Best Places for if We Relocate? Update!

[mammal_mama]

Dh has been unemployed since the end of August. We are currently scraping by on his unemployment checks and food stamps. Our housepayment is just under $600 a month (payment includes taxes and insurance), since we live in an older neighborhood of Kansas City.

However, it seems pretty certain that if we tried to sell, we wouldn't be able to get nearly enough to pay off what we owe. Property values have dropped so much. We just started buying 5 years ago, on a 30-year loan.

Dh has been looking really hard for work (his skills are in information technology and customer service -- no college degree ... he has ruptured discs in his back so can't do heavy lifting any more). He keeps going for interviews -- the phone interview goes well, then he goes in and it seems to go well, then they send him a note that they've decided to interview more qualified people.

The only thing he can think of, since he knows he's qualified, is that when they meet him and see that he's 51, he gets passed over. Maybe this will change now that the healthcare plan has passed, since I've heard that the reason for the age-discrimination is that it costs more to insure older people.

Anyhow, we're thinking that if he hasn't found a job by the time his unemployment expires in March, and especially if he can't get an extension, maybe we should just walk away and use our tax-return to relocate.

I mean, I suppose we could live off it for a few months and make a few more months of housepayments -- but then if he still didn't have work we'd lose our house anyway, and at that point have no money to relocate.

So, anyhow, I thought I'd check around about the employment situations in other states, especially the warmer states. We are thinking it would be great to live someplace warm all year round. Also homeschooling friendly. Thanks for any input.

Oh, we are aware of options to make money in the home such as licensed home daycare. We may do something like this -- but for the purpose of this thread I'm mainly looking for ideas for relocating (and no we won't show up and try to erect a tent in your backyard, LOL).

[sewchris2642]

One of the first things you should consider in relocating is the COL in the new area. San Diego satisfies your criteria of a warmer place. But you won't even be able to rent an apt for the $600 a month you are paying on your mortgage now. Studios are renting for $600 a month; a one bedroom for $800. 2-3 bedroom houses are going for $1500 to $1800 in a working class neighborhood; over $2000 in better neighborhoods. Gas averages $3.00 a gallon and driving is a must.

[PreggieUBA2C]

I just wanted to let you know that if it comes to it, there are loads of work in many fields, including IT and cushy government jobs, that pay very, very well in the Canadian far north. It's bloody cold up here, though, but the lifestyle is worth enduring it for most people up here. If it interests you, look up the two Territories and stay away from anywhere on the eatern side of the country; people over there are in the same situation you are presently. Lots of people immigrate to this area from western europe mainly, but some americans too. For homegrown living, it really can't be beat.

Although you would save yourself a lot of trouble if this was interesting to you and went to AK. Very similar terrain and your gov't pays you just to live there, like ours does us too, but the amount and benefits are better US side, imo.

It's cold, but a different 'climate' economy-wise. Don't let the unemployment figures scare you. A LOT of people up here live on the land, so they are 'underemployed' or 'unemployed' where a distinction isn't made, but this is by choice and doesn't reflect the need for competent and reliable workers in all fields, which is great on both sides of the border. It IS possible to live up here and not have a job, but I would never call that 'not working'!!! It would be very hard, but if you have the skills, very worthwhile, imo!

The far north Canadians and Americans mix very well/have a lot in common and tend to hop across the border as we need. There's not as much of a difference up here between understandings as there would be between us up here and people who live in the deep south US or in California, for example. We live pretty much the same sort of life up here, all of us.

Just a thought. I do hope that things can work out for you where you are though; that would be much better, right?

[mammal_mama]

Thanks, Chris, for reminding me to think about COL.

I have definitely heard what you're saying about San Diego -- that this seems to be true of the entire West Coast, and East Coast, too -- at least in the areas with more job opportunities.

I've been thinking that we might actually be happier in an apartment situation -- like in a large complex with lots of other families and a shared play area. Our girls both really love lots of opportunities to play with other kids, though they are definitely not wanting the structure of a school situation.

And sometimes in the winters they feel rather cooped up -- though they had a great time today playing with the kids next door, both in houses and also out in the snow. But next week when the neighbor kids start back to school, it seems so "iffy" as to who in the neighborhood might have time to play in the afternoons, what with their homework, family time, bath and bed, and it getting dark by 5.

I'm kind of wondering about Texas or Louisiana -- I actually heard a while back that Louisiana was doing a lot better employment-wise than some other places. I also wonder about Arizona.

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by PreggieUBA2C

Just a thought. I do hope that things can work out for you where you are though; that would be much better, right?

Well ... I think staying put would be preferable to dh and our oldest -- but I've actually been getting kind of excited about the possibility of a whole new scene. And getting rid of lots of stuff and moving to a smaller place that will be easier for me to keep clean. Selfish of me I know.

I find myself intrigued by what you're sharing about the Canadian North and Alaska -- but dh just reminded me that with his degenerative arthritis, diabetic neuropathy, and mixed-connective tissue disorder, he doesn't cope real well with extreme cold temperatures.

He feels like Kansas City in winter is about as cold as he can handle.

[4evermom]

Here's a list of the happiest states. Louisiana ranks #1.
http://www.livescience.com/culture/0...tate-list.html

[VisionaryMom]

We're in central Ky, which has a very low COL, and it would be hard to rent here for what you're paying as well. Years ago I paid $400 a month for a studio in Macon, Georgia, but I've always paid around $700 for 1-2-bedroom apartments in other places.

We have looked at re-locating to Louisiana, but at least in the southern half of the state, housing costs have risen tremendously post-Katrina. I know when we looked specifically at New Orleans, the rental rates at that time were $1000 minimum for a 2-bedroom apartment. I think housing concerns probably will have to be the biggest factor, and in the end, walking away may be more detrimental.

What kind of IT work does your husband do? I know for DH government contracts/grants have been the best for pay (not so much for benefits, though). I would imagine your husband's age and lack of college degree both are problems. I know my husband's office does not hire IT folks without degrees at all, and it seems to be the trend in many places. Is going back to school a possibility? I know (literally) living off student loans isn't fun, but that may be an option for you.

Given my druthers, there are a few places I'd consider. Austin, TX (and maybe Houston) are places we're considering for long-term location. My husband really has no desire to live in New Orleans, though I do. North Carolina also is wonderful for a number of reasons (depending on what issues are important to you). DH loves the Raleigh area most. You can be close to both mountains and ocean. (For us, a plus is the political climate, which is active and progressive, esp for the South.) The food markets are wonderful, and you'd get snow once or twice a year - enough in my opinion to be fun but not work!

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by 4evermom

Here's a list of the happiest states. Louisiana ranks #1.
http://www.livescience.com/culture/0...tate-list.html

Wow! That's awesome!

I have some friends with a large family who lived there once on a campground for quite some time.

And I wonder if we could learn to live off the swamp?

And I'm not joking about that, either!

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by BrandiRhoades

What kind of IT work does your husband do?

He worked in the call center at Gateway and also for a computer department store. But lately it's been more customer service. I.e. his last job, where he worked for 4 years, he set up conference calls. It seems like IT jobs have been hard to come by here, maybe because of the lack of college degree.

Is going back to school a possibility? I know (literally) living off student loans isn't fun, but that may be an option for you.

He was looking into it, but really got scared off by the debt and his worries that with his health issues (diabetes, cirrhosis), he might not be able to pay it off. He has decided to work on getting some computer certifications on his own.

He was considering going through a 4 month program, which would have cost us about $12,000 (after WIA paid $4000), to get those certifications ... but the interest rate was so high we'd have been paying for 10 years, and it would add up to about $20,000 when we were done.

And when he went to meet with them before he signed for the loan, the guy kept emphasizing how they COULD NOT guarantee him a job when he was done. And that really scared him, since his main reason for being willing to take out the loan was that this school really helps you find a job ...

And he got worried that it would be a bad risk in this economic climate. Because to not get a job, or have to get something much lower-paying, and be stuck with the student loan payments would be just awful. And he would have had to start making payments within about 2 months of finishing.

Given my druthers, there are a few places I'd consider. Austin, TX (and maybe Houston) are places we're considering for long-term location. My husband really has no desire to live in New Orleans, though I do. North Carolina also is wonderful for a number of reasons (depending on what issues are important to you). DH loves the Raleigh area most. You can be close to both mountains and ocean. (For us, a plus is the political climate, which is active and progressive, esp for the South.) The food markets are wonderful, and you'd get snow once or twice a year - enough in my opinion to be fun but not work!

Houston area sounds very interesting to me ... also North Carolina.

Of course, it would be a whole family decision. And so far, whenever we talk about the possibility of relocating, our 9yo gets so upset. But maybe if we could visit a place first it would be more tangible.

From her perspective, she has just started getting closer to the girl next door. She's been through some changes with having good friends and then having them move away, and has really been wanting a best friend who can live near her forever.

It's rough because I think the neighbors are renting so it doesn't seem "for sure" that dd's new friend will live in this neighborhood "forever."

[PreggieUBA2C]

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

Well ... I think staying put would be preferable to dh and our oldest -- but I've actually been getting kind of excited about the possibility of a whole new scene. And getting rid of lots of stuff and moving to a smaller place that will be easier for me to keep clean. Selfish of me I know.

I find myself intrigued by what you're sharing about the Canadian North and Alaska -- but dh just reminded me that with his degenerative arthritis, diabetic neuropathy, and mixed-connective tissue disorder, he doesn't cope real well with extreme cold temperatures.

He feels like Kansas City in winter is about as cold as he can handle.

I can relate to some degree. Keeping my feet ulcer/sore-free is a significant challenge that presently I am losing. If I could enjoy the cold, this would be the most miraculous place to live. It has so much to offer and so many opportunities for anyone who wants them. We don't live near any university though, so we may end up relocating to British Colmbia if dh or me or our boys end up wanting to spend any significant time at one.

Being in a warmer climate would be very helpful for me, health-wise, but it isn't feasible for us financially atm. I wish it were. There are a few islands in the south of BC that have a mediteranean climate. Mmmmmm, sunshine and ocean...

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by PreggieUBA2C

Keeping my feet ulcer/sore-free is a significant challenge that presently I am losing.

Oh, I'm so sorry! I have very dry feet and hands, and right now my feet are really cracked! So I guess I don't do so great with cold, either.

But if dh were feeling like doing it, I sure would want to try it!

I guess it's obvious that I feel ready for a major change.

Our main reason for being here is just that we were here. I grew up here, and dh has lived in this area for most of his adult life. But now that I've accepted that my extended family really is no support system -- sometimes I wonder why not start over someplace fresh?

But of course I don't want to traumatize my children, or make things unstable for them. But if we could have equal stability someplace else, for some reason this really appeals to me.

[VisionaryMom]

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

He was looking into it, but really got scared off by the debt and his worries that with his health issues (diabetes, cirrhosis), he might not be able to pay it off. He has decided to work on getting some computer certifications on his own.

Certifications may be a good route. I've considered that because though I have a degree, it's not in IT, which is where my experience is. I think a couple of certifications would be helpful in that regard - and definitely cheaper.

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

Houston area sounds very interesting to me ... also North Carolina.

The best part about my research on Houston is that with the hurricane that hit Galveston last year, there are tons of jobs available there. With his health problems, construction may not be possible for him, but I'm sure there are other needs to be met.

Oh, it also just occurred to me that perhaps getting on with a state agency benefitting from stimulus funds could work. The only hiring boon where we are right now is in this area. While many of those jobs are temporary, it may be something he can do until you can find something permanent. I definitely recommend looking at employment agencies if you haven't already, especially for long-distance moves. There are several IT-related that have offices nationwide, and that's where we've focused when we've moved.

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

Of course, it would be a whole family decision. And so far, whenever we talk about the possibility of relocating, our 9yo gets so upset. But maybe if we could visit a place first it would be more tangible.

My mom avoided moving for years because I would get so upset by it. The reality, though, is that she should've moved. Yes, I would have been upset, but it would've been best for the family as a whole (and really could have been for me as well). We ended up moving when I was 16 and my sister was 8, and I think it was for the best. It's just so hard to see that when you're 9.

[Ambystoma]

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

I'm kind of wondering about Texas or Louisiana -- I actually heard a while back that Louisiana was doing a lot better employment-wise than some other places. I also wonder about Arizona.

Yeah, here in LA the unemployment rate isn't terrible. It's not as great as people would make it out to be, though, especially in tech jobs (in our area, at least). My DH is working pretty far outside his field right now. Lots of jobs on oil rigs off the coast, but it is more physically demanding usually. Sometimes IT, etc stuff opens up out there and it pays very well.

Now, on the other things you asked about--I live in cajun country, so about 2 hours west of NOLA.
Weather: It is HOT here, especially in the summer. It was a cool summer here and we had many days around 105 F and most were in the 90s. Also very humid. Like florida swamp humid. It can be unbearable in the heat-but evenings aren't bad. If you like hot weather, you will like it here. Winters are usually in the 50s with an occasional freeze (like 1-2 days total). Mosquitos are unbelievable!

COL: Not really terrible, actually. Cute houses in the nice areas of town (older but high in demand) usually rent 1-2 BR for $800-1200. Nice apartments rent 1-2 BR for $600-900.

Attractions : The town dies quickly of the evening, which drives me crazy, but is family friendly. Actually, this is a very family friendly area, which I assume is from the Catholic influence? Mardi gras is fun here and more family-oriented (no boobs allowed), we have many music festivals that are great and free, and people really enjoy grilling/neighborhood leisure activities. There are sports teams nearby (Saints if you like football) and concerts that come to town or within 2 hours. Also, what I found hilarious was that you can buy liquor in the grocery store, gas station, etc. I had no idea some states didn't have state owned liquor stores!

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

Wow! That's awesome!

I have some friends with a large family who lived there once on a campground for quite some time.

And I wonder if we could learn to live off the swamp?

And I'm not joking about that, either!

Hmm...lots of people do live out in the bayou, but it is much different than living off the land in areas like NC or KY (where I am familiar). Game species are different, but still whitetail deer are pretty abundant. You also have to watch out for gators (no joke) and many venemous snakes-but those are why I moved here! Rice and crawfish farms are big here, but you need lots of land.

Originally Posted by BrandiRhoades

.... best part about my research on Houston is that with the hurricane that hit Galveston last year, there are tons of jobs available there. With his health problems, construction may not be possible for him, but I'm sure there are other needs to be met. ...

Galveston is a cool area, IMO. We are re-locating in about a year for me to work or get another degree, and we were thinking that area.

Other suggestions: Gainesville, FL - warm, smaller town, college town so job market is a little better, nice area.
North Carolina is great! I loved it there. The triangle usually has plenty of jobs in IT and pharma type companies. I still get emails from my old recruiter about jobs in that area. Living in a smaller area outside raleigh (like cary) is nicer and more child-friendly.

Good luck!

[34me]

Has your DH ever thouht of applying for SSDI? I know it's quite a process but with his list of health issues it might be worth it. You can still work some hours while on it but it doesn't (can't) be full time. Also Voc Rehab Services might be available. I live in one of Money Magazines best places to live but we have't sen above freezing for more than a couple hours in weeks.

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by BrandiRhoades

My mom avoided moving for years because I would get so upset by it. The reality, though, is that she should've moved. Yes, I would have been upset, but it would've been best for the family as a whole (and really could have been for me as well). We ended up moving when I was 16 and my sister was 8, and I think it was for the best. It's just so hard to see that when you're 9.

I think a big part of it for her, is just that this is the only place she's ever known. We haven't really travelled, other than a couple of short trips within the state.

And I've felt increasingly-isolated here, what with my extended family being VERY unsupportive of my parenting, to the point where we don't see them any more. I just talk with my mom on the phone, and dd1 and I just recently paid a short visit to her, for the first time in more than a year.

So it's not like dd has all these strong ties. What with a couple of families moving, and dh's and my theological changes that have had us out of church for a few years and not in very close touch with our old church friends, it really seems like it's just us.

We've lately started attending a new church that we like, and are starting to get to know some people. But it's not like we're in tight or anything.

And we go to a homeschooling co-op, and people are polite and all ... but there haven't been any real connections. We have a "sort of" friendship with one other mother with 2 daughters, in that they've come to play at our house a few times at my invitation. They seem to have fun while they're here.

But they never call us or seek us out. No one does -- it seems like all of dd's get-togethers with friends, other than what happens organically in the neighborhood, are up to me to orchestrate. The other moms just aren't contacting me.

Dd keeps telling me that she feels like she doesn't have any friends. It seems like she's just not satisfied with playing with other kids in the neighborhood or park like she used to be. She craves a best friend, and she had one for a few years and then she moved summer before last, and dd still cries about her.

And I realize there's no guarantee that we'll move somewhere else and have any better luck creating a community -- but, even if we move somewhere else and find out it's STILL just us -- it's not like that's any kind of a setback from where we are now.

But I realize that, miserably as dd sometimes complains about her life at the moment, it's the only life she knows.

[sunnmama]

$600 mortgage will be difficult to beat. I'm in the triangle of NC (in an apt complex), and pay well more than that for a 2 bd apt. And, there are credit checks for the better communities, which might be an obstacle with a foreclosure. "Walking away" from a house is rarely as easy as, well, walking away.....

Can you work? If the two of you work opposite shifts (to avoid childcare costs/continue homeschooling), you could potentially manage your low mortgage on 2 lower wage jobs (retail, daycare, etc). You could still explore the potential to move, but do so in a year or two from a standpoint of solid finances and credit.

[mammal_mama]

Ambystoma, thank you for all this great information about Lousisiana!

Also we will have to check into North Carolina.

34me, dh has thought about applying for SSDI. He's just scared to do it because he's heard it's a long waiting process, and he'd lose his unemployment the moment that he applied.

What we've heard is that you really have to have enough saved to live for, like, a year on your savings while you wait to see if your claim is approved.

So he's figured that as long as he can work he wants to work. But if his unemployment runs out, and he can't get an extension and still doesn't have a job -- maybe that would be the obvious choice then.

[newbymom05]

I'm in the NTX/Dallas area and it's a good place for tech jobs. We're originally from SoFla so in comparison, the weather here STINKS--hot hot hot in the summer and cold in the winter, but not as cold as KS! It's also surprisingly crunchy here. I've only lived in the Dallas area, but I have friends who lived in Austin and say Dallas is more AP and family friendly. It's def crunchier and more AP than SoFla. As far as lifestyle, the northern suburbs are def family friendly and family oriented. I see by your sig you're Christian--this is truly the buckle of the Bible Belt and there are a ton of very active church communities here, as well as an active and supportive homeschooling community (both secular and religious).

It took me a while to get used to TX--it's so different from SoFla in diversity, politics, etc.--but now I don't want to leave b/c it's really a great place to raise a family, esp if you home school, plus the jobs are here for my DH. Tell your DH to look into Plano or Allen--a lot of tech companies have HQs there.

ETA I want to amend my answer to add that checking w/ Trulia.com, most people in my area have advanced degrees and you'd have a hard time for finding a rental for under 1K, although nearby areas are cheaper.

I think your husband is def facing age discrimination, not necessarily ed discrimination. The people I know that are chronically un/under employed are all over 45. My SIL finally completed her BS at 47 and has only been able to find a job at Macy's. One of her co-workers has an MBA.

When there's 6 applicants for every job, employers can afford to hire the younger, cheaper workers. I don't think health care reform will change that, certainly not in the near future. I would think twice about incurring debt for more education at this time, but that's just me.

[noobmom]

South Carolina has LCOL, is warm, and is very homeschooling friendly, from what I understand.

As for the IT certification, it's really expensive to get done. Has he tried applying for any government jobs (post office or otherwise?)--at least with federal jobs he shouldn't be discriminated against because of his age.

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by newbymom05

I see by your sig you're Christian--this is truly the buckle of the Bible Belt and there are a ton of very active church communities here, as well as an active and supportive homeschooling community (both secular and religious).

Well, we're very liberal Christian -- but I spoze we're managing fine in the Bible Belt up here -- so long as there's also the liberal element like here, which it sounds like there is, from what you say.

I think your husband is def facing age discrimination, not necessarily ed discrimination. The people I know that are chronically un/under employed are all over 45. My SIL finally completed her BS at 47 and has only been able to find a job at Macy's. One of her co-workers has an MBA.

When there's 6 applicants for every job, employers can afford to hire the younger, cheaper workers. I don't think health care reform will change that, certainly not in the near future. I would think twice about incurring debt for more education at this time, but that's just me.

Yes, this is one reason why dh was so scared about the educational debt. Cause to incur additional debt and still end up in a lower-paying job, would just be so rough.