Too far gone? Please advise on filing...

[sunfish21]

Oh mamas, please just let me get this out and help if you can!

My stbx and I have one DD (21 months) and I am due again the end of Feb. We separated largely due to his refusal to treat both physical and mental health issues and his financial irresponsibility. I was ready to live apart for one year and see if he could take care of himself and show some reliability. If so, I would consider reconciliation with continued counseling.

He admitted himself to the hospital for his depression a couple of months ago and moved out when he left there after five days. We had decided previously to split up. We have only attended one counseling session together since he moved out--he was supposed to be seeing a counselor alone but has been skipping his individual appts, I recently found out. At this together session last week he admitted to fairly constant substance abuse (pills, alcohol, weed) and chronic lying--almost, he felt, to a "pathological liar" degree. This was in addition to the issues I knew about.

Obviously this is a short version of our three year unhappy marriage, but I feel I am in a bind. One part of me does believe that he has some serious problems and isn't himself. To file for divorce, try to get full placement, etc....just feels cruel. He needs help--you wouldn't leave your husband for a heart condition or cancer....

The other part of me thinks he is a deceptive sick man and I need to do anything to protect myself and the children.

How do I go about trying to sort out the best plan when I am wavering so much and have a lot of anger over feeling lied to and completely unaware of the man I married?

Thanks--I am really struggling right now.

[RollerCoasterMama]

Oh my goodness! That sounds like a really tough spot!!! My STBX has some similar issues, but not substance abuse. They tend to play out very similarly though (plus the extra level of danger/stress of course!!). When I saw a counselor last summer for the situational depression when everything was coming to a head, she said something that stuck. She said that these guys rarely get better with someone enabling the situation by taking care of everything else. They almost invariably survive on their own. And every now and then, the shake-up of losing their partner will be what they need to get things together.

I would say that since you're in separate living situations already, to keep that up---esp with substance abuse involved and babies! If he's not actively pursuing treatment, that would (and was) the answer for me. Professional help--not just "trying hard".

But---that's totally my opinion and only you know what you and your babies need!!!

[pinetree]

You cannot change his behavior, you can only change how you respond to it. Only you can decide if what you are doing is enabling him to continue or if you are putting responsibility for his behavior back into his hands.

For some people, that will mean divorce because there is nothing else that the spouse responds to. For some, separation (legal or otherwise) is workable. Sometimes this can be work on within the relationship still (though it sounds like that option has proven to not work in your situation). Regardless, you need to remember that you can only control or be responsible for your own actions but that you need to also make sure you are not enabling inappropriate behavior (lying, substance abuse etc)

[anon_abroad]

I share similar issues with (I wish)stbx, so when I read your post the first question that came to mind that could help you reflect on the situation is: what do you love about him, despite all of these issues. Are these things worth fighting really hard for?
In my personal experience I find I can't be PARTNERED with someone with these issues, IMO these issues are incompatible with life as a couple - you can't trust him, you can't count on him...you end up hanging out there all on your own!
On the other hand, I also see people who stick by their spouses through these issues because the issues haven't 'stiffled' the love in the relationship.

[MissLotus]

I really don't see how his behaviors and habits are things you or your children could live with. If I were you, I would not live with him again.

If you were to be legally separated or divorced, you know, that doesn't mean you can't be there for him as a friend, if that's what you choose and are emotionally able and willing to do. Divorce doesn't have to mean abandonment and hatred.. it just means you weren't able to live together as a couple, and he certainly does not sound ready to be part of a couple when he can't even deal with himself.

[sunfish21]

Originally Posted by anon_abroad

what do you love about him, despite all of these issues. Are these things worth fighting really hard for?
In my personal experience I find I can't be PARTNERED with someone with these issues, IMO these issues are incompatible with life as a couple

This is a good question. Feeling like everything has been a lie I am not sure what there is anymore. I know he seemed like a totally different person before we got married. Which was/is the real him? Since we got married he has been unavailable, unreliable, irresponsible, etc...I am not sure that there is anything there that I love. I have a feeling the "him" that I knew a few years ago was an act....I haven't seen him since. I haven't had a partner this entire time. That was one of my frequent complaints; feeling so alone in a marriage.

As others have mentioned, I can't change his behavior, although I certainly spent some time trying and then time making sure he knew all the options that were available to him. I don't think I am enabling--he lives elsewhere and everyone knows the situation. I am home with the baby(ies) so I have no money to give him or in other way cover for him...


I think after some time passes I will be able to be more of a friend to him. I know we will always have to be able to work together because of the kids, but right now this is still really fresh and I feel extremely hurt and "ripped off".

[Halfasianmomma]

hi sunfish...first off...*hugs*. What a difficult situation to be dealing with, especially while preggo!

Second, as the former wife of a highly functional alcoholic, who was also a sometime cocaine/sleeping pill user, (and I suspect someone who still struggles with bouts of depression) I recently discovered the 3 C's of addiction:

You didn't cause it.
You can't cure it.
You can't control it.

From your post, it seems like you already know the lingo. It also seems like you already know what to do with regards to your marriage. Time to focus on what you and your children want/need. If your STBX chooses to recover, good for him. If not, then not.

If you permit me, let me refer you to a site I often post on for support:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/
There is a section at the bottom for Friends and Family of substance abusers. Please check it out; the site and its people have been wonderfully helpful in getting me to understand who/what I was dealing with, with regards to my X, and helped me "mourn the dream" a lot.

[sunfish21]

Originally Posted by Halfasianmomma

If you permit me, let me refer you to a site I often post on for support:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/
There is a section at the bottom for Friends and Family of substance abusers. Please check it out; the site and its people have been wonderfully helpful in getting me to understand who/what I was dealing with, with regards to my X, and helped me "mourn the dream" a lot.

Thanks. I started to cry when I read the last sentence of your post. I think that is the next step for me. We didn't marry until I was 33; I tried really hard to wait for the 'right guy' at the 'right time' and all that. And now....there is nothing. No marriage, no partnership, no father for my two babies. I know there are no guarantees in life, but I am really feeling the whole "life's not fair" thing right now. I will check the website out.

[RollerCoasterMama]

Originally Posted by sunfish21

Thanks. I started to cry when I read the last sentence of your post. I think that is the next step for me. We didn't marry until I was 33; I tried really hard to wait for the 'right guy' at the 'right time' and all that. And now....there is nothing. No marriage, no partnership, no father for my two babies. I know there are no guarantees in life, but I am really feeling the whole "life's not fair" thing right now. I will check the website out.

I got married at 25 not 33, but didn't have my son until almost 31 because of the instability. I just turned 34 yesterday. I finally made the decision last summer, moved a couple of weeks ago and even though I know it's what I had to do...everything you're saying seems to be pretty normal for this stage of the process. My grieving isn't for STBX. It's for the dream. Which sounds like what you're beginning to work on. Even once you make a decision, expect to still have down days. The good thing is that pretty soon the down days start to be outnumbered by the hopeful, happy days if you let them. And with two sweet babies to care for and less chaos in your life, you will have happy days.

But yeah...mourning the dream is tough and I think the majority of people on this forum have gone through that. You'll get lots of understanding from this crowd.

*hugs*

[NewDirections]

I'm in a similar situation. I found out about the pregnancy the day after I told stbxh to leave. At the time we were in couples counseling and had been for 9 months. Stbxh became very abusive in the months before separation and I'd had enough of his behavior. After we separated, he decided to stop attending couples counseling so I told him that our marriage was over. If he wasn't going to make any effort to fix the mess he created then that was a deal breaker for me. It was really hard being alone in the first part of my pregnancy, but it's gotten so much easier as I've had time to adjust. I feel a million times happier now than when I was with stbxh.

It's not your fault that your h is acting this way. You are not responsible for his actions. It's a hard decision figuring out if the marriage is worth saving or not A great book that I'm reading now is called "Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft. I think it could be really helpful to you.

Take care

[sunfish21]

I guess my timing was right on. I got a call from a police officer this AM; it turns out his mother called them after he has not responded to her trying to contact him for awhile now. She doesn't like me--I think she blames his current state on me--and didn't ever call me to ask if I knew if he was ok. So that was a little scary for a coupld of hours. Essentailly it was a "do you think he is dead in his apartment?" call. He hasn't been at work for many days, if not weeks.

I drove over to his apartment to give a stern lecture about what calls from police due to my stress level and how at 33 weeks I don't need it, although he refused to answer the door. I left a note saying that I needed this payperiods unoffical child support. He wrote me an email that there was no money and that he was sorry.

Now I am a single pregnant mama with no money coming in! Argh!

[Theia]

Originally Posted by sunfish21

I guess my timing was right on. I got a call from a police officer this AM; it turns out his mother called them after he has not responded to her trying to contact him for awhile now. She doesn't like me--I think she blames his current state on me--and didn't ever call me to ask if I knew if he was ok. So that was a little scary for a coupld of hours. Essentailly it was a "do you think he is dead in his apartment?" call. He hasn't been at work for many days, if not weeks.

I drove over to his apartment to give a stern lecture about what calls from police due to my stress level and how at 33 weeks I don't need it, although he refused to answer the door. I left a note saying that I needed this payperiods unoffical child support. He wrote me an email that there was no money and that he was sorry.

Now I am a single pregnant mama with no money coming in! Argh!

I am sorry to hear this is so crazy and being pregnant too...

Have you applied for foodstamps and TANF (Temporary Assistance For Needy Families)? TANF was a life saver for me before I had an income. I also don't receive any CS.

[sunfish21]

I did apply for food stamps and the state health insurance two months ago when he started not working regularly this time around. I don't know anything about TANF but will look into it.