was to offer him a way to escape the class, but still do the work.

I'd try again, and talk to the principal. The principal may have a different attitude than the guidance counsellor. The guidance counsellor may change her mind once she's thought about it.

Ask them for their reasons for objecting. Tell them you would like their full list of anticipated problems. If they can only come up with lame reasons, they may realize on their own that your plan is workable and reasonable.

Do you know a teacher on staff who could help you advocate for the options he wants?

If they remain inflexible, that's tough. It will be frustrating for you and your ds. Your ds may not want to attend school if he's been present during your discussions with them, and witnessed for himself their attitude. It might change his mind about enrolling.

My other thought is that if identification will help your child manoeuvre in the school system, it's worth the time and money. If he is in a special education group, I'd get the identification for him if he's going to enter the school system.


Good luck.

[kathymuggle]

Originally Posted by Satori

Do you have the option for a virtual public school like we do here in the US? Or access to a public charter school that will allow you access to a virtual education?

I just did a quick google search and I don't know where your at in Canada but both are options in many parts of Canada.

I do. Here is how things are laid out if you want a Ontario secondary school diploma: (FYI for anyone in Ontario)

1. there is distance ed through the ILC. Most stuff is shipped through the mail - it is not on computer. It runs about $300 per year (plus mailing, I am sure). Pros: you can sign yourself up! There is great flexibility in how long it takes you to do a course, number of courses taken, etc. They find you proctors for any exams at higher levels. Cons: DS would probably prefer cyber school to distance ed with pen and paper. I have heard (through the online world) that ILC is not the best in terms of teaching or assignments

2. Avon Maitland. Pro: cyber school, free, has a better rep than ILC, has weekly online chats for students and teachers. Con: you need to register at your local school and work with local guidance counsellors, etc, to do this. Someone online hinted that you may be able to register directly if your local school is being a PITA, but you have to try them first. You have to arrange your own proctors.

3. Local Boards. Local boards are part of an e-learning consortium - but it seems (and I checked it out myself) most classes are for grade 11 and 12 students. They are for students who were in school - but need a few classes to graduate and have scheduleing conflict with the brick and mortar.


My preference is for Avon Maitland -at least for classes without examinations involving proctors.

My game plan at the moment is to try again with the local public school - with regards to finding out if very part-time enrollment is possible and applying to AvonMaitland through them. I am not sure whether to call and set up an appointment or simply write a letter (and I would like their response in writing no matter what).

I am becoming less and less convinced Ds needs a diploma to get into Uni -the site Karen mentionned upthread is awesome! - but I still see him taking some cyber classes and potentially wanting to try some classses at the local high school.

Ollyoxenfree: thanks for the advice on advocacy! It is not my strong suit...... (to me it is perfectly clear I am right and why isn't everyone else falling in line?). I may write down a few points beforehand if I meet with them so I can remember what I need to do/say.