No Such Thing As A Friendly/Civil Divorce (Rant?)

[bmcneal]

DC and I are living with my parents right now while I try and find work and save to get our own place.

Yesterday, my dad told me that he wanted to talk to STBX and I. He started saying that if we are going to go through with the divorce, than I need to stop being nice to STBX, that I need to tell him to leave me and the kids alone, and that I shouldn't call him, or talk to him, or be spending *any* time with him at all, and if I do, then we are getting along fine and that means that I need to go back and be his wife and his family. He said that divorced couples cannot spend any time together (even for the kids, after the divorce, they are *my* kids, not *our* kids anymore?) and that I shouldn't be friendly to him anymore.

First of all, STBX and I *both* believe that what we are doing (being friendly, or at the very least, civil to each other) is what is best for the children. It doesn't do anyone any good for us to yell and scream and curse at each other.

Second, STBX has *no one* here. We are living in Indiana, his family is in South Carolina. A few weeks ago, his family was *begging* him to move down there, "get away from that crazy witch" come live with your family, we love you, we miss you, you can stay with us until you have a place, we'll be supportive of you through your divorce, help you stay strong, other stuff you hope your family would say to you in hard times, and then at the last minute (a few days before he was scheduled to leave) they call and basically tell him to bugger off, that they don't want him down there, there isn't room for him down there, no one wants to be bothered with him. From his *family* after them *begging* for him to come down there, they leave him, with no support system, no emotional help, anything, alone. I can't just leave him to feel so betrayed.

I know I'm not responsible for his mental health, or happiness or anything, but if he needs someone to talk to, and his family is going to treat him that way, what harm is it for him to talk to me, for me to be his friend and help him with the hard stuff when he needs it, as long as we maintain the boundaries we have set? Is it so bad that I don't want the father of my children to feel so alone? If I want him to be happy, if I want to help him as much as I can, does that really mean that I need to go back to him, to live with him in the situation as it was? Can't I still care about him, and do what I can when I can and still need to leave for my safety and the safety of my children?

Is there really no such thing as a friendly or civil divorce? If you can be friendly or civil, does that mean there is no merit to whatever is "causing" the divorce?

[Kreeblim]

This is your life, and how you get along with your STBX is up to you and him...no one outside you two and your kids should matter.

For what it's worth my XDH and DH are actually on such friendly terms that they have hung out together voluntarily on multiple occassions. I have custody of my nephew and he was raised partially by XDH when our son was young so if we were not on friendly terms it would have been AWFUL for the kids. Our son (who was raised almost as a twin to my nephew) would have been going for court ordered visitation alone while my nephew wondered why he couldn't see XDH too. It hasn't always been easy, but being friends with my ex has been worth every minor disagreement. For instance, we've had to switch around visit times for kids classes, family functions, work conflicts, child birth etc. and it's never a problem...all my friends who have "normal" visitation agreements are at the mercy of their court order and if their X doesn't agree then that's too darn bad. It's actually more difficult to get along with my sister (nephew's mother) than my own XDH!

The best part is the kids though. They have so many people that love them. They come back and excitedly tell me what they did over the weekend and bring me cards on mothers day and Christmas from my XDH and his girlfriend. They even stay with us when they are in town and the kids get super excited to go downstairs and wake them up in the morning.

Anyway, sometimes it's not divorce, but how the parents deal with it that destroys the kids. You can show them that you can work out conflicts and still be civil and even friendly despite whatever disagreements led to your incompaitibility as a couple. If you are lucky enough to have a STBX who also wants to remain friendly for the kids, then working towards that and ignoring the nay-sayers is the best gift you can give them.

(I'd also like to add that we get along MUCH better as friends than as a couple, and just because you can be friends with someone doesn't mean you can meld your life with them...surely your Dad has people he can be friends with yet would want to strangle on a daily basis if he had to live with them?)

[russsk]

I don't usually post in PaP, but your dad's "advice" is some of the worst I've ever seen! It's almost funny it's so ridiculous (or it would be if it didn't involve children). I think it's wonderful that you and xdh can get along despite divorce. That's amazing and you should be proud of yourselves. FWIW, my mother and my father split when I was very young and my mom remarried when I was two. She divorced that guy 11 years later. Her split with my dad was amicable, and they often chatted about me on the phone. My dad was always invited to birthday parties and plays, and he never had a problem paying for clothes or guitar lessons or college, or whatever. The split with my stepdad was completely different. He would badmouth my mom to my brother every chance he got, refused to pay for child support, and when his wages were garnished would demand to see receipts to make sure my mom was spending his money on things like the mortgage or electricity (he thought cs was for toys and clothes for my brother only!). It was awful, and my brother was in therapy for years. I've barely said two words to him in the last 10 years and I wouldn't care if he fell off the face of the earth. I talk to my dad at least twice a week.

[GoBecGo]

Trust your gut, not your dad's. My ex and i have a very amicable arrangement. It hasn't always been easy on either of us, there has been a lot of slack cutting in both directions, but our daughter is growing up well-balanced, healthy and LOVED and now has 3 parents who love her and a little sibling on the way, eagerly awaited by ALL of the parents. The biggest issue you will face is with boundary setting - if you can keep on top of that (hard sometimes but VERY doable) you will be fine. It's a very old-fashioned view that divorce/separation MUST be bitter and cruel for all involved. If all the adults in the situation go on ACTING like adults (and it sounds like you guys are doing a fabulous job) then the kids get to go on being kids. Simple as that. Hang in there, you're doing the good stuff!

[sparklefairy]

It Depends.

It sounds like your father is going beyond "don't be 'nice'" (whatever "nice" means -- that's so open to interpretation) and on to "be nasty for the sake of being nasty."

OTOH, it's possible to subvert your own best interests and personal growth and the best interests of the children in the name of being "nice" (again, whatever that means -- one person will define that as "not asking for child support" and another will define it as "not being verbally abusive while seeking a resolution"). It's possible that "helping" him could mean that he doesn't build his own support system. It's possible that "helping" him could mean that you're not focusing on your own needs and life enough. I don't know.

It could be that your father is seeing something unhealthy about the dynamic that doesn't show over the internet and that he's explaining it in the way that he has to get it across. Or it could be that he sees marriage/divorce/relationships as very black-and-white.

[Ceinwen]

We have a more amicable divorce than not. There are lots of ups and downs, but as a pp posted, we cut each other a lot of slack and try to be understanding and flexible. It's not always easy, and as we're coming up on a year of being separated, I know there's a long road ahead.

We're doing it for our children's sakes. Like the op mentioned, my ex has little family, very limited social circle, and I do worry for his mental health, happiness, stability, etc. I do have to walk a fine line in not having my well being tangled up with his... but we were together for ten years. I care for him, in that I wish him well and hope he's happy.

Anyway, follow your own instincts. Set firm guidelines for your own mental/emotional health, but absolutely remain friends with your ex (if possible, I realize there are many situations where this is not). One of my fantasies is that my ex will get into a long term relationship, and then we can hang out as two couples with all the kids.