Must military dependants be vax'd?

[isign]

My brother is in the Navy, and is out to sea. SIL took niece (almost 6m) to the ER (some of the details are sketchy, as told through my mother) last week. According to my mother, the ER Dr yelled at SIL for not having niece's vaxs up to date and even though niece was sick, they gave her a few. My mom is under the assumption that military dependents do not have a choice, but I thought it was only the member who must. I'm looking for some good simple info as well to send SIL about vaxing.

[true2Him]

I'm a military dependent, and we just stopped vaxing. I may get a questionable look here and there, but I haven't gotten any grief behind it. I even submitted my birth plan recently with NO VACCINATIONS written boldly across the top, and my ob/gyn basically told me the ped would want to talk to me about some of the things I was refusing. Other than that, I haven't had anyone but family members give me a hard time.

This is the Immunizations and Chemoprophylaxis regulations for vaccinations.
http://www.vaccines.mil/documents/969r40_562.pdf

I would probably file a complaint about the doctor's behavior. Yelling is not required to voice an opinion. If she felt bullied into getting vaxed, and the child had a severe reaction, what would happen? No one needs to be pressured to make those type of decisions under intimidation.

[isign]

Thanks. I skimmed through there - my munchkins are not wanting me to read too much right now and I didn't see much about dependents, except for this

Family members receive immunizations according to current ACIP
recommendations. The ACIP recommendations are available at the CDC Web site (http://www.cdc.gov/nip) or the
Military Vaccine Office Web site (http://www.vaccines.mil). In addition, family members may be subject to Service–
specific requirements/recommendations for immunizations applicable to the country in which they will reside
while accompanying military members under military sponsorship.

I don't know if that is to mean they MUST or just a recommendation. SIL has no backbone, but I wanted to pass info on to my brother who has enough for both.

[Hey Mama!]

Former military family here: No, dependents stateside are not required to be vaccinated. BUT, if they are going to another country overseas it was my understanding that if you wanted to accompany the military member then they may be required.

[isign]

Nope, they are stateside and have no orders. He's actually separating in the late spring. I am wondering if SIL mistook them saying that niece was behind as them really saying that they are in trouble and must catch up.

[Hey Mama!]

So no, she doesn't need to vax if she doesn't want to.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by Hey Mama!

Former military family here: No, dependents stateside are not required to be vaccinated. BUT, if they are going to another country overseas it was my understanding that if you wanted to accompany the military member then they may be required.

The only vaccinations required are those required by the host country. I do not know of any country that dependents can go to that requires visitors to get any vaccination for entry.

OP: Your SIL should file an ICE complaint about how she was treated in the ER.

"Remember that you can file ICE reports online for ANY bad and good experiences you have at any military facility (military doctor, the commissary, exchange, etc.). They will always follow up on your report and try to remedy the situation. The ICE system is done through DOD and stands for Interactive Customer Evaluation."
http://ice.disa.mil/

[treemom2]

I honestly just think it depends on the doctor and the installation. I have a friend who was told she could not come overseas if her children weren't up to date on their vaxes (she tried to claim religious exemption and was told she'd have to fight for it which could take over 2 years. . .and wouldn't be able to go overseas until then). However, another family might not have any problems when they go to the doc and try to get a religious exemption (I see threads like this all the time here on MDC). We are civilians so we don't have to have the medical check before coming overseas, but for entry into base schools we are supposed to have it. Once I took DS to the doctor. He had pneumonia. The doc found out he wasn't vaxed and went into a tirade about how I was going to kill my child, how many people she's seen die of VPDs (even describing some of the deaths in detail), how much harder it is to treat my DS because he wasn't vaxed (because she now had to think about VPDs), and how my DS might die. She lectured me for 20 minutes at least while my DS was having trouble breathing and was in such bad shape. The evening ended with her sending me to the local hospital and telling me she wasn't sure if DS would last the night (the hospital actually gave us some meds and sent us home. . .we had to go back 2 days later and have DS admitted but he was okay). We had another doctor here who insisted to know what religion we were since we said we had a religious exemption then when we stupidly told her she went on to say that she had once been that religion and there was nothing in their tenet about vaxes (but she never gave us a hard time except for that). Now we've gotten to the point that we tell all the base docs that we only discuss vaccinating with our doctor back in the states and that seems to work.

[nia82]

Total BS, family members do not need to get vaccines at all. We are active duty family members and there is no law - the active duty spouse signed up and his body away, but not his family! I have heard of a couple times when military doctors told families it is law and they have to, which is untrue and an utter and shameful lie. Your SIL should file a huge ICE complaint right away and make a huge stink about this. I would.
The base totally accepts my choice, they try to talk me into it every time I'm there but I ignore it. They never threatened me though nor told me lies about laws and stuff. Crazy.

[Hey Mama!]

Originally Posted by Emmeline II

The only vaccinations required are those required by the host country. I do not know of any country that dependents can go to that requires visitors to get any vaccination for entry.

OP: Your SIL should file an ICE complaint about how she was treated in the ER.

"Remember that you can file ICE reports online for ANY bad and good experiences you have at any military facility (military doctor, the commissary, exchange, etc.). They will always follow up on your report and try to remedy the situation. The ICE system is done through DOD and stands for Interactive Customer Evaluation."
http://ice.disa.mil/

I know, I guess I didn't convey that clearly in my last post. I guess I don't consider a family who is stationed in another country as a visitor but I'm sure I'm wrong. But, we did our overseas placement in Hawaii so I wasn't 100% sure on my info.

[bbrandonsmom]

treemom-I am so sorry you had to deal w/ that. If you could file a complaint, I would.
Op-she shouldn't have been bullied. Yelling-that's just wrong from the dr. And if the child was sick-he should have known better. It's right there in the AAP not to give a vax to a sick child, if that's what they go by.

[bubbamummy]

we are AirForce and have been stationed 'overseas' and in the US my son is 'selectively vax'd' with NO probs at all. Last time we went to the clinic they said 'Do you want him to get the Heb B vax' and I just said 'oh no thanks' and that was that. NO issues what so ever.

My friends kids (2 and 3 years old) have had ZERO vaccinations and she has had a letter from the clinic 'reminding her' but that is all. No real problems at all.

[nia82]

Oh yeah bubba, we get cards from them too. I got one for HiB and one for the flu... Saying my kid is eligible for it. I get annoyed, tear them apart and toss them. Oh well what a waste of taxpayer money!

[isign]

She's not at all wanting to delay/select/not do vaxs. She's not the type to do anything different than the way her mama did it - no Bfing, the list goes on. I just don't want her to rush into 'catching up' just because some nutcase Dr says she has to.

[wendy78]

We've lived in Korea and are now in Germany and neither of our children have been vaxed at all (ages 3 and 1). We've also been very blessed to never have an issue with it, besides some strange looks.

[isign]

I was able to get an email to my brother. He said that while he's not wanting to vax for everything, he can go to Captain's Mast for neglect. In VA, if I read right, there is only medical exception, not anything else. I do know he has had a really rough time with his commanding officer (not sure of what term they use). When his daughter was born, he had to have documentation from the Dr to give him any paternity leave.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by isign

I was able to get an email to my brother. He said that while he's not wanting to vax for everything, he can go to Captain's Mast for neglect. In VA, if I read right, there is only medical exception, not anything else. I do know he has had a really rough time with his commanding officer (not sure of what term they use). When his daughter was born, he had to have documentation from the Dr to give him any paternity leave.

It is not medical neglect ANYWHERE to knowledgeably not vaccinate your child.

The military cannot compel a member to vaccinate his children. I know someone on another board (Army-overseas) whose dh was threated with a Captain's Mast type thing, but they ultimately had to drop it as they had no grounds; she was ready to go to the IG.

An exemption is not necessary except to use certain military facilities (like DODS and the CDC), or, in civilian life, for school. VA does have a religious exemption option.

The Navy has been particularly hard on non-vaxing dependents this year; especially involving command sponsorship overseas. The Air force seems the most hands off except for childcare.

[elus0814]

My husband is active duty military and none of my kids have ever had a vaccine. I don't get flu shots (I'm allergic) and I have never had an issue with either. I did have one doc say a few sentences that politely conveyed that he felt I should be vaxing but it wasn't an issue. The ped we have now on base is very natural and she thinks it's great that we don't vax - she even yelled at the immunization people after I mentioned that they were giving rotovirus vaccines to parents to give their kids orally in the waiting room. It's a live virus vaccine!

It is correct that if dependents want to accompany their sponsor overseas they have to receive the vaccines required by the host country. I know Japan does not have any but I'm not sure about other countries. The DOD cannot force anyone to vaccinate but they do have the right to refuse use of services, like child care and schools. For a SAHM homeschooling family this would not be an issue but I could see it becoming one for a family that needs to use those facilities.

[buckeye_bebe]

The short answer to that is "it depends". A previous poster linked to the document we got from the CDC when we looked in to temporary on- and off-base drop-in childcare. If I want to use a CDC provider, my kid needs to get an H1N1 vaccination, provided by DoD. OH NOES WHAT WILL I DO! Just kidding. It depends. The religious exemption is somewhat difficult for some to obtain though. Depends on how nuts they go verifying the info in the forms and how they decide to interpret intent. I'll start vaccinating against largely seasonal issues when someone invents a vaccination for Thanksgiving Dinner or peppermint oreos. Or pumpkin/eggnog milkshakes. I'll vax for that.

[mntnmom]

NO!!! The military cannot REQUIRE dependents to do ANYTHING! They can however withhold certain benefits if you don't follow their rules. It is very difficult to use any CDC programs, or certain sport programs if your child is not up to date on their shots. But they cannot MAKE you vaccinate your child. I'm an "Army wife" of 8 yrs, and a former soldier myself. The military can bully, coerce and arm twist with the best, but if you are willing to forgo some of their programs and take whatever losses might come with that, none of their orders apply to family members.