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Hatred of photo taking - Page 4

post #61 of 189
She's gone now. She doesn't mean forced as in threatened, she means it should be expected. But no suggestions as to how to accomplish this from her.
post #62 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porcelain Interior View Post
Yes. It isn't about her thinking she looks bad in photos, it's about control and her not wanting her photo taken period. She ducks and covers her face every single time. In previous years we've used real live animal props (her cat for instance lol) in the family photo, or we've allowed her to be in profile so she doesn't really have to smile. Now it's no photo period.

She takes my camera and deletes ANY and ALL pictures of herself.

Rewards and bribing have never worked with her.

She's 14 btw, and this photo-aversion thing started gradually when she was in the 6th grade.

She's very stubborn. If she doesn't want to do something it's not happening.

She hates any attention being drawn to herself, she's an introvert and it's getting more pronounced the older she gets.

I guess I allowed it at first out of respect, I certainly don't enjoy people taking my picture when I'd rather not be in one.

Seems I've created a monster, as she doesn't feel obligated to ever be photographed.
Ahhhh. She's 14. Well, she's old enough to cooperate. Period.

Personally, if she is ruining family photos - I would give consequences. You know, like "dd,you need to cooperate with me and smile for the photo. You will need my cooperation later, so let's do this for each other." If she can't cooperate, then give a consequence.

Also, my dd (also 14) wanted to disagree over what to wear etc in a family photo I was paying for. We have this photo done every 5 years or so. I told her straight up I was paying for the photo, she needed to suck it up and wear the outfit I picked out.
post #63 of 189
I don't have time to read this whole thread right now, but I wanted to post my reply.

First of all, I know what you mean because my husband is a photographer and my son is sometimes very tired of being a subject. And he is ALWAYS a subject. But that's understandable. My suggestion to you would be to buy her a camera and then don't mention it again. She will surely start photographing herself; kids can't seem to help hamming it up!

And if she's grumpy in photos, so what? That's her honest feeling at the time the photo was taken. Maybe she resents being asked to "perform" and display a certain emotion when it's not genuine.

My second suggestion is to treat it as a business transaction. Honestly. Say that you value having family photos (and drag out the scrapbook to show her the photos you DO have and show her how nice it is), and say that you understand she doesn't enjoy doing it that much, but that you'd pay her to be a model. Agree on a set "modeling fee" and just pay her. Seriously! Why not? I have done that with my son. He gets over it pretty fast and now doesn't charge us. I think I bribed him with a quarter once (he is 6) and he never did collect. But it's a way to show respect and give her a chance to get something out of it too.
post #64 of 189
I'm astounded by the people who think this is something to punish your child over because she doesn't like having her personal privacy invaded.

It is not like eating your vegetables in the least. There are no known health benefits to being photographed against your will. Personally, I make memories through experience, not through a viewfinder.

If you don't have family memories without photos, I find that very bizarre. My mother was very seldom photographed--her choice, and I have many, many memories of her.

If at some point your dd regrets not being in family photos, oh well. That's just a natural consequence of her own decisions.
post #65 of 189
Oh yes,and the longer people pressure her and make a big deal out of it, the longer her resistance is likely to last. In other words, you could try just taking the year off from mentioning it AT ALL. Then she's likely to just naturally forget the resistance. But seriously....because all these other folks have a huge EMOTIONAL stake in it, I bet it's affecting her ability to have a relaxed clarity on the subject.
post #66 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by EFmom View Post
I'm astounded by the people who think this is something to punish your child over because she doesn't like having her personal privacy invaded.

It is not like eating your vegetables in the least. There are no known health benefits to being photographed against your will. Personally, I make memories through experience, not through a viewfinder.

If you don't have family memories without photos, I find that very bizarre. My mother was very seldom photographed--her choice, and I have many, many memories of her.
That's lovely for you, but not everyone has the same experience, or the same good memory you do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EFmom View Post
If at some point your dd regrets not being in family photos, oh well. That's just a natural consequence of her own decisions.
Which would be fine if the world revolved around the DD. But my understanding from the OP and her updates is that these photos were to be mailed to grandma. This isn't just about the DD, it's about her being part of a larger family and having to do something that should be completely innocuous (causes her no pain, requires absolutely nothing from her except to act normal) but that she doesn't want to do, either because she has emotional problems that need to be worked through or because she's being rude.
post #67 of 189
Thread Starter 
Wow this thread is like a mushroom! Very hard to keep up with it grew overnight.

Just a few comments from me the OP...

*I never said I don't have memories if I don't have photos, to the pp who said that, that's just a weird sort of thing to say. Believe it or not some people enjoy family photographs- especially years down the line when you hit generations that didn't get to meet older family members and want to put a face or a place to a family story. Not necessary, but still beautiful and worth saving.

*My daughter is possibly on the spectrum, and we're in the middle of counseling and trying to find out how to make her quality of life (anxiety/depression/introversion) better, or if she's actually happy and really does just want to be left alone. We're totally on top of this and making sure she's provided with an environment that's conducive to her personality and respectful of her choices as far as how she wants to live her life- while also trying to maintain family harmony. She's not in any way a brat. She does have a selfish bent, and she's very private. She's always been odd when compared to her peers. This probably is the root of her unhappiness, that she is not accepted. We've worked hard to meet her where she's at and to accentuate and celebrate her differences, not try and tamp down on them or change them.

The photo thing is just one of the pieces of the puzzle we've been "puzzled" over because it's not just about her.

Anyway this is a good discussion and ya'll can continue discussing it, I'll keep reading. I've already made my mind up though and will not push any photos for the time being.
post #68 of 189
I'm stunned by the number of people who think it's fine for someone to refuse to be photographed for years.

They've already spent years dealing with this. I think that catering to it for another year is entirely the wrong approach. The girl needs to grow up and figure out that it's not all about her.

I'm really impressed at how much patience the OP has already shown. That approach obviously isn't working. So, I think it's time for a more direct approach.
post #69 of 189
Well, I'm surprised at the number of people who feel it's ok to force someone to have their personal boundaries violated just because they want a picture.

It's not always about being rude.

It's not always about having self-esteem issues.

Sometimes it's just about not wanting people to take your picture, and forcing the matter will only make it worse. She will either learn to deal with sitting for pictures eventually, or just opt out of any future photos. What I don't get is that most of us wouldn't force an adult to have their picture taken if they didn't want it, but we think it's ok to force a teenager.
post #70 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
I'm stunned by the number of people who think it's fine for someone to refuse to be photographed for years.

They've already spent years dealing with this. I think that catering to it for another year is entirely the wrong approach. The girl needs to grow up and figure out that it's not all about her.

I'm really impressed at how much patience the OP has already shown. That approach obviously isn't working. So, I think it's time for a more direct approach.
I hate being photographed. Absolutely hate it. I don't have "emotional issues." I'm a well-adjusted, highly successful professional and am raising a happy well-adjusted family. I'm not "on the spectrum." It just feels like an intense violation of my privacy to be photographed against my will. Being photographed is not completely benign. It is a violation.

Nobody has any "right" to have pictures of me. Nobody. If my parents had forced me to have pictures taken when I was a kid, that would just have made me resent them and would not have made me feel more positive about being photographed.
post #71 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
I'm stunned by the number of people who think it's fine for someone to refuse to be photographed for years.

They've already spent years dealing with this. I think that catering to it for another year is entirely the wrong approach. The girl needs to grow up and figure out that it's not all about her.

I'm really impressed at how much patience the OP has already shown. That approach obviously isn't working. So, I think it's time for a more direct approach.
So it's all about her because she doesn't want her picture taken. I'm guessing she doesn't care if other people are getting their picture taken. A good part of it is about her because it's her body and face that is going to be in the picture. Sometimes the picture taker needs to realize it's not all about them and accept that some people just won't ever consent to having their picture taken. And you know, the person refusing doesn't even need a reason, let alone a good one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigerchild View Post

Other people don't have the right to your body. They don't have a right to the image of your body either.
That right there is the issue. No one has the right to force you to do anything with your body, including let it be photographed.
post #72 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL83 View Post
I'm stunned by the number of people who think it's fine for someone to refuse to be photographed for years.

They've already spent years dealing with this. I think that catering to it for another year is entirely the wrong approach. The girl needs to grow up and figure out that it's not all about her.

I'm really impressed at how much patience the OP has already shown. That approach obviously isn't working. So, I think it's time for a more direct approach.
It IS all about her. Her body. Her right to do or not do what she wants with it.

And also it's only not working because the OP was still puzzled by it and trying to work through her love and obvious want to work with her daughter with her want to include her in things like scrapbooks and be able to send pictures to Grandma.

Not being in scrapbooks/photo albums is a natural consequence to not having your picture taken. If I didn't want my picture taken I'd accept that as the consequence. As for Grandma, again she has no "right" to have pictures of her grandchild. None. Would it be nice? Sure, I'm not saying she wouldn't like one. But she is not owed one.

So actually it IS working if the teenager feels her boundaries are being respected and everyone else can get on board with the natural consequences of this and agree to not be thrilled about it but also not push what isn't going to work to be pushed anyway.
post #73 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by philomom View Post
I've worked hard as parent and I deserve to have a few pictures a year of my children as they grow. This does not make me a bad parent in any way, shape or form. There are a handful of things that a child should just buck up and do for a loving parent. Really.
I agree.

I haven't gotten through the whole thread yet. Have we discussed what dd says about WHY she dislikes having her photo taken? If you have right of veto over pix you really consider bad, what is the harm? I understand that she really hates it, will do anything to stop it - but why? Even if she is on the spectrum, can it really be THAT upsetting to her that as a 14 year old she can't find SOME time/way to let her mom have a photo of her? Alone without others watching? With a beloved pet or playing guitar or something she enjoys but not having to look at the camera?

Sorry, off to finish the thread... But OP, I really understand being extremely sad about not having photos of dd1. And I understand feeling it is unfair to photo document dd2 but not dd1. But it isn't your fault that dd1 is so anti-photo, and it isn't dd2's fault either. I'd still make scrapbooks of her, because it really wouldn't be ok to ignore her childhood in pictures because her sister is against pictures.
post #74 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porcelain Interior View Post
Anyway this is a good discussion and ya'll can continue discussing it, I'll keep reading. I've already made my mind up though and will not push any photos for the time being.
I think this is a very wise and respectful decision, and while it is sad that you won't have the photos that you would like, your willingness to respect your daughter will probably result in a better relationship in the long term, and you will probably get to see HER more often.
post #75 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by EFmom View Post
I'm astounded by the people who think this is something to punish your child over because she doesn't like having her personal privacy invaded.

It is not like eating your vegetables in the least. There are no known health benefits to being photographed against your will. Personally, I make memories through experience, not through a viewfinder.

If you don't have family memories without photos, I find that very bizarre. My mother was very seldom photographed--her choice, and I have many, many memories of her.

If at some point your dd regrets not being in family photos, oh well. That's just a natural consequence of her own decisions.
It may not be important to you. That's probably why you didn't post a question about what to do if your child didn't want a photo taken.....

This is apparently important to the OP and she posted to get some feedback on how to handle this. So we did post a few responses....
post #76 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porcelain Interior View Post
*My daughter is possibly on the spectrum, and we're in the middle of counseling and trying to find out how to make her quality of life (anxiety/depression/introversion) better, or if she's actually happy and really does just want to be left alone.
My dd (that responded) will be pleased to hear that.
post #77 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by NellieKatz View Post
Oh yes,and the longer people pressure her and make a big deal out of it, the longer her resistance is likely to last. In other words, you could try just taking the year off from mentioning it AT ALL. Then she's likely to just naturally forget the resistance. But seriously....because all these other folks have a huge EMOTIONAL stake in it, I bet it's affecting her ability to have a relaxed clarity on the subject.
Yup, absolutely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EFmom View Post
I hate being photographed. Absolutely hate it. I don't have "emotional issues." I'm a well-adjusted, highly successful professional and am raising a happy well-adjusted family. I'm not "on the spectrum." It just feels like an intense violation of my privacy to be photographed against my will. Being photographed is not completely benign. It is a violation.

Nobody has any "right" to have pictures of me. Nobody. If my parents had forced me to have pictures taken when I was a kid, that would just have made me resent them and would not have made me feel more positive about being photographed.
Yes and yes. As I've experienced first hand, like I said earlier, some of the family members who always tried to take my picture and force me when I was young is still someone I don't really talk to or see.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MusicianDad View Post
Well, I'm surprised at the number of people who feel it's ok to force someone to have their personal boundaries violated just because they want a picture.

It's not always about being rude.

It's not always about having self-esteem issues.

Sometimes it's just about not wanting people to take your picture, and forcing the matter will only make it worse. She will either learn to deal with sitting for pictures eventually, or just opt out of any future photos. What I don't get is that most of us wouldn't force an adult to have their picture taken if they didn't want it, but we think it's ok to force a teenager.
Yeah, that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porcelain Interior View Post
Anyway this is a good discussion and ya'll can continue discussing it, I'll keep reading. I've already made my mind up though and will not push any photos for the time being.
That's an excellent decision. I agree with this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by rachelsmama View Post
I think this is a very wise and respectful decision, and while it is sad that you won't have the photos that you would like, your willingness to respect your daughter will probably result in a better relationship in the long term, and you will probably get to see HER more often.
We are very respectful of our kids and their personal boundaries, and our grown, 21 yo. has moved out, but she's home several times every week. She also had a period in her teens when she didn't want to be in photos, we respected that, didn't push it (and didn't allow anyone else to bug her or push her) and she got over it eventually. And even gave us some pictures she had taken of herself with her own camera in that period. And since there was no issue over it, it's nothing she resents us for. I can only imagine that she would have moved out earlier and not been home as much if we had not respected her like we did.
post #78 of 189
I'm glad to hear that you're working through whatever issues she may or may not have. Hopefully you'll be able to shed some light on whatever's going on with her that is making her this unhappy.

Someone earlier mentioned a 24yo old brother who flips the bird at cameras: I've known a few guys over the course of my life who think it's absolutely hilarious to do this, and I absolutely guarantee you that no one finds it amusing or quirky to ruin other people's photos. These guys (it's always guys, in my experience) tend not to be particularly well-liked or fun to be around, except as party-hard frat boy types. I think it's a good idea to figure this out now, because what's acceptable as teen angst on a 15yo is considerably less acceptable on a 20-something. So if it's something she's going to grow out of that's fine, and if it's something that she won't grow out of for whatever reason then she can at least get a diagnosis and you can all work on things.
post #79 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by rachelsmama View Post
I think this is a very wise and respectful decision, and while it is sad that you won't have the photos that you would like, your willingness to respect your daughter will probably result in a better relationship in the long term, and you will probably get to see HER more often.
:
post #80 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by MusicianDad View Post
What I don't get is that most of us wouldn't force an adult to have their picture taken if they didn't want it, but we think it's ok to force a teenager.
Yes, but the OP is not talking about some random adult.

It's her child, who she is raising. There's lots of things you wouldn't force an adult to do - that argument doesn't really apply. If an adult came over and trashed my house, I wouldn't make them clean it up, I just wouldn't invite them over again. I'm raising my kids, though, so I need to teach them how to behave.

I think the OP sounds like she's on top of the situation and handling it beautifully, but for the sake of the larger argument I want to say this.

This doesn't sound so much like it's an issue of having oneself photographed, but of teaching children that they are part of a family and, as such, have some obligations that might occasionally make them uncomfortable. I want my children to learn this. I want them to know that even though they think their great-grandparents are kind of scary-looking, they still have an obligation to act as politely as they can as is appropriate for their age/development. It's kind of the same, I think.
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