or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › Hatred of photo taking
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Hatred of photo taking - Page 8

post #141 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokering View Post
What do you mean, the "actual photo"? Nobody here's implying that the 4 by 5 glossy will emit death rays. But taking the photo, distributing the photo and displaying the photo can all cause an unwillingly photographed person humiliation, feelings of shame, betrayal and embarrassment.
Let's hope the OP's DD never gets arrested, especially as an adult. She'll have no choice about a photo then and it may well end up all over the internet on one of those "ugly mug shot" websites.
post #142 of 189
okay, let's go with the muslim women one because that seems closest to me.

surely, there is no inherent _harm_ in someone of the opposite sex seeing your arms and legs, right?

so, it's basically a personal boundary dictated by what the woman is comfortable with.

the op's dd doesn't want her photo taken because she is uncomfortable with it, not because she's trying to ruin christmas or make her grandma cry.

she's really and truly uncomfortable. does she have the right to not do something she is uncomfortable with?
post #143 of 189
Quote:
Let's hope the OP's DD never gets arrested, especially as an adult. She'll have no choice about a photo then and it may well end up all over the internet on one of those "ugly mug shot" websites.
...Yes...?
post #144 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlayaMama View Post
does she have the right to not do something she is uncomfortable with?
I don't think she has the right to prevent everyone around her from having pictures of her.

That's not reasonable.

It would be reasonable to put conditions on the photos. That's what my sister did. She required advanced notice with time and place to check how she looked and fix her hair. The OP's DD could put a limit on the number of photos taken or even saying only for big events like Christmas. Those things would show a willingness to work with the OP and the rest of the family. Those would be reasonable things to request.

But it is not reasonable to refuse or ruin all photos. That's extremely selfish behavior.
post #145 of 189
Quote:
I don't think she has the right to prevent everyone around her from having pictures of her.
Uh... WHY? I really don't get it. Should she also be forced to surrender her fingerprints, measurements, a lock of her hair and copies of all her school reports to everyone around her, should they deem them of sentimental worth? This is her body, her image. If she chooses to share it with other people, that's lovely, but I do not see how having photos of someone else is anything other than a privilege.
post #146 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
I don't think she has the right to prevent everyone around her from having pictures of her.

That's not reasonable.

It would be reasonable to put conditions on the photos. That's what my sister did. She required advanced notice with time and place to check how she looked and fix her hair. The OP's DD could put a limit on the number of photos taken or even saying only for big events like Christmas. Those things would show a willingness to work with the OP and the rest of the family. Those would be reasonable things to request.

But it is not reasonable to refuse or ruin all photos. That's extremely selfish behavior.
so, in other words, no? you do not feel it is reasonable for a 14 yo to set boundaries regarding something that makes her feel uncomfortable?

because your sister was able to work within this solution does not mean that everyone else will be okay with this compromise. i also think that there may be room for a compromise if it has been exhibited that boundaries will be respected.
post #147 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
I don't think she has the right to prevent everyone around her from having pictures of her.

That's not reasonable.

It would be reasonable to put conditions on the photos. That's what my sister did. She required advanced notice with time and place to check how she looked and fix her hair. The OP's DD could put a limit on the number of photos taken or even saying only for big events like Christmas. Those things would show a willingness to work with the OP and the rest of the family. Those would be reasonable things to request.

But it is not reasonable to refuse or ruin all photos. That's extremely selfish behavior.
Wow, so teens don't have the right privacy the same way an adult does? People sure don't have a right to your image if you're over 18, why would that be different for someone under 18?
post #148 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
Let's hope the OP's DD never gets arrested, especially as an adult. She'll have no choice about a photo then and it may well end up all over the internet on one of those "ugly mug shot" websites.
Huh? How this even remotely relevant to anything?

If you are arrested, your rights are curtailed. You have no control over your body. You can be strip searched if it's deemed necessary. Physical force may be used to subdue you if someone else determines it's necessary. Other people decide how much you have to pay to get out. You can't even go to the bathroom in privacy.

Please explain why what happens with police should apply to family life. It's a little scary to me that what happens when you're in police custody for allegedly committing a CRIME is compared to setting personal boundaries for yourself when they're not even remotely illegal.
post #149 of 189
Actually, could we please stick to the parenting aspect of this, since it's the Parenting forum, and maybe start a new thread for the rabbit trails? Thanks!
post #150 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by MusicianDad View Post
Wow, so teens don't have the right privacy the same way an adult does? People sure don't have a right to your image if you're over 18, why would that be different for someone under 18?
Actually, there's a whole paparazzi industry built up around the fact that, no, you don't have much of a right to your own image as an adult, if it was taken in a place where you don't have any expectation of privacy. But I'm not sure what that has to do with this thread. (And, no, there's no expectation of privacy when the whole family is gathered around the tree and Mom has a camera.)

And, no, teens don't have the right to privacy the way that an adult does. Because they're not adults. They're children. They're not little children, and any reasonable parent will give them an appropriate level of freedom and a reasonable amount of free reign to make their own choices. But for many good reasons, teens are not considered adults. Not legally, not socially, not developmentally, not practically, not culturally.

If my teen feels so strongly that grandma cannot, under any circumstances, have a photograph of her, she's welcome to get a lawyer and become legally emancipated. Which would kind of suck for her, because life in my family is a pretty sweet deal, so far as these things go. Otherwise, I would expect her to either buck up and act like a member of the family while she's living under my roof, or to work with me to get whatever emotional issues she has treated.
post #151 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by lach View Post
Actually, there's a whole paparazzi industry built up around the fact that, no, you don't have much of a right to your own image as an adult, if it was taken in a place where you don't have any expectation of privacy. But I'm not sure what that has to do with this thread. (And, no, there's no expectation of privacy when the whole family is gathered around the tree and Mom has a camera.)

And, no, teens don't have the right to privacy the way that an adult does. Because they're not adults. They're children. They're not little children, and any reasonable parent will give them an appropriate level of freedom and a reasonable amount of free reign to make their own choices. But for many good reasons, teens are not considered adults. Not legally, not socially, not developmentally, not practically, not culturally.

If my teen feels so strongly that grandma cannot, under any circumstances, have a photograph of her, she's welcome to get a lawyer and become legally emancipated. Which would kind of suck for her, because life in my family is a pretty sweet deal, so far as these things go. Otherwise, I would expect her to either buck up and act like a member of the family while she's living under my roof, or to work with me to get whatever emotional issues she has treated.
Not going to dwell on the celebrity issue since it's not on topic, except to say that its far more complex then "papprazzi take pictures of people, so there!"

To the bolded. First that is a very authoritarian approach, which is not something I believe in with anyone. Second, and I am saying this yet again, not wanting you picture taken doesn't equate emotional issues. All you can say for sure is that some who doesn't like getting their picture taken, just doesn't like getting their picture taken. Not everyone wants to be in front of a camera, and everyone does want to be able to set boundaries on their own body. It maybe your house, but it sure isn't your body or your image and not your final choice. You have no more control over your childs body then your husband has over your body.
post #152 of 189
My mil prefers not to be photographed, and mainly it is honored. I have a very very few pics of her holding various children, with her permission.
post #153 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latte Mama View Post
I just wanted to say that I can very much appreciate the sentiments of a BTDT mom with grown kids. Your perspective counts for a lot in my book!

ETA: I enjoy reading your posts for this very reason.
Thank you.
post #154 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by lach View Post
Honestly, if my adult children hold a life-long grudge because of the time I made them look halfway pleasant in a photo for grandma, they're probably not people I really want to hang out with. I'm being quite honest about that. I really hope to raise pleasant, rational, polite people who think of people besides themselves on occasion. I've worked with my fair share of adolescents, and I accept a certain level of attitude, snark, angst, and self-involvement as being developmentally normal. But sometimes it's time to buck up and do something for someone else. That's the way the cookie crumbles. I will be sorely, sorely disappointed in my parenting if I turn out an adult with such a complete lack of perspective, barring some sort of emotional or psychological issues.
It's interesting to me that some people take photos seriously enough to have all these strong feelings about the idea of not having them. It's also interesting that many of the people advocating forced participation are saying "what's the big deal, it's just a photo," yet clearly it is a huge deal to those same people if the would-be participant's desires don't align with theirs. What is the big deal?

I'm not that into photos, so if someone expressed a preference not to be in one that I was taking, I wouldn't even think much of it, let alone question their character. I can see how it'd be disappointing for several years to pass with one kid refusing to participate in all photos, but it wouldn't be the end of the world to me or cause me to question their moral fiber or label them as selfish/rude/emotionally disturbed. We don't take all that many pictures anyway, and our extended family appears to consider the ones we do occasionally send them a nice surprise, not an obligation that we don't fulfill often enough.
post #155 of 189
My MIL also does not like her picture taken. However, she is gracious and cooperative about it to a degree. She will allow her picture to be taken if she is given time to prepare for it before hand, and if you agree to delete any "bad" pictures of her, and still, then, only very few pictures. A couple for each vacation, a couple from Christmas. That's about it. She understands how important it is for the children to have SOME pictures of her and with her, though (especially since we know she may not be around much longer). IMO, this is the example of how a mature, gracious person handles a deep aversion to being photographed.
post #156 of 189
While I agree that it is nice if the whole family cooperates for a special event (including a photo), if one person feels very uncomfortable with the idea, to the extent of the OP's DD, then I would find another way for us to celebrate or memorialize a family event. There are so many ways, other than a picture, to do that - a poem, a note to the family, a collage of images that represent your feelings, etc. Something from the heart that represents who that person is. For some, it is indeed a smiling photo, for others it is not.

I can't imagine how putting another family member in a painful or uncomfortable position in order to get a "perfect picture" would make anybody feel good in the end. Yes, the picture may look nice to outsiders, but what it represents is, well, not so very nice or thoughtful. What a sad testament to "family love".

I do not have many photos of myself between the ages of 15 and 19. I do not feel bad about that. That was who I was at that time and because I was permitted to be that person, and not violated by my parents, I have good feelings about myself and happy memories. I still do not like to have many photos of myself taken - it is just not something that I feel comfortable with at many times. When I feel like it, I do photos, when I do not feel like it, I do not. I am an otherwise well-adjusted adult - a good mom with a good marriage and good career. Right now my DD is quite the "ham" and loves to be photographed - some are hammy posed smiles, some are goofy, some are natural. Would I be sad if she did not want her photo taken? Yes, of course - I LOVE looking at all her photos. Is it worth to me to force the issue and cause her discomfort and resentment? NO WAY - her body, her image, her choice!

That said, if I felt that the refusal to take photographs was a manifestation of something deeper - depression, anxiety, etc. - I would focus my attention as a parent on the root issues to help my child feel good about themselves. Back to the OP, who alluded to potential issues, I would put the idea of photographs aside (and not even try to cajole her into a more "creative" approach to photos) and let my child know that I would support them no matter what and help them to heal themselves and get outside help if it was needed. That is not about photographs or not for grandma, that is about mental and emotional well-being which trumps everything else.
post #157 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post
It's also interesting that many of the people advocating forced participation are saying "what's the big deal, it's just a photo," yet clearly it is a huge deal to those same people if the would-be participant's desires don't align with theirs. What is the big deal?
The "what's the big deal" is about the simple chore of sitting and smiling-- maybe even taking a little longer to prepare for photography if you feel more comfortable doing that. That's not a lot to ask of someone who doesn't have mental/emotional disabilities.

Having photos for memories IS a big deal to an awful lot of people.


OP, I know I felt really ugly when I was 13-15. My mom took me to get a haircut and it was awful and I felt even worse. None of my clothing looked good on me because I didn't know how to dress my newly changing body type and still look trendy. I was petite and a little bit chubby, so teen clothing just didn't fit me well. I SO wish someone had taken me in hand and given me a total makeover-- taught me how to dress, helped me choose a cute and functional wardrobe that fit and was flattering-- including shoes, helped me with a hairstyle and knowing how to care for it, and makeup. This might not apply to your daughter at all but if it does-- well it's an idea.
post #158 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by amma_mama View Post
I can't imagine how putting another family member in a painful or uncomfortable position in order to get a "perfect picture" would make anybody feel good in the end. Yes, the picture may look nice to outsiders, but what it represents is, well, not so very nice or thoughtful. What a sad testament to "family love".
This is what it all boils down to, to me.
post #159 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by LionTigerBear View Post
The "what's the big deal" is about the simple chore of sitting and smiling-- maybe even taking a little longer to prepare for photography if you feel more comfortable doing that. That's not a lot to ask of someone who doesn't have mental/emotional disabilities.

Having photos for memories IS a big deal to an awful lot of people.
So the feelings of the people who don't want to be photographed (and for whom it is a big deal to be forced to do it, whether you believe it or not) don't matter. The feelings of the people who want the photos do matter.
post #160 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by EFmom View Post
So the feelings of the people who don't want to be photographed (and for whom it is a big deal to be forced to do it, whether you believe it or not) don't matter. The feelings of the people who want the photos do matter.
Yeah, I just don't get it. I guess not really caring about pictures just makes me unable to understand how this could be a hill-to-die-on issue for some people.

Having photos just has never been a priority for me. Maybe this is partially influenced by the fact that I know someone who places a giant value on having the perfect photo, and spends her entire visits with my kids sticking a camera in their face, trying to get them to reenact cute moments, screeching at them to smile, etc., instead of creating meaningful memories with them. I err on the side of leaving the danged camera in its case and just experiencing moments, or maybe journalling about them later if I want to capture them (and, sure, sometimes snapping a photo, but only with willing participants). Maybe I err on that side too much, but in any case, photos just aren't a very important thing to me, so labelling a kid or forcing her to sit and give a fake smile just aren't things that would ever occur to me.

I like for photos to capture reality, and right now the reality for this girl is that she doesn't want to be in photos, or wants to hide her face if she is in photos. So, cool, there'll be a family record of that for people for whom that kind of thing is important.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Parenting
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › Hatred of photo taking