It didn't FEEL gentle... What should I have done?

[swd12422]

DS just turned two, and is in the hitting/kicking when he doesn't get his way phase. When he hits me, I hold his hands down and tell him "no hitting/be gentle" and sometimes when he's frustrated he'll say to me "no hit" instead of/before actually taking a swing.

Last night, we went out to dinner and DH ordered fries. DS will not eat ANYTHING but fries if they're on the table.... I had his plate and was trying to put on tomatoes and chicken from my salad, but he kept yanking the plate away to shove at DH for fries. I told him to wait, and he just wouldn't. He started crying, hitting, trying to fling the plate all at once and I finally got tired of struggling with him. (It had been kind of a struggle at the table before the food came: throwing his snack cup and water bottle, hitting, etc.) After telling him AGAIN that we don't act like that in public and no hitting, I started to lose it, so I scooped him up and carried him outside.

By this point, he was crying. We were both frustrated. I sat him down on the bench and told him we could go back inside when he was finished crying and ready to behave nicely. Then I took a few steps away to let him calm down. He didn't. He kept crying for Daddy, so I went back to him and repeated that we wouldn't be going inside til he was calm. He finally calmed down a little bit after I picked him up, but he really wasn't listening to me. He was just focused on getting back inside for some fries.

How on earth do you get through to a 2 year old??

We did go back in and I just kept reminding him to be nice. We finally got through dinner with DH bribing him with fries. (As in, "Eat more chicken and you can have a fry." repeated several times.)

The crying and frustration didn't feel gentle, and the bribery didn't feel like we were setting ourselves up for good model parenting. But what should we have done differently to make it better?

[ann_of_loxley]

Lol - you will probably get many different replies on this!...
You might even end up sighing and thinking 'so much to remember!'....

I am by far not perfect but this is what I would have done:

For starters - I would never bribe with food. I would never bribe at all. Its manipulative. I feel it teaches our children to 'behave' and 'please us' for selfish reason (get the goody!). I remind myself that I want my son to do the right thing for the right reasons. (for me, this has led us to consensual living but I know that is not everyones cup of tea here and that took us time to get there - baby steps! lol) It teaches them how to be manipulative as well (well if mummy wants this...shell have to do this for me first...). It can also create food 'issues'. Something you really don't want as that can set them up for life.

Second is positive phrasing. This takes practice. Stopping before you speak ...but over time it gets so easy! That is - don't use 'don'ts' lol...'Yes!' phrases is what we are after. Instead of things like 'Don't act like that in public' (which IMO is a bit of an arbitrary comment for a 2 year old)...you can phrase that in a positive 'yes' sort of way - tell your son what he CAN do instead of what he 'can't' do. We sit in our chair. We place our cup down gently. etc. Its simply how the small childs brain functions - they hear the last part of the sentence, not the first. They don't hear the 'don'ts' lol. So if you are saying 'We don't act like that in public' - they are hearing 'act like that in public!'... I am doing exactly what you are telling me mum! lol

Be realistic of age and capability. This does not mean that you have to self sacrafice and never have any fun. But it may mean that you arn't going out to eat at posh restaurants for awhile and pick somewhere less comformed if you do want to go out. Its important to look at other factors of the behaviour - not just the behaviour. Children at this age act on impulse and those are often led by nature...hungry, tired, bored, overstimulated, etc. Work with that. Okay, its just before nap time - probably not the best time to eat out. Or perhaps you could bring a snack (and a book or a toy, etc - all handy things for such a small child in a public setting that requires quiet and patience lol) if you know you will have to wait awihle until the food arrives and you know your child is hungry, etc. And - if you know your son will only eat 'fries' and nothing else...don't create battles. Either, don't order them or accept thats what hes gonna want. This is why we don't keep yummy crap in our house because I know as soon as we bring in a box of chocolate in, neither DS or I will want to eat anything else until its gone! lmao I model healthy eating by doing - at 4 now, he has pretty good self control.

And Validate those feelings! I feel this is so important at this age because if anything else, its a super emotional age. Never shame or make a feeling 'bad'. Crying is okay! - In fact, we should do more of it in our culture! Some children may need taking outside to help them calm down - but this still requires you. Maybe sitting next to them with some simple eye contact or a cuddle, etc. 'I can see you are feeling very upset'... A child at this age can't 'talk about it' really - but they will get there. For now, you can just fill in for them. 'You are so frustrated right now that you didn't get a lot of fries!' ...and then help them come up with solutions. This might be a personal one. If I wanted my son to eat more healthy and perhaps not have any fries - we wouldn't be eating at this place... But since I am actually okay with this, my suggested solution might be to get him his own fries. 'Shall we order you some of your own fries?'. You could even take this time to apologise if thats what you feel like. 'I am sorry I shouted at you - I love you and we don't shout at people we love' ...or whatever! We are only human! Its perfectly fine to show our children this as well!

Once you go back in - instead of bribing with food, you could simply explain why some foods are more healthy than others and how they make our bodies feel good - etc (in ways your child will understand that doesn't invovle shaming or bribing). Then leave it up to him. Modeling good eating is a fantastic way to teach our children how to eat in a healthy way. Once I put a bowl of fruit out as a central piece in our house and helped myself throughout the day - my son started doing the same as well! (for example).

[joanna0707]

First of all, I would not have fries on the table if I don't want my son to have any, I would only have the choices of food I consider acceptable, this way it's easier to avoid struggles over the kinds of food I want DS to eat. When we go out, to visit friends for example, I let DS eat what he chooses, it's not going to hurt him if he has a piece of cake or fries once in a while and I think it's not worth a fight.

As for the rest I agree with Ann.

[swd12422]

Believe me, I had no intention of using bribery! And as far as the fries go, there's only so much I can do. I can't control what DH orders. I've asked and asked, but the few occasions we eat out, we do tend to go for burgers and fries and other unhealthy stuff. I don't mind it now and then, but I want DS to eat other things at the meal too. He'll only eat fries if they're on the table. He can have them, but he also needs to eat the protein and veggies, and believe me, he gobbles down chicken and tomatoes at home like there's not tomorrow, so it's not like we're making him eat stuff he doesn't like. So that's my compromise: he can have some fries, but they can't be the whole meal. Are you saying there's just not a way to do this with a toddler?

And to clarify: I didn't mind the crying, other than that it was bothering other people. The "bad behavior" was the hitting, throwing and not listening, not the crying. Thank you for the reminder to not use "don't" and "no" and to validate feelings first instead of just trying to "fix" the problem! I'll try that next time.

[plunky]

Probably an unpopular opinion, but we don't go out much any more. When we do, I don't mind if DD only eats fries or whatever else it is that she wants. I would be focused on all of us having fun.

[LynnS6]

Originally Posted by swd12422

He can have them, but he also needs to eat the protein and veggies, and believe me, he gobbles down chicken and tomatoes at home like there's not tomorrow, so it's not like we're making him eat stuff he doesn't like. So that's my compromise: he can have some fries, but they can't be the whole meal. Are you saying there's just not a way to do this with a toddler?

Look at it from another perspective: If 99% of his diet is good, does it really matter if he has one meal every now and then that consists only of french fries? A child's diet is best looked at over the course of a week, not a single meal. If he gets enough protein and fruits and veggies and whole grains in a week, he'll be fine with french fries for one meal.

The other thing to consider is: Why are you going out to eat? It makes no sense to go out for some family time and then spend it all fretting about french fries. Your dh deserves french fries now and then too. Your ds will get past this stage and eat something other than fries. He might even become picky about what kind of fries he eats. My eat only fries girl is now 5, and the last time we went out for burgers and fries, she had her burger only because she didn't care for the fries!

[Mary-Beth]

Focus on telling him what you want. "Gentle hands" over "don't hit." because you visualize hitting when you head don't hit. You want him to visualize being gentle.

I'd say not to have food he can't have right in front of him (when possible).
If he is allowed fries, give him a serving of fries and other food and let him select what he wants. When the fries are gone just say so. I'd also say something like, "I can tell you want to eat fries. You seem so hungry and they taste so good." You are letting him know you understand what he wants.

[paxye]

Originally Posted by plunky

Probably an unpopular opinion, but we don't go out much any more. When we do, I don't mind if DD only eats fries or whatever else it is that she wants. I would be focused on all of us having fun.

I agree... going out is a treat and is the time that we can indulge in things that we usually don't eat at home... it's a once in a while thing for all of us... If he is gobbling down the chicken and tomatoes at home then great! One meal of fries once in a while won't kill him... Of course if you are having fries often at home or going out every night it would be up to you to change those habits... but once in a while? I don't see the problem...

[heartmama]

I would feed him at home, where there are no fries, before I went out to dinner. That way I know he had some chicken and tomatoes, and can enjoy family time at the restaurant without worrying about who orders what first and how many bites ds has before he has fries. If he loves fries as much as you say, he will sit happily at the table in the restaurant to eat them. You will have peace of mind knowing he had protein first at home. Problem solved (hopefully!).

[Kreeblim]

The two year old stage is probably the worst for restaurants...we avoid them for the most part during that time. It's not that you CAN'T have a meal at a restaurant during that age, it's just it ends up being rushed and normal unpredictable restaurant issues (like service that takes too long for example) can lead to meltdowns due to their inability to understand these issues and their poor ability to deal with hunger while surrounded by other people who are eating. By age 3-4 it's MUCH easier.

However, ordering the fries wasn't the 2 year old's problem...it was your DH's. It was like having a big bowl of lollypops in the center of the table the whole time, and it sounds like you guys were aware of that situation before ordering. If your expectation is to be able to have a marginally calm meal out then either not ordering fries or relaxing your food rules for the night would make that possible. If your expectation is to be able to order whatever you want in front of a 2 year old and then have a calm meal out while denying said 2 year old something that you KNOW trumps every other food item on the table then you may want to consider changing that expectation...or delaying it for a year or so. 2 is WAY young for that kind of thing no matter how you discipline your child.

[Latte Mama]

Originally Posted by Kreeblim

However, ordering the fries wasn't the 2 year old's problem...it was your DH's. It was like having a big bowl of lollypops in the center of the table the whole time, and it sounds like you guys were aware of that situation before ordering. If your expectation is to be able to have a marginally calm meal out then either not ordering fries or relaxing your food rules for the night would make that possible. If your expectation is to be able to order whatever you want in front of a 2 year old and then have a calm meal out while denying said 2 year old something that you KNOW trumps every other food item on the table then you may want to consider changing that expectation...or delaying it for a year or so. 2 is WAY young for that kind of thing no matter how you discipline your child.

Yes,YES to all of the above. The first thing I thought when I read the OP, was "why the heck did they order fries? " And I'm still a newb at this!
Great advice from all posters, storing away for the next year .

[Everrgreen]

Originally Posted by heartmama

I would feed him at home, where there are no fries, before I went out to dinner. That way I know he had some chicken and tomatoes, and can enjoy family time at the restaurant without worrying about who orders what first and how many bites ds has before he has fries. If he loves fries as much as you say, he will sit happily at the table in the restaurant to eat them. You will have peace of mind knowing he had protein first at home. Problem solved (hopefully!).

I think this sounds like a great idea! But I also would have no problem with my DS eating just fries for a once-in-a-while dinner out.

[kittykat2481]

I think you've gotten some good advice on here. I use positive phrases too, and that really helps. Also, if DS is getting frustrated for whatever reason and I'm not getting through, usually DH can step in an try to get through to him nicely with better results. It's as if he begins to tune me out in order to better focus on whatever he wants, and a different person or another way of phrasing something can grab his attention and help him focus again on the behavior we are looking for.

Also, regarding the food, maybe next time put some french fries on his plate, along with tomatoes, chicken, and whatever else. He will likely eat all of the fries first and ask for more. Then you can encourage him to taste the other foods on his plate too. Even if you just put a couple of bites of chicken and tomatoes... Just try to get him to try a little of everything to see if he likes it (even if it's something you know he would normally like) and then let it go. If he eats healthy normally, a few fries isn't going to do a lot of damage.

*hugs* My son just turned 2, so I feel for you and your frustration.