Breastfeeding Schedule Confusion - Page 2

[Juvysen]

Originally Posted by Darryen

We tried the SNS tonight and it didn't go well. After 2 hours of him screaming I finally put him down to rest. He only ate 1/2 an ounce. I want to do what's right and get him to the breast but its so depressing every time we try and now he is starving himself because we won't let him eat from the bottle. I had it at the fastest flow and was squeezing it in his mouth so all he had to do was swallow. I just want him to associate the breast with food right now and not worry about it being hard to suck but he still screamed. Its gut wrenching.

Unfortunately DH can't help much. He supports me and makes the bottle up for the SNS but he can't do any chores due to his surgery. It'll be 6 months before he can lift more than 2lbs with his left arm. He did put a load of laundry in for me today but I know it was extremely difficult for him to do so. He has to go back to work tomorrow too. My parents were here but only for a week and they really didn't help much. They got the nursery sorta in shape because they were staying in there on our spare bed and they cooked some meals but those left overs are gone already. It's all me now. I wish we could afford to hire someone to help but the cost of living in AK is too much for us to afford paid help. We'll manage though. There are moms out there without a husband/friend for even emotional support so I count my blessings anyways. I guess maybe the best thing to do would be to make a list of things that need to be done in a day and then when I have time btw feedings/pumping I can pick something on the list and try to get them all done.

I'm starting to think maybe I should stick to my original plan to pump exclusively and bottle feed him my bm. I had decided to give bfing a try once he was big enough and awake enough to suck but for the life of me I can't remember why I wanted to do that... maybe because it would cut out the whole setting up the pump and cleaning it steps? I don't remember now. /sigh Pregnancy brain + Depressed brain = really bad memory. I just don't know how many more hours or days I can listen to him scream at my breast and watch him starve himself. I'm putting him to breast WAY before he is super hungry too... the moment he squeaks or begins to root. He wakes up, sees that he's on the breast and all hell breaks loose.

Have you tried a different position? I mean other than cradle, cross-cradle or football (although, try all those, too, if you haven't!). I had a friend who couldn't get her baby to latch on at all (he wouldn't even put his mouth on, most of the time, he'd just scream) until she mentioned that he preferred being held upright most of the time. I suggested that she (BY ALL MEANS!!) hold him in a position that he likes. I think she ended up holding him in sort of a modified football hold, so his bottom was next to her hip and he was sitting sort of upright to one side of her, nursing on the side he was sitting... that was when he finally decided it would be acceptable to latch on...

That is, don't be afraid to try positions that none of the books say... because if baby's comfy, that's what matters.

[Megan73]

Originally Posted by Darryen

We tried the SNS tonight and it didn't go well. After 2 hours of him screaming I finally put him down to rest. He only ate 1/2 an ounce. I want to do what's right and get him to the breast but its so depressing every time we try and now he is starving himself because we won't let him eat from the bottle. I had it at the fastest flow and was squeezing it in his mouth so all he had to do was swallow. I just want him to associate the breast with food right now and not worry about it being hard to suck but he still screamed. Its gut wrenching.

Darryen
Don't let him starve himself, mama! The most important thing is to feed the baby - no matter what it takes. If he won't take the breast right now, feed him however you need to feed him to get him to eat.
He won't take the breast if he's too hungry and upset. You have time to figure this out. I didn't even get an SNS until my son was six weeks old and he's still nursing at 17 months!
Pumping and feeding him your expressed milk and formula is a good plan until you get some hands on help. Can you arrange to see a lactation consultant tomorrow? The hospital where you gave birth or your local public health department may be able to help if you can't afford a private LC.
Hang in there, mama.

[Tjej]

Have you heard about/seen a nipple shield? I have heard a lot of moms have success with that - it's a shield you put over your breast while you nurse, and it makes it more like a bottle. You use it for a while and then over time try it without or slip it out during feeds and eventually don't need it anymore. I mean, for the first couple of weeks just USE it, but after that try randomly to slip it out after baby has been nursing for a while and they get used to it.

I have not personally used one, and have heard that they can cause supply issues, but if you are willing to pump a little for a little while, that would cover that issue.

Tjej

[Darryen]

Yeah, I've tried all kinds of positions. He has to be swaddled tightly or he'll punch and kick at me. He's a strong little guy.

I was given a nipple shield at the hospital but its VERY flimsy and hard to keep on. Are there others I could try? I had to hold it in place the entire time he was feeding and also hold it away from his nose since it could suffocate him. I'm thinking with all the success stories I have heard about them that there is another kind out there or maybe they showed me how to use it wrong?

I tried the SNS again just now. He screamed again but I kept repositioning him and trying. He finally took 1/2 an oz again and then he accidentally got the nipple without the tube and fed for about 10 mins (3 mins or so of actual eating since I had to keep waking him up to suck). It felt so nice to have him on my breast eating. It was very encouraging. I do have a question. My nipple won't stay hard... does that matter? Its not flat or inverted, just not hard. I saw when he finally got on the nipple without the tube that he sucked it in far enough that it was elongated. Will he pull it in far enough on his own or should I try to get it hard to latch him on? The LC at the hospital wasn't much help as you can see. I was given the number for another free LC in Fairbanks and I need to give her a call and see what she can do to help us.

[ratrodgrl]

i have no experience w/ nipple shields but was having troubles getting my preemie son to latch right. Fortunately, I got some info here about dr jack newman's site drjacknewman.com click on 'breastfeeding help" there are a lot of great articles. here is a direct link to the latching sheet, hope it helps you as much as it did me!

[Juvysen]

Yes, there's a variety of different nipple shields. You do want it to be fairly flimsy, though, so your breast gets the stimulation you need. My sister in law used one - I think what she did was lick it and then stick it on. There's a positioning trick you can do to keep his nose off your breast/shield - that is, pull his little bottom in closer to your body, it tips the head back slightly and lets them breathe. It is harder if you have particularly large breasts, but it might help.

Glad to hear that he was latched on for a few!

I would say that it doesn't matter if your nipple is hard or not, as long as there's milk coming out. I know mine wasn't at the beginning... but over the months it sort of changed. As long as he's getting it elongated to the back of his tongue and able to get milk out (and not hurting you) then it's right

FWIW, I didn't feel a let-down for the first couple months, but then one day I just started getting this weird feeling like when a part falls alseep - that achey tingle. Took me a while to realize it was let-down i was feeling, and it wasn't very comfortable, but only lasted for a minute or two. It sort of changed to a less uncomfortable feeling later.

[Megan73]

Originally Posted by Darryen

It felt so nice to have him on my breast eating. It was very encouraging. I do have a question. My nipple won't stay hard... does that matter? Its not flat or inverted, just not hard. I saw when he finally got on the nipple without the tube that he sucked it in far enough that it was elongated. Will he pull it in far enough on his own or should I try to get it hard to latch him on? The LC at the hospital wasn't much help as you can see. I was given the number for another free LC in Fairbanks and I need to give her a call and see what she can do to help us.

I'm so glad he's latching You're doing great, mama!
I don't think it's a big issue if your nipple isn't hard - as long as he's able to latch onto it.
I hope you can get in to see that LC ASAP!

[DCMama01]

I'm a novice too, but my LO has been receiving the occasional bottle since she was 10 days old. I gave her pumped milk mostly for 2-3 days when she hit 2 weeks to let my nipples heal. No nipple confusion here. I was surprised one day last week when she refused to take a bottle from me (only her dad), just the breast, when I give her a bottle about 20-25% of the time. (Trying to prep for when I return to work.)

[Darryen]

I have DDD breasts and I am finding that they are kinda hard to nurse from. They aren't particularly firm and the surgeon put my nipple up high after my reduction so that as they grew they would still appear perky.

I think its the cross cradle? Idk which it is but I have him swaddled tightly and laid across my belly with legs at the non-feeding breast. He is on his side. This is the only position I have found that he even accepts the nipple for comfort. I tried sitting him up a little to keep him awake but he didn't like that idea.

He took 2oz of formula from the SNS plus whatever he got from my breast for the 3-5 mins he actually sucked and not just sleeping on it. Then after his nap, when I offered it again, he would have nothing to do with it and he hadn't had a wet diaper so I got out the bottle and fed him slowly. He took another 8oz before bed. I guess today if he refuses the breast then I'll tube feed him with the SNS and do it slowly to try to get him used to not having it come so fast like the bottle. I have slow nipples on the bottle but its still too easy for him. I don't know that it has anything to do with nipple confusion so much as the bottle drains faster and easier. The Breastflow bottles I am going to get are harder to drain and the nipples are wide and short like my breast. The nipple he is using now are so elongated its crazy.

[buttercups.nest]

Hello Congratulations on your little one...this is such a fun and awesome journey, I promise, things get easier!

With my first I had way less knowledge of breastfeeding than you do. I didn't do any research beforehand...reading your first post I can tell you know more than I did. That being said, I attempted breastfeeding (accompanied by a screaming baby), followed by a bottle, and then pumping (in attempts to get my milk in). So I can totally understand your depression. When I quit BF at 2 weeks I felt like a failure of a mom. My little girl definitely did not like the work involved in BF.

With my second I did skin to skin as soon as he was born and BF has been pretty good since the beginning. We have had a few problems and so I tried feeding him via syringe to avoid nipple confusion. We avoided the confusion, but he still realized that the syringe was way less work than the boob! Little stinker! So once I realized that I threw out the syringe, never looked back. That day we did skin to skin all morning, and by lunch time he was hungry enough to work at it.

Another thing to remember is that babies feed off our stress; I think in the beginning with my daughter thats one of the reasons we had problems with breastfeeding getting started. With my son I had relaxing music, or the TV on (found when I had something to distract me I relaxed easier), or even talking to a friend.

I would say try skin to skin. In the beginning with my son whenever he got stressed out (even if he was hungry) put him on my chest, calm him down, and then we could start over.

I hope things work out for you...find a support system, whether on here or in real life....that was the main thing for me for baby #2 being successful at BF! Keep us posted!

[Darryen]

I think he was nibbling but I did hear a couple gulps this morning. I gave him his bottle since he was hysterically hungry by the time we got home from taking DH to work. Then he was looking around so I put him to breast and he latched. It was nice not having him scream. Maybe next time he'll actually eat!

[Juvysen]

If he's latching on when he's *not* hungry, I'd see about trying to put him on the breast like every half hour (or a half hour after he's done) for a day. See if he decides he likes it...

I realize it won't help you get your chores done, but having the baby on your naked chest a lot is a good way to encourage baby to nurse...

[Latte Mama]

Another suggestion with th nipple shield. Use your pump first for a few seconds to kind of "pull" your nipple out, then pop the shield on, and then try and latch him.

I got my son back to breast at 3 months and used the shield to do it. He was so used to bottles that the shield helped because it felt like a bottle nipple to him. It is kind of slippery and hard to keep on until you get used to it. But if you can get him on with it, then you should be able to wean him off the shield within a couple of weeks.

[smpayne]

Glad I'm not the only one with a super stubborn screaming baby. My DS #1 did the same thing and he was full term and healthy, just a stubborn little stinker. I never did get him to nurse, but things were the opposite with #2 that I can look back and be OK with everything.

I too have DDD and #2 was nearly 10lb when born. I found the cross-cradle the most comfortable (had to constantly hold breast while feeding). The Medela nursing stool helped me get my knees in a really good, confortable, stable position to lay baby on my lap with a full size pillow underneath. I wouldn't need to hold baby in place, but could concentrate on massaging my breast and stroke his head, face and hold his hands while he ate.

Good luck!

[Darryen]

LOL! You know those rings they make to sustain a man's erection? They should make little ones to keep nipples hard during BFing. I am sure there is something out there already but you know... it might help keep the shield on.

[Pookietooth]

I don't think the nipple needs to stay hard, mine never do. I wanted to suggest you try feeding him when he's asleep, or almost asleep, as they will often be more accepting then. Also, you can try feeding him with him on his back and you on your hands and knees over him (you might need to put him up on something and be at an angle so he can reach your nipple). to you mama.

[Megan73]

I hope things are going well, Darryen.

[Darryen]

Not "well" but they are going and that's progress. I am not giving up on this bundle. I did have a break through of sorts today. For the first time since his birth I had feelings of protectiveness because he is mine and not just because he is helpless. I was also extremely... um randy today. I think my hormones are changing.

[Megan73]

Originally Posted by Darryen

Not "well" but they are going and that's progress.

That IS progress. Hang in there, mama. The early days are rough for anyone and you've had more challenges than most. You're doing great
Have you been able to see a LC yet?

[Darryen]

First LC didn't help. Gonna try another.

I know stress effects your milk supply. What can you all suggest I do when the stressor is daily and not going away for 2 months? There is a SGT at DH's work that is making things hard on us but there is not getting rid of him so I am trying to find a way to deal with it.