Crate training question

[anomaly13]

I have an 42 pound, 8-10 month old pit bull/jack russell mix, we adopted him so his age is not exactly know to us. Anyway he has already been crate trained, as soon as I got him a crate he went right in no problem. He spends time in there throughout the day sometimes with the door locked sometimes not. When I lock the door I usually leave the room, but our house is really samll so he can always hear us.

Anyway last week I left him in his crate while I went to the store for about an hour. As soon as I left he started barking. When I came home he had made the crate collapse on him so he was able to get out. So DH put zipties on the crate, we did read reviews that some dogs can get out and a lot of people reccomended securing the crate so it wouls not collapse.

Today I left fo about 45 minutes and came home to find him in his crate but 3 of the 5 zipties had broken and the crate is pretty bent. I guess I am a little concerned that he could hurt himself. I am assuming he is jumping inside the crate, it fits him well, reccommended for 40-70 pounds dogs, there is not much room to jump but enough to do damage. He does fine in it when we are home, with the door oopen or locked shut. How do we get him to relax inside while we are gone? Will he just figure it out and stop doing it, I have only left him 2 times so maybe I need to do it more often. I pick my niece up every afternoon from school and that takes about 40 minutes, she just started back this week so maybe that will help him get used to it because it is at the same time everyday for the same amount of time. I give him something to chew on, like a rawhide or kong stuffed with treats, but as soon as I leave he forgets all about it because when I come come it is still there.

I have taken him with in that car a few times but honestly don't like that because while I'm away he is jumping all over the car and when I get back he is always trying to jump out of the car with excitment. So what are my options for leaving him alone? I am feeling a little trapped, I haven't taken the kids to storytime at the library in weeks and grocery shopping has become sort of a hassel when I used to actually enjoy it.


Also he gets walked for about an hour before I crate him and leave in the mornings and in the afternoon when I pick up my niece he spends 1-2 hours outside before we leave. He spends a lot of time outside playing in the yard throughtout the day and always gets 1 walk a day, some days 2. I also play fetch with him most days for about 30 minutes, usually the days he won't get a second walk.

[Ola_]

Sounds like he has separation anxiety. I'd see if you can get one of those DAP diffusers and some rescue remedy. Also, spending time in the yard is nothing like a walk, at least for my SA dog so I'd keep up the walks.

If it is anxiety he won't just stop doing it, if anything it may get worse. I'd practice frequent departures, but don't make them long - at first just go out the door and come back in (pick up your purse and keys, etc. as if you were really leaving). Do this a bunch of times till you can go out the door and he doesn't even care. Then try it for a couple of minutes, and slowly slowly increase the duration. There's a really good booklet I got from Dogwise.com, it's called "I'll be home soon" and it's about separation anxiety - it was pretty inexpensive I think.

[Oubliette8]

I agree it sounds like separation anxiety. A DAP infuser may help. Separation anxiety unfortunately doesn't just go away on its own. In fact, untreated it often gets worse. The most effective training involves leaving the dog for tiny increments. It might start by having you crate the dog, than pretend like you are getting ready to go out, but then you stay home and let the dog out of the crate instead. Repeat frequently. Then you might do all that and walk out the door, but come right back inside as soon as the door is shut. After that, you might get in your car, get back out and come back inside etc. Its very time consuming. The idea is to desensitize your dog to your coming and going.

Also, you want to be sure you are NOT making a big fuss over your dog when you leave or return. That can make it worse. Put your dog in his crate just the same as if you were crating him and staying home, then completely ignore him. When you come home, ignore the dog as well. I think most trainers recommend 15-30 minutes. say nothing to him, make no big deal out of it. Let him out of his crate after that, but once again, ignore him. Pretend nothing is out of the ordinary. The hard part is that you are never supposed to leave him alone besides during the training during this period. So if, say, you need to run to the grocery store, someone has to stay with the dog.

Unfortunately too many dogs are abandoned because of separation anxiety, and it tends to get worse every time a dog is rehomed. Because his is at a level where he could injure himself, I would HIGHLY recommend consulting a trainer. This is a very difficult problem to tackle on your own, and you can make it worse if you take the wrong approach.

Out of curiosity, does he do better when he is NOT crated? Some dogs just don't do well when left alone and confined like that. If he does better uncrated and can be left that way safely, I might suggest simply leaving him lose. On the other hand, if he doesn't and is prone to getting into mischief, I'd keep him crated.

[anomaly13]

A few questions....

What is a DAP infuser? And do you mean rescue remedy like the same stuff we take when we are feeling sick? It comes in a glass jar with a yellow lable and a dropper.

We are not making a big deal about leaving or returning. Although yesterday I yas a little worried about him so I let him out right away and put him outside because he seemed like he would explode and I didn't wan't anyone getting hurt, kwim?

As for leaving him uncrated while away the first time I left him in the crate while away he got out. I thought it might happen so I put everything away and closed the bedroom and batheroom doors. He did ruin the miniblinds, but I should have opened them and that wouldn't have happened. He also knocked down some dishes but I do't think he was being mischivious rather he was trying to look out all the windows for us. When I got home he was sitting on the back of the couch/windowsill with the curtins all pushed away, he didn't break them but could have. I guess I should leave them open and there won't be an issue.

As for walks he always gets one but I am noticing that he could probably use 2 everyday, this is hard for me because I stay home with 2 little ones, 3 and 16 months, and am pretty busy with them all day. Also with it being winter evening walks are harder to get in before dark since the sunsets right around the time I am making dinner or getting ready to serve it.

How do I find a trainer for seperation anxiety? Maybe I will call the dog whisper, lol.

Also he is super hyper in the mornings as soon as we get up. I assume this may have to do with his anxiety.

[SophieAnn]

Some good advice so far, but one thing to add...

A good quality, safe crate should never collapse on an animal inside it - and you shouldn't need zip-ties to hold it together either. We have 2 crates, and no matter how jumpy/fidgety a dog can be inside one, it would NEVER collapse. In fact, although it is a collapsible/folding crate, it is actually somewhat difficult to fold. I don't have the strength in my hands to fold it, so I always have to get dh to fold the crate for me.

We have a Precision Great Crate (Precision is the brand-name), it is heavy-duty coated wire with a plastic tray bottom and has 2 doors (no top door since we have a larger-sized).

Here is the crate we have:
http://www.precisionpet.com/detail.aspx?id=9

If you are going to continue crating him (which is probably a good idea!) please look into getting a safer crate that will not collapse on him.

[anomaly13]

thanks for the crate advice, this is the one we have:

http://www.petsmart.com/product/inde...ductId=2753727

however we are replacing it with this one:

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product...64222*&topnav=

It's the best we can afford, plus it's from Costco so it can always be returned/exchanged no matter what. The closest place that sells a precision crate is over two and a half hours away. I have read a lot of reviews for different crates and pretty much every single one had at least one review saying their dog collapsed the crate. It is not easy to do, when I put this crate together I pinched my fingers a few times trying to snap it into place, I guess my dog is just really strong and presistant. Hopefully we won't have the same problem with the new crate but honestly to be sure, and for our dogs safety, I think we will put zip-ties on it from the strat this time so he won't be able to collapse it, hopefully.

[SophieAnn]

Glad to hear you're able to replace the crate with a sturdier one (and return it if it doesn't work). I hope the new crate works out for you.

Are you giving him something to play with/occupy himself in the crate?

Kongs are great, because you can stuff them with food, peanut butter, etc. which rewards the dog for being calm in the crate. Get the black rubber kongs because they're the toughest ones (and I bet your guy is a power-chewer).

A neat trick we used to do was to fill the kong with kibble, block the small hole (plastic wrap and a rubber band), add water (or broth) and freeze it. You can then top it with peanut butter if you want and give it to him in the crate before you leave. The water/freezing helps it to last much much longer. A kong stuffed with dry kibble will hardly last anytime but a frozen one could last hours.

[anomaly13]

I just ordered 2 blck kongs and they shoud arrive by Friday. I have been giving him rawhids to chew on, they keep him really busy when we are home but he seems to forget them when we leave as they are always still there with not much missing when I get back.

The whole leaving and coming right back training sounds like it will work however it will be hard to do with 2 little ones that I will have to take with me everytime so he really thinks we are leaving. Not a big deal just a bit more work. I can really get on board with doing it over and over throughout the day and extending the time a little bit after a few trys. One problem is that I cannot possibly dorp everything on my calendar until he is better. I mean I have already given up all the fun stuff I do with the kids, zoo, library, park, aquarium, play groups, visiting grandma, etc., but I cannot cancel all my appointments until further notice. I am due in April so have a few prenatal appts. to go to as well as dr. checkups for the kids. and not to mention picking up my niece after school every afternoon. DH leave for work at 7am and gets home about 6 or 7 at night, some days he gets home as early as 4:30 but I cannot wait for him to try and get things done. For now I think grocery shopping and the bank will have to wait for the weekend or possible late evenings depending on DH's work schedual. But this week he is out of town so I am not sure when I will get to the store. I don't want to mess up the training but I will have to leave him for longer periods of time during the training.

Any idea how long it takes to get them desensitized to our coming and going?

[Ola_]

Originally Posted by anomaly13

Any idea how long it takes to get them desensitized to our coming and going?

That's tough to say as it depends on the dog and their anxiety. For some dogs, never.

You can also try leaving him uncrated with a Kong/treats a few times (windows open as you mentioned that seems to help) and see how he does. Not eating treats that they usually love while you are gone is one of the classic SA signs, so if he eats when left uncrated I'd consider that a sign that it may work better for him.

Of course doggie-proof lots and get rid of anything valuable/breakable/dangerous first. Just wanted to mention it since for some dogs it can work better.

[anomaly13]

Thanks for the advice. I may try to leave him out while we are away next time. When I got back today he had not touched his rawhide. I left him in the crate for about 10 minutes after we came in, I waited until he was sitting calmly. When I let him out he went right back in for his raw hide and then ran for the door, which is what is always does when he gets a raw hide he like to chew them for awhile and then hide them in the yard.

I am thinking of video taping him while we are away tomorrow just to see what he does while we are gone. I know pp said not to leave him for long periods at first but I really have no choice. He seemed a little better when we returned today then he was yesterday, not as explosive.

[anomaly13]

Update.....Things have been going pertty well with pur anxious dog. We got a new kennel that he did bend up pretty bad the first time he was left alone. We did put zipties on it from the start to there would, hopefully, be no chance of him collapsing it. He still leves he kong or rawhide alone until we get home and let him out.
However somethings are happening that aren't good. Yesterday I had to take my son to his checkup, a weight check so we would be gone for an hour at most. I came home and he had gotten out. But how? I checked his kennel, it was still standing and the doors were not open. I looked closelt and found that he had managed to unlatch the top latch on both doors. So he squeezed trough a half open door or he opened the door all the way and then closed it and latched the bottom latch. I am thinking it was the former. So I checked him out, he was fine. I let him outside and within the 45 minutes he was out there I hear the neighbors dogs going off so I look out and see they are barking towards my sister's house. My dog jumped the fence. He did it again later in the day when my sil came home from work.

Today he didn't get out of him kennel but did jump the fence after being outside for about 45 minutes after we got home. I went to call him in to eat and he didn't come. So I got the kids and was going to go find him. Just as we were leavign the yard he came running from the ditch past my sister's house. This was the first time he jumped the fence and left. Usually he goes to my sister's house and sits at her front door or goes to her gate and sniffs her dogs through the fence.

I am thinking this is not working. He is obviously acting up after being left in his kennel. What do I do? I am trying to desensitize him to our comings and goings with short trips out the door and right back in but I have tings to do and cannot cancel everything I have planned/schedualed. I do plan on haveing dh had height to the fence in the back yard that seperate it from the front, that way when we put him olutside he will just be in the back yard and won't be able to escape, hopefully.