How do folks feel about Amazon.com?

[MaterBum]

I've read quite a few threads over the years here on MDC about why people won't shop at certain stores for pricing policies that hurt other companies, poor treatment of employees, and/or only offering mainstream made-in-China merchandise.

So my question is this: why is Amazon.com okay? Here's why I ask.

1. Price gouging. If you look at the holiday's top selling items (like Zhu Zhu pets and the Crayola Crayon maker, they are asking outrageous prices. Z Z's retail is around $9 each, but on there, they were asking 50 and 60. The CCM is normally 29.99, they have it for 59.99.) Why is this okay? At least other big chain stores have honored the actual price when they have them in. Am I the only one this price differentiation bothers?

2. My niece is the manager of a bookstore. Her biggest competition isn't the local Borders or B and N, it's Amazon. They charge a buck or two less, give people free shipping, and so our local book store is closing. Now, I get the temptation for saving money. BUT, this means fewer options to shop will exist and it means no local dollars getting spent and circulated. It means the quaint shop with comfy chairs to browse the books and special events for the kids will be gone.

3. The nature of the online store is that they can employ fewer people than a local brick and mortar store has to do. Plus, much of their merchandise is shipped from folks who are paying the costs in their community for their brick and mortar stores while Amazon profits from it.

I understand the idea of capitalism and free markets. I understand that some folks believe that if Amazon can get the price they ask, they are allowed to do so. I understand the idea that Amazon has done an impressive job from a business perspective. Etc. Etc.

But I guess I'm just curious to see why some stores are so bashed (just for the record, I don't shop there either) but this online powerhouse seems a-okay to so many? Am I the only one who is feeling uncomfortable with how large and all-encompassing Amazon is becoming?

[Porcelain Interior]

Originally Posted by MaterBum

I've read quite a few threads over the years here on MDC about why people won't shop at certain stores for pricing policies that hurt other companies, poor treatment of employees, and/or only offering mainstream made-in-China merchandise.

So my question is this: why is Amazon.com okay? Here's why I ask.

1. Price gouging. If you look at the holiday's top selling items (like Zhu Zhu pets and the Crayola Crayon maker, they are asking outrageous prices. Z Z's retail is around $9 each, but on there, they were asking 50 and 60. The CCM is normally 29.99, they have it for 59.99.) Why is this okay? At least other big chain stores have honored the actual price when they have them in. Am I the only one this price differentiation bothers? This is false. Amazon works a little differently than other online retailers. Zhu Zhu pets (we were going to buy one) were out of stock at Amazon, so when you put Zhu Zhu pets into their search engine alternative retailers came up. They were the ones price gouging.

2. My niece is the manager of a bookstore. Her biggest competition isn't the local Borders or B and N, it's Amazon. They charge a buck or two less, give people free shipping, and so our local book store is closing. Honestly they don't charge simply a dollar or two less, most local bookstores I've seen hover right at or under retail price. Amazon knocks no less that $5 off most titles. That's not a small difference, it's huge.Now, I get the temptation for saving money. BUT, this means fewer options to shop will exist and it means no local dollars getting spent and circulated. It means the quaint shop with comfy chairs to browse the books and special events for the kids will be gone. Borders has outrageous prices. Small bookstores often don't have the item I want or need, and honestly their prices are usually pretty high. I will pay a few bucks more for a book at a local shop, but I'm not going to pay $10-20 more.

3. The nature of the online store is that they can employ fewer people than a local brick and mortar store has to do. Plus, much of their merchandise is shipped from folks who are paying the costs in their community for their brick and mortar stores while Amazon profits from it. Many people in rural areas had no access to the variety of materials available from amazon or other online book retailers. It's definitely a double edged sword.

I understand the idea of capitalism and free markets. I understand that some folks believe that if Amazon can get the price they ask, they are allowed to do so. I understand the idea that Amazon has done an impressive job from a business perspective. Etc. Etc.

But I guess I'm just curious to see why some stores are so bashed (just for the record, I don't shop there either) but this online powerhouse seems a-okay to so many? Am I the only one who is feeling uncomfortable with how large and all-encompassing Amazon is becoming?

Amazon isn't ruining communities like Walmart is, and they aren't making the very poor and evil business decisions- like treating it's workers like dirt etc.

I can see being sad that the old days are gone- where you go down to the local shop and buy a book, but at the same time online retail has opened up so much information access that it's hard to really want that to go back to the way it use to be.

Megastores (online and brick and mortar) are what they are.

I use amazon for CD's and books most of the time. I get free shipping and I get everything I need all in one place at one time at the best possible price. (Unless you count half.com and eBay which are sketchy on supply.)

I also almost always walk out of a local bookstore having purchased something even though I know in my heart I'm getting ripped off (full retail price is a ripoff.) because I want the item and they have it.

Our local bookstores just don't have the variety I need or the prices that fit my budget to be a reliable source of materials for me. We use our library often as well because we can't afford the amount of materials we all blaze through, and many of my purchases are resource materials or reference books.

[PGTlatte]

I go into physical bookstores when I want the experience of browsing and maybe having a coffee in the cafe. But when I am seriously searching for a variety of books on a topic (for homeschooling or other), or want to buy a specific book, I go straight to Amazon. Their online database IMO is amazing. It works so much better than our library system's search system, or waiting at the book store for an employee to help me. And it has customer reviews, and it will link the books to both automatically-generated and customer-created lists of related books...in this way I can usually find a whole collection of books on the topic I want. I add them to a list I create for that topic, and then put them on hold through our library system. After reading the library's copy, if I decide I want to buy it, I can often buy a used copy, through Amazon ! When I do end up buying a new copy because it's not available used in a condition I want, I combine it with other items to get the free shipping. I also sell some of my own used books through Amazon's site. Amazon makes reading very convenient and affordable for us, and we end up using a lot more books than we would if I had to do it all through a book store or the library's search system. And I love the way customers get to contribute to the experience there, through reviews, Listmania lists, etc. When I find errors in listings, I submit corrections, and I have even sent in images of books for them to use in the listing when the image is missing. I also have some Listmania lists. Amazon feels like a cooperative experience to me.

To me, Amazon is doing much more than selling books - they are providing a service that helps people research books, save money, and also providing a marketplace for other businesses and individuals to sell in. I see quite a few used books businesses selling extensively through Amazon. I suspect those businesses would suffer if the Amazon marketplace wasn't available to them...so IMO Amazon is probably helping a lot of small businesses to succeed.

I don't see how a local bookstore can provide all of these things on the scale that Amazon can. IMO Amazon is the next step in the evolution of book selling. If I am going to go to a local bookstore, it is for completely different reasons than what I would go to Amazon for. It's for something I want to pick up today, or I want to look at calendars or journals or magazines, or to browse the bargain section, or take the kids to the story time, etc. The books marketplace has changed, to me in very positive ways, and book stores will have to adapt. They will have to provide more of the advantages that can only come from brick-and-mortar bookstores. I don't think the situation with Amazon is unethical, especially since they are providing a service that helps other businesses. It is just business evolution.

[cschick]

Originally Posted by MaterBum

I've read quite a few threads over the years here on MDC about why people won't shop at certain stores for pricing policies that hurt other companies, poor treatment of employees, and/or only offering mainstream made-in-China merchandise.

So my question is this: why is Amazon.com okay? Here's why I ask.

1. Price gouging. If you look at the holiday's top selling items (like Zhu Zhu pets and the Crayola Crayon maker, they are asking outrageous prices. Z Z's retail is around $9 each, but on there, they were asking 50 and 60. The CCM is normally 29.99, they have it for 59.99.) Why is this okay? At least other big chain stores have honored the actual price when they have them in. Am I the only one this price differentiation bothers?

Who exactly was asking the 59.99, though? I looked up Zhu Zhu pets on Amazon, and none of the listings I found was actually being sold by Amazon.com but by an online retailer with a "storefront" on Amazon. As far as I know, Amazon.com has little control over the prices those other retailers chose to list for. Looking at toy prices on Amazon tends to be a bad idea: when Amazon is actually the primary seller of the toy, I tend to find it's competitive with the b&m stores, but the "storefronts" are generally not worth buying from.

[~Adorkable~]

i wanted to add two things that have been kinda covered

i feel amazon provides a really open market, since they have a number of types of program for little folks to sell, and both new and used, this is great for lots of folks

also i have looked up how to get a small art catalog for a local guild out to the public and found the process of getting on amazon really reasonable and happy to hear that they give discounts for non profits and that the seller always determines the top price and if amazon decides to have a sale, they take the profit hit, never the 3rd party seller.

in general i think they have a good business model that does a balancing job and by having a gathering spot for big and small venders it lets the market work in a healthy way. and their shipping methods are very automated, but also employ tons and tons of folks is strange places, and those same methods make their job just the part that is human benefited rather than more drudgery.

all just my 2¢
i vote

[April Dawn]

I won't buy from Amazon - I stopped a couple of years ago when the Humane Society called for a boycott because Amazon sold dogfighting videos and cockfighting magazines. The Humane Society sued them two years ago over the issue and they recently settled. Amazon no longer carries the materials, but not by choice - the magazines folded. Here's more info: http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/...on_110909.html

However, I never liked Amazon even before that. They just see books as one more moneymaker IMO. As a librarian and bibliophile, I prefer to go to the library or to a small mom and pop bookstore - places where the people who work there live and breathe books, and really CARE about books.

[elus0814]

I really like Amazon. I shop on their site all the time for books and other things. I used to shop there occasionally until I moved this summer. It's now a 45 minute drive with three very young kids to get into town to a small bookstore and they frequently do not have what I'm looking for. I use Amazon for all kinds of things, including food by the case. They have hard to find organic food by the case at a really good price with free shipping. I pay per year for 'Amazon Prime' so I get two day shipping and no minimum purchase and if I need something the next day it's only $4 to have it shipped. We even made our Christmas list online through Amazon. In the past the kids got all kinds of stuff that they didn't really want and hardly used but this year we told everyone about the wish list on Amazon and the kids (plus DH and I) were given exactly what we needed and/or wanted. I agree with pp, it's not just a bookstore - it's a valuable service. I also like that ordering stuff is easy and I don't have to expose my debit card info to businesses, plus I don't have to create an account for every little purchase from a small online retailer. Amazon has saved me many hours of driving, many dollars in gas money, and hundreds of dollars with their lower prices. I would shop local if I could but I just can't see spending an entire afternoon driving and dealing with the kids then paying more for something, that's if they have it in stock, and that money is going to a national chain bookstore anyway (there are no mom and pop bookshops around here - I've looked). It's fun to browse the bookstore sometimes but unless I really want the item that day I just go home and check Amazon, 9 times out of 10 it is significantly less expensive on Amazon and I don't have money to waste on overpriced books - homeschooling is expensive enough.

[~Adorkable~]

Originally Posted by April Dawn

I won't buy from Amazon - I stopped a couple of years ago when the Humane Society called for a boycott because Amazon sold dogfighting videos and cockfighting magazines.

i think human controlled animal fighting for any reason to be one the most awful things anywhere.
With that in mind i might be able to still see what amazon did was fighting for what it sees as a 1st amendment right. i find it hard to believe that it cared that much over what was probably a tiny percent of a tiny percent of money it made off this 3rd party sales.
it may have been the wording or some other part of the case that they felt set a precedent that could be misused in the future.

i do not know the details and the wording of the case so that is all i'm going to comment and do not mean this to start a debate on any of it.
I say this only to share my feeling that i think places like amazon.com help to protect a open flow of ideas and first amendment rights, in that it's open to basically everyone and not subject to a small number of folks controlling what we have access to.
i think that is a great thing, independent of anything else about the company.

and i am glad that they dont sell that stuff, to me that is a sign that the whole system of laws and public conscience worked just the way it is supposed to in a society.

[~Adorkable~]

as i side note i just did a quick search and many The Humane Society things are sold on Amazon.com so that tells me that the can't complain too much about them being evil and much be ok at where things ended. if they dont think that , they should be the first ones to put their money where their mouth is.

[CatsCradle]

One reason that I like Amazon is that they do utilize vendors who otherwise wouldn't have a market without Amazon. I order a lot of limited edition and unusual art books from Amazon, and 99% of the time, the books are coming from independent dealers and Amazon acts as a go-between. I wouldn't have access to these books otherwise (unless I traveled far and wide or spent much time searching for sellers).

[treemom2]

I'm overseas on a military base (which has a US addy). I would love to shop from smaller vendors, but most of them charge outrageous shipping and their products are so expensive. . .and a lot of them won't ship to my address. Amazon ships to FPO addresses, offers the same shipping options they offer to stateside shoppers (which I don't understand why all businesses don't do this. . .I mean, it doesn't cost more to ship to us for a retailer. . .only thing is they have to fill out a customs form and ship USPS), has pretty good customer service when things don't get here.

[A&A]

The local bookstore had a book my dd wanted for 19.99. At Amazon, it was $11.59. That's over eight bucks cheaper.

We buy a lot of paperbacks from the local store but for hardbacks there's such a price difference we usually buy from Amazon.

[ecoteat]

I live in a rural area and it is usually pretty inefficient for us to drive to a store that may or may not even have what we are looking for. For Christmas shopping, the free trial of Amazon Prime was wonderful. We mostly use Amazon for things that we'd buy from a big box store if we lived near one. I'm a teacher and I buy most of my classroom materials from there because it is so much faster and easier than driving to the city. I love that there are so many thoughtful reviews on so many products. Even if I don't buy something from Amazon, I usually research options there first and read reviews.

[plantmama]

Over half the books I buy from amazon are actually sent to me from a small book seller somewhere else in the US. I buy books that are used and sometimes even out of print that I couldn't find at most bookstores.
We have an awesome used bookstore nearby but with three small kids browsing is impossible.
I have mixed feelings about amazon but like others have said most small, independently-owned bookstores that sell new books have very limited selection and high prices.
I still love used bookstores but amazon is where I shop for the most part if I have something specific in mind. FWIW I wouldn't actually buy the books I buy from amazon at a local bookstore. Unless I was very highly motivated, I wouldn't buy them at all.
I was checking the used bookstore first for awhile but it's not always possible.

[~savah~]

Originally Posted by CatsCradle

One reason that I like Amazon is that they do utilize vendors who otherwise wouldn't have a market without Amazon. I order a lot of limited edition and unusual art books from Amazon, and 99% of the time, the books are coming from independent dealers and Amazon acts as a go-between. I wouldn't have access to these books otherwise (unless I traveled far and wide or spent much time searching for sellers).

This is really true. There is a small children's clothing store in my town, owned by a midwife and her husband, that wasn't doing so well because of the economy. They started selling stuff like old books, records and trading cards through Amazon and according to her that is the only thing that is keeping them afloat.

[mlec]

I do tonnes of shopping through amazon.com. It's not because I particularly support their ideology (whatever that might be) but because I don't want to drag my kids around on errands, and then deal with them (gentle discipline of course!) in stores when I can research and purchase much of what we need from my kitchen.
I have found *awesome* stuff b/c of their recommendations (based on what I buy, wish list, and view). The reviews are enormously helpful. What can you tell about a carseat at Babies R Us? Very little! But on amazon.com you can read reviews of people who bought it, loved it, or hated it and then make a more informed choice.
Also I buy many many old out of print books from amazon marketplace vendors. I will choose amazon over abebooks.com b/c I get more points on my amazon visa, which means more refunds to my credit card. Great racket! But it helps me save alot of time and money.

[kriket]

I have been retailing for a grassroots gaming store on Amazon.com for over 2 years.

1. I don't think that the ZhuZhu thing is really price gouging. It happens every year with the "hot" toy. If people want to pay $60 for a mechanical rodent let them. I think we can really only apply the term price gouging to things that people need, like food or oil to heat their house.

2. saying you won't buy on Amazon.com is like saying you won't buy from Flea market XYZ. Most of the things sold on Amazon are really being sold by small sellers (like my company, there are a whopping 3 employees at my store, 4 at our retail location)

I can't speak to books, we only sell a few and can't really sell them because Amazon (the actual amazon) sells them for sooo much cheaper. Plus the markup on books from the publisher is so high. Talk to a Canadian about the retail on books. Now that the exchange rate is close to par with the USD the Canadian are getting totally taken on the price of books.

That's my $.02

[kriket]

Originally Posted by treemom2

Amazon ships to FPO addresses, offers the same shipping options they offer to stateside shoppers (which I don't understand why all businesses don't do this. . .I mean, it doesn't cost more to ship to us for a retailer. . .only thing is they have to fill out a customs form and ship USPS), has pretty good customer service when things don't get here.

For some odd reason recently the USPS program I use occasionally flat out tells me that it's not letting me ship an item to an APO. I don't know what that is all about but when you are trying to process 500 orders and one won't go through and you spend an hour trying to get it and end up going to the PO with the company credit card that your boss forgot to sign so you have to go back, get cash and try again the week before christmas you just yell SCREW THIS and stop shipping to APO

[katiesk]

i feel like they usually use an insane amount of excess packaging...

[JessicaS]

I buy things from them now and then, we go to the library and we also go to our local book store.

We go through a lot of books, my husband and I are both avid readers and we are homeschooling so we are always wanting more books. We do get things from amazon if we cannot find them at our local book stores. I do get free shipping at a lower price than from Rainbow Resource and if I forget to get something from RR then I order it from Amazon so I don't have to pay shipping. .

If I had to guess how much I spent at Amazon in the last year it would be about $100, but I spent more at Rainbow Resource and my local bookstores.