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Must military dependants be vax'd? - Page 2

post #21 of 25
This is infuriating... That commanding officer is a bully and liar. Terrible to deal with.

I want to sum up what was mentioned here before. You only are required to vaccinate in the military if:

1) You go to a country that requires vaccines. I don't know any. Neither Japan nor Germany require any shots.

2) You want to enroll your child in base childcare or schools. There are however religious waivers that you can file.

That all dependents have to be vaccinated is an utter lie and does not apply, ever. This officer should be reported and a huge stink and complaint should be made immediately.
post #22 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by mntnmom View Post
NO!!! The military cannot REQUIRE dependents to do ANYTHING! They can however withhold certain benefits if you don't follow their rules. It is very difficult to use any CDC programs, or certain sport programs if your child is not up to date on their shots. But they cannot MAKE you vaccinate your child. I'm an "Army wife" of 8 yrs, and a former soldier myself. The military can bully, coerce and arm twist with the best, but if you are willing to forgo some of their programs and take whatever losses might come with that, none of their orders apply to family members.
Yep they sure can & do bully. We were "forced" to catch up on vaccines when coming here to Japan. We were moving to JP a couple of months after DH moved here & they absolutely would not sign off on our FEA/non-concurrent travel until proof of passports & updated shots were received. After fighting with them for a couple of months, we gave in & got the shots. As much as we didn't want all of the shots, being with DH was much more important for us since we had already lived without him for 3 1/2 years. We are also not a homeschooling family so the kids being able to attend DODDS school was also important to us.

It is beyond ridiculous to me that there as much bullying as there is! We've already filed many complaints.
post #23 of 25
Are you Navy? They are way more oppressive about that. And in the end they don't force you to get the shots, they will just deny command sponsorship. Sure, that means you cannot go to Japan or God knows where.
If they ever put us in that situation, I would find a doctor in Germany that helps me faking the records or I will call ACLU. As much as I hate that group, I wouldn't mind hiring evil lawyers, call TV stations and make such a HUGE stink that the military wishes they had never pestered us about it. I'm in PR, I know how to make a good stink. I don't care whether DH would approve or not - I am not military property nor their puppet.
post #24 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by DebraStorm View Post
We are also not a homeschooling family so the kids being able to attend DODDS school was also important to us.

It is beyond ridiculous to me that there as much bullying as there is! We've already filed many complaints.
DODDS has very clear exemption protocol.
post #25 of 25
QUOTE=nia82;14826571]Are you Navy? They are way more oppressive about that. And in the end they don't force you to get the shots, they will just deny command sponsorship. Sure, that means you cannot go to Japan or God knows where.
If they ever put us in that situation, I would find a doctor in Germany that helps me faking the records or I will call ACLU. As much as I hate that group, I wouldn't mind hiring evil lawyers, call TV stations and make such a HUGE stink that the military wishes they had never pestered us about it. I'm in PR, I know how to make a good stink. I don't care whether DH would approve or not - I am not military property nor their puppet.[/QUOTE]

If on base efforts proved fruitless I would file an IG complaint; contacting one's congressman has the same result (found that out myself once ) Dependent vaccination is not a requirement, only vaccines required by the host country (there are none), and if they made it a requirement that would certainly require a big stink involving the media.

One person here ultimately received a letter from the Navy that basically said that they just wanted to make sure sending unvaxed dependents would not cause an international incident, and her dh received orders for the overseas location that the Navy tried to deny them.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
VACCINATION STATUS: Command Sponsorship and Dependent Travel

Quote:
Originally Posted by mommyrn5 View Post
Because of the AFIs you posted, I was able to locate a few more AFIs. Everything I read said that dependents have to get whatever vaxes are required for entry into that particular country (Japanese Encephalitis for Japan, for example), but I couldn't find anything anywhere that stated a dependent's vaxes must be up to date in order to get command sponsorship or for the military to purchase the dependent's plane tickets. I also found, through my research, that this seems to be a common "threat" people are hearing lately. I am beginning to think that this is one of those things like people telling you your kids can't go to school without being vaxed. It isn't true, but people hear it, they believe it, they repeat it. But at the heart of it is a veiled attempt to scare people into vaxing their kids. I also finally spoke with someone at Outbound Assignments at the base. She said that if you get medical clearance, they cut the orders and buy the tickets. Since I went through the medical clearance process last year, I know that dependent's vax records aren't looked at in that process.

Thanks, again, for all the pubs you listed. They were a huge help!

Kathy
AFI 36-2110 Assignments
AFI 36-3020 Family Member Travel
AFI 36-2102 Base-level Relocation Procedures
AFCSM 36-699 Volume I

[DOC]

"Remember that you can file ICE reports online for ANY bad and good experiences you have at any military facility (military doctor, the commissary, exchange, etc.). They will always follow up on your report and try to remedy the situation. The ICE system is done through DOD and stands for Interactive Customer Evaluation."
http://ice.disa.mil/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
COMMAND SPONSORSHIP

www.48fss.com/DNN/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=AnFg2fIO99U%3D&tabid= 138&mid=711 -

FAMILY MEMBER SUITABILITY SCREENING
OPNAV INSTRUCTION 1300.14D. SUITABILITY SCREENING FOR OVERSEAS AND REMOTE DUTY
ASSIGNMENT
http://usmilitary.about.com/gi/dynam...s/1300.14D.pdf

DOD Form NAVMED 13001/2
http://www.med.navy.mil/sites/navmedmpte/nomi/swmi/Documents/Overseas%20Screening(Encl%204).pdf
http://www.militaryhomefront.dod.mil...NT/1601311.pdf

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

NAVY/JAPAN INFORMATION

I did a search on the mothering.com vax board for "navy"; just look for my responses... I think the first one has my general miltary childcare vaccination information; the second has Navy/Japan information.

Navy PCS 1

Navy PCS 2

Navy Search
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Quick update:
We just went for our overseas screening (VA to Japan). We sel/delay vax. We are Navy. We were told we HAD to get kids up to date on all vax per CDC/WHO recs or they would not sign the Form 1300-2 form for the immunizations. it was an Army reg (not sure which one - dh may remember) which clearly stated they must be current per the CDC recommendations.

Quote:

All that I have read up to this point said that the vaccinations are

recommendations (except those required by the host country, which there are none) and are not requirements per reg (though you can be denied assignment for any reason).

NAVMED 13001/2; it says that immunization requirements are "assignment specific" and "meet destination country requirements" (there are none required by Japan).

I've known at least 4 people on another are in Japan or going; and they are all Navy and not vaxing! Not all Navy dependents to Japan are being treated the same; at least this treatment is very recent (since about Jan 09). Oddly enough, though they cited an Army reg. I don't know any overseas Army dependents with this problem; it's just the Navy.

FAMILY MEMBER SUITABILITY SCREENING
OPNAV INSTRUCTION 1300.14D. SUITABILITY SCREENING FOR OVERSEAS AND REMOTE DUTY
ASSIGNMENT
http://usmilitary.about.com/gi/dynam...s/1300.14D.pdf


DOD Form NAVMED 13001/2
http://www.med.navy.mil/sites/navmedmpte/nomi/swmi/Documents/Overseas%20Screening(Encl%204).pdf

Be aware that the Army regulation sprung on Paniscus concerned DOD schools, CDC daycares, and other childminding institutions that had nothing to do with dependents getting a medical clearance for an overseas accompanied tour/ to deny a medical clearance for an overseas tour: (Army Regulation 40–562
BUMEDINST 6230.15A
AFJI 48–110
CG COMDTINST M6230.4F
http://www.vaccines.mil/documents/969r40_562.pdf).
It's like saying "you cannot include pianos in your household goods and this regulation, regarding pcsing with pets, backs up my statement."


___________________________________________


Advice from an Officer:


Quote:
I just hate being condescended to. But I know my rights, and for whatever reason, in the experiences I've seen with me and my sister, they tend to not try to push around officers/officers wives as much as enlisted. My sister said they tried fear tactics all the time with her when her DH was enlisted, but never when he was an officer. And having been enlisted and an officer, I've seen that as well.


Just don't accept that answer. I really don't believe that they can refuse to PCS you overseas because you or your children aren't vaccinated.



If this happened to me, this is the order in which I would take action:



  • Contact my DH's chain of command to see if they can work the situation
  • Then make an IG complaint if that didn't work
  • Write to my congressman if that failed
  • Lastly contact the media

http://www.cafemom.com/group/4388/fo...ext=11#replies
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