"Intervention" for overweight friend. - Page 4

[bcblondie]

About the blog

A) yes, fat can help in certain instances, but the negative affects of being overweight, far outweigh the benefits. You simply cannot say it's "healthier" to be fat.

B) I definately agree that often, fatter people are in better shape than thinner people. My husband is a great example. He's skinny as a stick (neurofibromatosis) and can't gain weight for the life of him, thus, he eats chips all day and never plays sports or goes for walks.

BUT I believe that portion sizes are often the problem for many people. Yes, chicken, potatoes and beans is a great meal, but it doens't have to be a heaping plate full. If you look at restaurant portions they've increased dramatically. Just while I worked at mcdonalds they phased out the smallest cup and the medium became a small, etc, and they brought in a new "big" size.

[LavenderMae]

Yes, I am saying just being overweight does not mean you're unhealthy anymore than being thin means you're healthy.

And I guess the part where it's never been proved (although many have tried) that overweight people eat more or exercise less than thin people.

And if we can't figure out why some people can't gain weight (and no one blames them for it ) then why is it hard to grasp the same applies for fat people who can't lose weight (which most people blame them for). Either extreme on the size spectrum isn't healthy but you're more likely to die from being on the very thin end statistically.
The fact is many people especially in the USA eat unhealthily and don't move enough whether or not they are fat, thin or in between.

[SunshineJ]

Originally Posted by bcblondie

Fact being. Even drug addicts KNOW they are drug addicts. But they don't turn their life around until they hit rock bottom. Anne knows she's overweight. The intervention isn't to tell her what she already knows, it's to say hey! Whatever you are doing isn't working. You need to find solutions, and we need to do it NOW. Speak with a dietician (though she may have already) and be held accountable to someone for her weight loss each week/month. SOMETHING.

But how do you know she isn't already doing this? Fact is, you don't. She has doctor's appointments regularly and that may be something she is addressing already and for all we know there may be other things they are having her address first. For example, if she has high blood pressure they'd most likely want to make sure that was under control before allowing an exercise program in her condition. Frankly whatever steps she may be taking with her physicians are no one else's business, and there's no reason she should be backed in a corner forced to defend herself and offering up personal information like that if she is taking those steps. There are much nicer and more effective ways to address this!

[Catubodua]

while the idea of an intervention as originally proposed is clearly a harsh way to go, i'm not quite understanding the advice to not say anything to someone you cared about. if you see someone go from 200 to 400 pounds, i would think a good friend would bring it up - privately - and in a gentle way to see if there was anything they could do to help.

and, for those who are saying the fat person knows they are fat - this is not always true. i have a good friend who has a very distorted imagine of herself, her size and what she thinks she's eating vs what she really is eating.

for example, at a picnic last summer she ate 3 hotdogs, 2 burgers, tons of sides (potato salad, etc), an uncounted number of brownies and at least 3 pieces of cheesecake and multiple beers over about 4 hours (i am probably forgetting some stuff too). i know this because we sat next to each other that whole time and i was floored when we were packing things up that she said she didn't know why she felt so full off of "a hotdog and a little potato salad."

she really meant it. it was like she was completely erasing all the other food she had eaten from her memory. i said "well, the beer and cheesecake probably helped that too" and she replied that a few beers (she had had at least 8) and half a piece of cheesecake weren't anything to worry over.

i dropped it at that point because i've seen this before. when we go to dinner at a restaurant she will eat the entire basket of bread and then tease me about not leaving her any even though i didn't eat any.

for someone like that, how do you not say anything? i've tried to talk to her kindly about it and she looks at me like i really have 3 heads and has no idea what i'm talking about. i worry about how much she's eating and how fast her weight is climbing and how unhealthy she is. i really worry she is eating her way into a heartattack at 40.

[mamachandi]

subbing

[Kailey's mom]

Originally Posted by bcblondie

About the blog

A) yes, fat can help in certain instances, but the negative affects of being overweight, far outweigh the benefits. You simply cannot say it's "healthier" to be fat.

B) I definately agree that often, fatter people are in better shape than thinner people. My husband is a great example. He's skinny as a stick (neurofibromatosis) and can't gain weight for the life of him, thus, he eats chips all day and never plays sports or goes for walks.

BUT I believe that portion sizes are often the problem for many people. Yes, chicken, potatoes and beans is a great meal, but it doens't have to be a heaping plate full. If you look at restaurant portions they've increased dramatically. Just while I worked at mcdonalds they phased out the smallest cup and the medium became a small, etc, and they brought in a new "big" size.

but I've noticed that overweight people actually eat less. My mom weighs 30 lbs more than I do, and eats about half as much. My grandma barely eats at all, and weighs 40-50 lbs more than I do. I really think genetics play a huge role in weight. I eat A LOT, and mostly crap to be honest, and I weigh 113 lbs. My body fat percentage is too high; I'm out of shape, and don't feel well most of the time. I don't think weight plays a huge factor in good overall health.

[bcblondie]

It's really hard to say how much someone eats sometimes because even an extra couple bites full can make you much fatter 30 years from now.
Here's an example with some math.
3500 calories = 1 lb of fat.

So if you eat an extra 19 calories per day, more than you burn (which could litterally be one mouthfull of food, the the difference between having stairs in your house or not)... That equals almost 7000 (6935) calories extra in a year. So about 2lbs of fat would be gained. Very hard to even notice considering weight tends to fluctuate day by day 5, even 10lbs, depending if it was a heavy or light eating day.

But an extra 2lbs per year means in 30 years you will be 60 lbs overweight.

Add in a couple babies, those last 20 lbs are a bugger to lose, I know!) and could be 100 lbs overweight without having really eaten poorly at all!

But guaranteed, those 100 lbs will impact your life, Every single aspect of life will be more difficult, having to carry that weight.. Imagine strapping a couple sacks of potatoes to yourself.

Now there are obviously some more details here. You may be well within your calories for the day but it depends where they come from. The sugars from fruits are much more easily processed than simple sugars like candy. So that needs to be taken into consideration. But I think my math stands.

[E.V. Lowi]

Originally Posted by LavenderMae

The obesity myths link I posted up thread and this link are a really good place to start if you are wanting to get a different perspective on being fat and the lies, myths and prejudice that come along with it.
http://kateharding.net/faq/but-dont-...-is-unhealthy/

This is great- thanks for sharing!

[Kailey's mom]

I can't argue the math LOL

Originally Posted by bcblondie

It's really hard to say how much someone eats sometimes because even an extra couple bites full can make you much fatter 30 years from now.
Here's an example with some math.
3500 calories = 1 lb of fat.

So if you eat an extra 19 calories per day, more than you burn (which could litterally be one mouthfull of food, the the difference between having stairs in your house or not)... That equals almost 7000 (6935) calories extra in a year. So about 2lbs of fat would be gained. Very hard to even notice considering weight tends to fluctuate day by day 5, even 10lbs, depending if it was a heavy or light eating day.

But an extra 2lbs per year means in 30 years you will be 60 lbs overweight.

Add in a couple babies, those last 20 lbs are a bugger to lose, I know!) and could be 100 lbs overweight without having really eaten poorly at all!

But guaranteed, those 100 lbs will impact your life, Every single aspect of life will be more difficult, having to carry that weight.. Imagine strapping a couple sacks of potatoes to yourself.

Now there are obviously some more details here. You may be well within your calories for the day but it depends where they come from. The sugars from fruits are much more easily processed than simple sugars like candy. So that needs to be taken into consideration. But I think my math stands.

[sapphire_chan]

Originally Posted by Catubodua

for someone like that, how do you not say anything? i've tried to talk to her kindly about it and she looks at me like i really have 3 heads and has no idea what i'm talking about. i worry about how much she's eating and how fast her weight is climbing and how unhealthy she is. i really worry she is eating her way into a heartattack at 40.

Take her swimsuit shopping in a store with three-way mirrors and when she complains about her weight, mention that you've being doing some food journaling?

more seriously, if she's teasing you about eating stuff that she ate how about "actually you ate all of that, are you okay? I've noticed you don't always realize when you're eating, are you worried about something?"

[Catubodua]

Originally Posted by sapphire_chan

more seriously, if she's teasing you about eating stuff that she ate how about "actually you ate all of that, are you okay? I've noticed you don't always realize when you're eating, are you worried about something?"

that's actually a good idea. i can't tell you how weird it is to hear several times during a dinner about how you didn't save any bread for her when you know you haven't touched the stuff (or when she "jokes" with the waiter about how we need more bread b/c i must have been very hungry).

[bcblondie]

I'd just like to commend everyone involved in this discussion. Weight is such a sensitive subject and everyone has been extremely civil. On some other mommy forums I'm part of, I don't know that it would have hit 4 pages without being locked.

[LavenderMae]

Your math is fine as far as I can tell but gaining and losing weight doesn't seem to be that simple or follow the equation some of the time maybe not most the time. If the equation with out a doubt worked then we wouldn't have people eating 2000+ calories a day (not burning that much +) that can't gain weight no matter how much fat/calories they eat. And if that's true then the same can be said for the other end of the spectrum. There's more to it than an equation.

And I think most people sometimes take an extra bite or two but then the same person probably skips a meal or two as well. And again it doesn't seem to hold true that overweight people eat more or exercise less than their thinner counterparts so the point is moot imo. And thinner people seem to die sooner than overweight people according to studies so maybe that extra bite is a health benefit.

But most of all if you wouldn't throw an intervention for a thin friend who eats crap and doesn't exercise then you shouldn't for your fat friend either!

[ChristyMarie]

Originally Posted by Catubodua

for someone like that, how do you not say anything? i've tried to talk to her kindly about it and she looks at me like i really have 3 heads and has no idea what i'm talking about. i worry about how much she's eating and how fast her weight is climbing and how unhealthy she is. i really worry she is eating her way into a heartattack at 40.

It is hard, isn't it? I have a friend in a very similar situation and I truly worry about her health and her being there to watch her little girl grow up. She could hardly trick or treat with us - and we went 2 blocks at a toddler's pace. I thought she was going to pass out.

But I can't say anything. In the past she used to ask questions and talk/vent a bit but any answer I gave her was wrong and at one point she accused me of being anorexic! Um...I'm a size 6. A round size 6 at the moment (thanks infertility drugs!). I just work out and watch what I eat 70% of the time. My rambling point was that even when she asked me straight out about what I do/how to do it she still got mad at me.

I think all we can do is overlook the flaws of our friends and be there as a supportive individual in life. Even when we worry.

To the OP...so glad this intervention was called off. Anne would have been so humilated.

[mamabadger]

Originally Posted by dachshundqueen

My only thought was, "What if this carnival drives your friend to suicide?"

More evidence that fat causes early death!
Okay, that was crass; but I have heard doctors comment that one problem with overweight is that it causes depression, and I suspect "interventions" like this might be a big part of the reason.

Originally Posted by bcblondie

I'd just like to commend everyone involved in this discussion. Weight is such a sensitive subject and everyone has been extremely civil. On some other mommy forums I'm part of, I don't know that it would have hit 4 pages without being locked.

I have been trying to figure out why people feel so intensely about fat. Being bad for your health is not enough to explain the hostility.

[bcblondie]

Originally Posted by mamabadger

I have been trying to figure out why people feel so intensely about fat. Being bad for your health is not enough to explain the hostility.

Some people are cruel teenagers on the inside. Kids pick on whatever is the easiest to make fun of, to make themselves look/feel better. Fat is an easy target.

[eclipse]

Originally Posted by bcblondie

It's really hard to say how much someone eats sometimes because even an extra couple bites full can make you much fatter 30 years from now.
Here's an example with some math.
3500 calories = 1 lb of fat.

So if you eat an extra 19 calories per day, more than you burn (which could litterally be one mouthfull of food, the the difference between having stairs in your house or not)... That equals almost 7000 (6935) calories extra in a year. So about 2lbs of fat would be gained. Very hard to even notice considering weight tends to fluctuate day by day 5, even 10lbs, depending if it was a heavy or light eating day.

But an extra 2lbs per year means in 30 years you will be 60 lbs overweight.

Add in a couple babies, those last 20 lbs are a bugger to lose, I know!) and could be 100 lbs overweight without having really eaten poorly at all!

But guaranteed, those 100 lbs will impact your life, Every single aspect of life will be more difficult, having to carry that weight.. Imagine strapping a couple sacks of potatoes to yourself.

Now there are obviously some more details here. You may be well within your calories for the day but it depends where they come from. The sugars from fruits are much more easily processed than simple sugars like candy. So that needs to be taken into consideration. But I think my math stands.

The fact is that this doesnt' factor in individual metobolic efficiency. Many overweight people, myself included, have damaged their metabolism through years and years of under eating low calorie, low-fat diets. I was over 250 lbs and GAINING weight eating only 1200 calories a day. My body thought it was starving, so it hung on to every little thing. When I went to weight management from my insurance company, they wanted my body to literally go into starvation mode - past the hang on to every calorie phase and into concentration camp victim phase in order to drop weight. The health care professionals were recommending 600-800 calories a day on a 100% liquid diet. I'm so glad i decided not to do it, because I can only imagine that once I started eating like a human being my weight would have ricoched even higher. I think I've finally repaired my metabolism by eating way more for awhile, and even gaining a bit of weight while my body was trying to decide if I was faking it out. Now I'm losing weight eating 2000 calories a day. Doctors are so fat phobic, though, that no one is looking for other solutions.

[laohaire]

We consider fat to be a sign of personal weakness.

Gary Taubes has pretty much disproved the personal weakness theory of fat, though.

[Viola]

Originally Posted by Catubodua

for someone like that, how do you not say anything?

I don't see how you could say anything useful in that situation. Clearly something is not right with her. It's like when you try to talk to your mother about something she did to you as a child that you thought was horrible, and she has no clue what you are talking about, or has a completely different memory.

[laohaire]

Oh, and I can also serve as an example of a person who gained weight on semi-starvation allottment of calories. Same with my mother. Last year I was eating 900-1200 calories a day (and breastfeeding... literally starving myself, as this is half the recommended calories for a healthy adult woman) and lifting weights and running. I have 6 extra pounds to show for it.

People like blondie can sneer all the want about self control but the evidence shows that it's not about self control. People are following the recommended calorie restrictions and exercise programs and are bewildered and dispairing when it doesn't work. The problem is not self control but that the recommended diet is wrong, very wrong.