Observation/little known fact

[brant31]

In the dozens and dozens of events I've worked (baby fairs, health fairs, medical conferences) and literally thousands of conversations I've had about circumcision, one odd point keeps coming up over and over: the rate of circumcision among American doctors' sons is low. Like, really low.

I hear this from parents and very often from doctors themselves. The most common version is, "Our Ped remained very neutral on this until we said we weren't circumcising. Then he/she smiled and said good, I didn't have any of my sons cut either."

This data point seems to bear out no matter which way I look at it. Many doctors I speak with with insist it's up to the parents, then add that they didn't do it in their family. Among my intact peers, a disproportionate percentage are sons of doctors. All born right here in the US of A. I'd go so far as to say I suspect that doctors' kids have had one of the consistently lowest circumcision rates in the US, even over the period when circumcision peaked in the this country.

Is this just a case of "Do as I say, not as I do?" I don't want to impart mercenary motives to doctors (at least, not too much). But what is with this bend-over-backwards political correctness of MDs to appear "neutral" about circumcision, or toe the "company" line, when in fact their gut tells them something's not 100% with it and they wouldn't choose it for their own kids? I haven't noticed any such trend with vaccination, but definitely with circumcision.

So many parents have said to me how much it meant when their doctors told them that their own sons are intact. The validation is invaluable. Yet many (most?) of these doctors wait until after the poor parents say what they're doing.

I don't understand this phenomenon well, but how can we use it to our advantage? Formal surveys? Encouraging doctors to speak up more? If you look at the dramatic changes in NZ, Australia and Canada in the past 30 years on circumcision, it was clearly a combination of fundamental changes in the economics of circumcision combined with doctors coming right out and saying not to do it. Ditto the UK back in the 1950's.

And for those of you moms who hope your daughters will find a nice intact boy to marry -- check what his parents do for a living!

[FernG]

This isn't true in my social circle. I can think of 5 doctors with sons in diapers and every boy is circd. I'd love to see more statistics on this.

[tpintsch]

Hmmmm, you bring up an interesting concept. When my DS was a baby the ped. came in to give me going home instructions and when he asked if he was circ'ed and I said no, he looked visibly relieved and stated that I had made the best decision and none of his boys had been circ'ed either. I'm not sure why doctors (at least in my experience) try to stay so neutral and politically correct where circumcision is concerned. I would be very interested in seeing circ rates in baby boys with a parent in the medical community, though I image the data would be hard to come by.

[mslissa]

Interesting. My OB did not circ her son. My peri circ'd his first two boys but not his second two. My OB asked what we were thinking in terms of circumcision and then we had a frank discussion. She clearly didn't want to insult me if I had decided to circ, but seemed relieved that I was leaning against it. Even then, she did a pretty fair job presenting both sides. Once she knew that we weren't going to circ she said that she doesn't like doing circs and that she feel like she has to watch herself to not be too forceful in advocating against circumcision. My guess is that part of it is that doctors don't want to lose patients over the issue who are firmly on the side of circumcising their boys.

I really am appreciative that my OB shared her decision regarding her son with me. It really helped sway DH.

[LaffNowCryLater]

My friend's older sister is a pediatrician and even says it is a barabaric procedure, only a cosmetic procedure, etc but had a son and had him circd so he could look like his dad, a dentist :

[momasana]

Now that you mention it, the two doctors we have seen for DS (one ped, one family-medice) told us they had intact sons. We met the first while I was still pg and she handed us a brochure on circ-care and when we said we weren't planning to circ she said "Yay! Parents after my own heart". So, again like you mentioned, why did she hand us the brochure on circ first instead of literature or a talk about non-circ?

We found out from our second doc when she was examining DS for the first time. I told her very firmly and specifically that he was not to be retracted. She smiled and told us not to worry, her sons were intact and she knew not to retract. Whew!

Hmmmm....very interesting...def something to ponder....

[Fellow Traveler]

I have to say I get this impression too. I hear it too often to dismiss it as just hearsay. I doubt firm numbers are available. Having said that it's so irritating that they don't advocate more strongly against it.

[KaylaBeanie]

Circumcision came up on another site I frequent, and a girl(18 or so at the time?) from the USA, in a high-circ area, had no idea that Americans circumcised their sons. Her dad was a doctor, and none of the males in their family circ'd. Of course it's purely anecdotal, but it seems that in the 60's, 70's and 80's, most parents who chose not to circ were either medical professionals who knew how bad it REALLY was or hippies.

[Quirky]

IME at least the observation plays out. I know an OB who DOES circs and has two intact boys. I think they're too afraid of offending/losing clients to speak out, and have totally bought into the "it's the parent's decision and I shouldn't judge" rationale. Which begs the question of why they're not fulfilling their ethical duties to ensure informed consent.

[an_aurora]

Interesting. I know my pediatrician's son is circ'd but it was done at a bris.

Of the doctors at work, I haven't heard anyone say their sons are intact, but it's never exactly come up . We have one VERY circ-happy doctor and I'm certain his kids are (he's the one who had a patient decline the circ, and he told the nurses "oh that kid will leave here cut" ). One is from Central America and I think he's pretty anti-circ, although he does an awful lot of them (he's a NICU doc).

[Fay]

My MIL tells the story that she was given the choice of leaving DH intact or circ'ing him. She agonized over the decision and finally asked the doctor, "What would you do if he was your son?" The doctor answered that he would never circ his own son. My dH is intact as a result.

My OB is anti-circ AND vocal about it -- he actually told me that he refused to circ his son even though he himself was circ'ed as a newborn. Our ped is anti-circ, but she does them on request. I really wish more doctors would express their personal and professional opinions on the subject.

[graceomalley]

I know that my doctor's kid is intact - firstly because I babysat him from the time he was a couple of months old and secondly because my doc is extremely anti-circ, refuses to do them and is outspoken in changing the minds of parents who ask him to do it. But I'm in Australia, and I know the majority of doctors here are like that. Not all, but most.

[mama24-7]

Originally Posted by graceomalley

I know that my doctor's kid is intact - firstly because I babysat him from the time he was a couple of months old and secondly because my doc is extremely anti-circ, refuses to do them and is outspoken in changing the minds of parents who ask him to do it. But I'm in Australia, and I know the majority of doctors here are like that. Not all, but most.

another doc i'd like to clone multiple times & flood the US with.

sus

[lawmama1984]

One of the first discussions I had with a doc about circ'ing/leaving my son intact was with my OB...and all that consisted of was his nurse handing me a personal statement saying that he did not circ and why (the pain, foreskin being functional etc). I am not sure if he circ'd his boys, but I am forever grateful for this letter he gives to all his patients having boys.

[MommaLauraRN]

This definitely seems to be the case in the L&D unit I work on when it comes to OB/CNM providers and the RNs. There are many of us strongly opposed to circumcision, some more neutral but wouldn't/didn't do it to their own children, and very few that think circ is a good thing, or did it because they had a male partner who was adamant. The good news is, we discuss circumcision often at work, and the younger generation of nurses & residents is listening I can think of only one person of the entire group of nurses and doctors I work with who would ever make a statement in favor of RIC. We have another doctor who has been active in trying to get VT Medicaid to stop covering RIC. It's so nice to get to work with like-minded individuals!

[brant31]

Thank you all. So many healthcare professionals seem to be personally against RIC, even if they don't speak up about it to parents. My theory is that the present position statements from medical associations inhibit them from just coming out and saying circumcision is unnecessary and undesirable in newborns. Not that anyone is cowed, per se... just that the system works more smoothly if the majority sticks to the script, as frustrating as that seems with regard to RIC.

If the policy were to change next year to say "routine infant circumcision is discouraged in principle except in those rare cases of medical need", we would see a lot more medical professionals coming out of the woodwork and speaking out against it. I'll do a separate post on this later tonight.

This is why I think it's vitally important to work toward eventually getting the AAP and AAFP to move off the fence and just say that infant circumcision is contraindicated without immediate medical indication.

If anyone else has noticed this trend, please chime in.

[tlh]

I only knew 1 intact kid growing up and his dad was a Dr.