Yuck!

[GoodMomma]

I'm in nursing school and I start my maternity rotation in a few weeks. Well I got my books today and I of course opened it right up to see what was in there about circ'ing (and breastfeeding). And wow...same old crap. However, it did actually show a picture of a newly circ'ed penis....looked horrible. And it showed some illustrations on how it's done, like the clamp attached to the penis, it also showed the plastibell method. I hope by just the looks of the pictures will prompt nursing students to look into it further. I've only skimmed through, but so far there's nothing on what the foreskin is for and the benefits of remaining intact. It does list risks and complications from being circ'ed though. I don't know....I guess it's a pretty neutral book and nothing can be perfect (unless parents like us write it). It just annoys me because nurses (at least at my school) apparently aren't being taught what the foreskin is for. It's referenced in the books as a piece of skin routinely removed via a circumcision. How are people ever going to know anything further?

[Night_Nurse]

Originally Posted by GoodMomma

How are people ever going to know anything further?

Well...nursing students like you will educate fellow classmates of foreskin function when the opportunity presents itself in class or clinical. And once you're a nurse you can educate patients or co-write nursing textbooks that include foreskin function.

I know what you meant by your post but you can use it to think long term about educational opportunities. I'm guessing the authors of the text book are doctors and nurses who were conditioned to believe the foreskin was awful and needed to be removed asap. So at least they are thinking outside the box a bit by providing accurate photos and being neutral. Maybe our next generation of text books will be better written and include foreskin function. My old nursing texts really don't have much on circ and I think only mentions a foreskin in the context of it being removed during a circ.
Also, if you are doing a BSN program and have to take a semester of ethics, circ would be a great topic to bring up!

[GoodMomma]

Originally Posted by Night_Nurse

Well...nursing students like you will educate fellow classmates of foreskin function when the opportunity presents itself in class or clinical. And once you're a nurse you can educate patients or co-write nursing textbooks that include foreskin function.

I know what you meant by your post but you can use it to think long term about educational opportunities. I'm guessing the authors of the text book are doctors and nurses who were conditioned to believe the foreskin was awful and needed to be removed asap. So at least they are thinking outside the box a bit by providing accurate photos and being neutral. Maybe our next generation of text books will be better written and include foreskin function. My old nursing texts really don't have much on circ and I think only mentions a foreskin in the context of it being removed during a circ.
Also, if you are doing a BSN program and have to take a semester of ethics, circ would be a great topic to bring up!

Circ is one thing I won't be able to keep quiet about in clinicals, lol. I hope I don't get in trouble. It'll be hard to remain neutral if I know my patient has decided to circ her new baby the next day. Ahhh, it's gonna be a horrible 8 weeks!

[Greg B]

Anything that ignores or minimizes the value of a foreskin is incomplete and innacurate at best, is biased in a way that promotes RIC at worst, but is not neutral.

Neutral means giving both sides equal treatment.

Regards

[GoodMomma]

Originally Posted by Greg B

Anything that ignores or minimizes the value of a foreskin is incomplete and innacurate at best, is biased in a way that promotes RIC at worst, but is not neutral.

Neutral means giving both sides equal treatment.

Regards

I do agree with you. The book does give the statement from the AAP and does give proper intact care instructions (no retraction, etc). I'm actually glad that it shows how it's done and the picture of the newly circ'ed penis.....makes me cross MY legs! So maybe it'll make someone think. FTR, the book is written by a couple nurses and a midwife...no doctors, not like it would make any difference, I just wanted to point that out.

[glongley]

The two things that are most typically missing from mainstream information giving about circumcision are 1) the anatomy and functions of the foreskin [i.e. giving the foreskin some value] and 2) the ethics of newborn circumcision [ i.e. that it's medically unnecessary surgery to remove a normal, healthy body part from a person who is unable to give their consent, and the rights of the male to bodily integrity and self-determination, and the fact that he is is appropriate person to make the decision]. This comes up over and over again whether in medical org position statements, parent magazine articles, or parent circumcision info handouts.

Having a foreskin is the biological default, and at the very least not circumcising should be examined as a completely valid alternative to circumcision. The only way to do this in a non-biased way in information-giving is to give equal attention to NOT circumcising as to circumcision itself. This could include giving info on: anatomy, function, development, and care of the intact penis; counter-information on common hygienic, social, and medical rationales for circumcision; rates and trends of circumcision and not circumcising locally and internationally; the ethics of the circumcision decision that identifies the male as the primary stakeholder; normalizing the intact penis and not circumcising by using words like "normal" "natural" or "intact" instead of "uncircumcised."

Please write a letter to the editor of this text book, to point out the positives of their circ section, and to suggests ways they could improve it. You are welcome to use any of my ideas above. I'd give a copy to your instructors to help raise their awareness.

Good luck with you nursing training. You are in a great position to educate your fellow students and instructors, as well as educate parents and colleagues once you have your degree. Thanks so much!

Gillian, RN

[Ron_Low]

I think if this text citation means the topic will come up in a class, that would be a good time to ask what a nurse should do when asked to assist with an amputating procedure which clearly involves a non-consenting patient and no diagnosis of defect or pathology.

The answer ought to be "go around the person who gave you the instruction and report the unethical behavior."

You could also ask what happens to the amputated human body parts, and when they dismiss the question "medical waste is incinerated" you can whip out an article about SkinMedica or Vevalta and ask where these cosmetics firms get the foreskins they make their products from.

[rlmueller]

Upload photo

from the book if you can with proper creds given. I'd love to show it to dh

[GoodMomma]

Originally Posted by rlmueller

from the book if you can with proper creds given. I'd love to show it to dh

I'm computer stupid and have no idea how to do that here, lol. Can you message me your e-mail and I can e-mail it to you?