Help! DD wants to go vegan and I am scared.... - Page 2

[Ianthe]

Originally Posted by kathymuggle

See, this is what I do not want to do.

I am Ok with cooking one or two vegan meals a week (I am up to the challenge!)

I am OK with cooking a vegan sauce (say a red sauce) and then handing it to her to add beans, while the rest of us add meat or cheese.

I am Ok with her fending for herself a couple of times a week - but I need her to totally clean up her own mess.

I think I am going to ask her to start with the supermarket. What foods does she at all already that are vegan? What products are easy switches (example - some breads contain milk, some (fingers crossed!) do not).

I have orderred some vegan cookbooks - so hopefully we will be inspired.

She is very bright 11 yr old - and very capable of reading labels and figuring out how much protein and other nutrients she is getting. while she is capable of figuring out how many nutrients she needs, getting them may be an other story. She is picky and like many people, knows what she should eat but doesn't.

To be honest if she is serious (and she is always serious) about converting to veganism it might be a good thing health wise. She does not eat a varied diet at the moment and veganism would force her to.

I know a lot of families just cook meat on the side, but keep the main part of the meal veggie.. mexican and italian dishes are easy to do this with.

There are lots of dairy-free/vegan bread. in my experience it is the locally made bread that is vegan, not the wonderbread or sara lee bread.

I think taking her shopping is a great idea... I think you will find that there are a lot of vegan options available to her... even for the pickiest of eaters.

[BeanyMama]

Originally Posted by lotusblossom9

I highly recommend this book by Dr. Joel Fuhrman.

http://www.amazon.com/Disease-Proof-...5413118&sr=1-1

Yes! I've been singing it's praises for years. It made a huge difference in how we decided to feed our kids as our oldest got old enough for table food

Your daughter sounds really strong, secure and mature. Kudos to you for respecting her choices and keeping tabs on her health!

[prothyraia]

I would think it might be a good idea to sit down with her and talk about how you can support in her in this (and what your limits are). If you plan your meals for the week, include her in that. Brainstorm some ideas between the two of you of what she wants to have around for breakfasts and snacks. Come up with a handful of simple meal ideas for lunch and dinner, and make the ingredients for those available. Have her set aside at least one meal a week to try something new, and if she likes it she can work it into her normal rotation. Have her come to the grocery store with you (plan for a lengthy trip) and check what you're buying to see if it *is* vegan, and to find an alternative if it isn't. I'm not currently vegan, but it still bugs me that dairy is snuck into so many foods that don't require it.

My favorite vegan snack has always been tortilla chips and hummus or some other variety of bean dip. I could live on that alone for days if I had to. Yumm!

[caiesmommy]

Originally Posted by BedHead

My dd did this when she was about that age, maybe a bit older. I bought some stuff specially for her, but she lasted about a month before she broke down and had bacon with us again. Maybe it was mean of me, but I just made sure to make some of her favorite meat dishes when she was around to smell them cooking and stuff.

I was about 10ish the first time I went vegetarian and my father did this to me and I STILL to this day have not forgiven him for not being supportive

[Sayward]

Do you have a Trader Joe's near you? They have a bunch of great, easy-to-make vegan meals. They are not the *most* nutritious thing, but they sure beat white bread and potato chips. It may be a good idea to have some of these in stock, just in case you need a quick meal for her.

[lilyka]

I thought maybe it would help if we could give you some two way meals!

taco night: use meat and cheese for the family and refried beans for her. fantastic foods also makes a yummy toco filling with TVP. she can skip the cheese but add some guacamole.

speghetti and salad and garlic bread. use margerine on the bread and pull out come sauce for her without meat.

stirfry- cook the veggies and meat seperate. Take hers out and then add the meat.

hamburgers and fries - have some garden burgers or boca burgers on hand. these take a minute or two to heat up in the microwave. there is also boca chicken and morning star farms makes a yummy ribblet thing. I am not a huge fan of fake meat but sometimes it hits the spot.

on nights whete you are having meat as the main dish (such as chicken or steak) just be sure your sides are vegan. She can add a vegan protien source to round things out (fake meat something or another). that way she is not making a whole meal for herself, just some celery and peanutbutter, heating up a fake meat slab, heating up some left over chili or soup or something.

how does she feel about traces of milk and eggs? I am mostly vegan but do not concern myself too much with what is in my bread or pasta (As I try not to eat too many carbs anyway). Talk to her about how concerned she is about these things. She might be willing to be flexible on these things.

[purslaine]

Originally Posted by Sayward

Do you have a Trader Joe's near you? They have a bunch of great, easy-to-make vegan meals. They are not the *most* nutritious thing, but they sure beat white bread and potato chips. It may be a good idea to have some of these in stock, just in case you need a quick meal for her.

No - but thanks for the thought. I am in Canada. I am actually in rural Ontario, and some food choices may be limited.

We did hit a big shopping centre today and bought rice milk (she does not like soy) and some veggie ground (I may put some in a shepards pie or spaghetti sauce).

I also have some black beans and hummous on hand - so that will help. I do not think she is starting just yet, but the time is coming....

kathy

[purslaine]

Originally Posted by lilyka

how does she feel about traces of milk and eggs? I am mostly vegan but do not concern myself too much with what is in my bread or pasta (As I try not to eat too many carbs anyway). Talk to her about how concerned she is about these things. She might be willing to be flexible on these things.

She is not Ok with "traces of". She feels that if she has a bit of milk or eggs, she might as well go full throttle (or that it is a slippery slope to full throttle).

She has been a rigid lavo-oct vegetarians. Once upon a time I was vegetarian, but I did not concern myself with things like rennet, gelatin, or whether the sugar was passed through bones. She does. I have also spoken with her about how reducing items may be more realistic than complete avoidance - no dice.

I am not sure whether this desire to completely avoid any traces of animal procducts is because she is young and things are quite black and white (it may have a tsp of milk in a huge batch and is therefore unacceptable) or if it is part of her personality. I do confess the rigidity of her beliefs do concern me, but that may be another post. I am trying to stay positive, and know it is very possible that going vegan, (which from the outside seems a restricted diet) may actually force her to eat a more varied diet to pacify her mothers concerns about nutritional requirements, lol.

We are starting at the beginning and we will see where the journey goes....

[Ianthe]

Originally Posted by kathymuggle

I am trying to stay positive, and know it is very possible that going vegan, (which seems a restricted food choice) may actually force her to eat a more varied diet to pacify her mothers concerns about nutritional requirements, lol.

We are starting at the beginning and we will see where the journey goes....

I think this is a very good outlook. I know for myself when I went vegan a whole new world of cuisine opened up to me! She might like to try different ethnic foods for this reason. Also, www.vegweb.com is a great vegan recipe website.

Keep us updated!

[lobster_mom]

Originally Posted by BedHead

My dd did this when she was about that age, maybe a bit older. I bought some stuff specially for her, but she lasted about a month before she broke down and had bacon with us again. Maybe it was mean of me, but I just made sure to make some of her favorite meat dishes when she was around to smell them cooking and stuff.

Originally Posted by LizzyQ

I would have been very sad if my parents did this to me. It doesn't show respect or support at all.

I agree



I am trying to think what I would do. I think I would link her to those resources posted up earlier in the thread (she uses the computer I assume?), and let her try to navigate it herself while keeping an eye on her basic nutrition. It really isn't as hard as it used to be when I was first dabbling with veganism as a teen. There are many other sources of protien out there as well as the vitamins she will need. Since she is close to getting periods maybe get her hematocrit checked after she establishes a routine and finds acceptable food sources she enjoys (admit it, we all tend to eat the same things over and over for the majority of out meals, yah?).

I like a lot of the advice in this thread. I would support her but try not to make it like OMG this huge ordeal, just be there for her if she needs help figuring something out, yk?

You said she doesn't like rice milk? How did she like the Silk? My son prefers Silk to regular milk anyway. Myself, I'm just not a big milk drinker. I don't do Silk/soy, rice, almond, any of that (except for horchata- yum) I drink mostly water. I just don't crave anything milky.

Cooking for two diets is a lot of work (though I saw some good advice about trying to accomodate both by putting part of the meal aside before adding the animal sources). This also might be a great opportunity for her to start learning to be an excellent vegan cook.

-I have no idea where she is going to get the iron, calcium, B12, and the protein she needs. I have no idea what it will do to her, physically, if she does not get the nutrients she needs.

B12- First, encourage her not to supplement with the B12 from spirulina or algae, it doesn't function in the human body like regular B12 and can lead to false B12 levels if she ever has bloodwork done to check it.

B12 (the kind we need) is made by bacteria, if she is not ethically opposed to that, getting her B12 requirement should be easy through supplementation in her food. There is also a synthetic form. The B12 should be taken by food source (as an additive). To put it simply, it needs to go through the mouth first to be effectively absorbed and utilized by the body. Luckily B12 stays in the body a long time so it is not something she will have to be thinking about often, and deficiency is rare. Unless she is eschewing all vitamin enriched food, which honestly, it's hard to do in the first place and she is 11, she is going to want some of those yummy vegan protein bars!

Calcium and iron can certainly be found in vegan food sources. Look at a website or book with her to determine how she might get enough of these vitamins/minerals in her diet. But it can be hard. (I know this from personal experience) I am sure you know you can easily get these to her by supplementation.

I think you'll do great mama!

I can't believe how long winded I am right now, sorry about the novel, I am usually quite short. But I am amped on caffeine, home alone, and I vividly remember going through this myself when my mother was worried about my children and me eating a vegan diet.

[KaylaBeanie]

I'm a huge picky eater, and since becoming vegetarian, my food palate has expanded incredibly. I've tried more new foods in the past six months than I have in the prior 19.5 years. So, keep optimistic! After a month of beans, peanut butter and fake meat nuggets, she'll be so bored she'll be dying to try something new. Amazon.com offers some great vegan cookbooks too. I eat dairy and eggs, but my favorite of all my cookbooks is vegan. I actually find myself cooking vegan pretty regularly. You should be so proud for encouraging and supporting her. It sounds like this is really important to her.

[Magelet]

While it might not mesh with my personal beleifs, I think it is great of you to support your daughter in developing her beliefs. It sounds like you have a good plan to start exploring this with her.

I do have to say that if she cannot/will not do the work/learning to make sure that she is meeting her nutritional needs, then I would work very hard to find a way to keep her ovo-lacto, until she is mature enough to meet those needs. while you can be slightly picky and laisez-faire about food and nutrition when you eat plenty of eggs and dairy, you could quickly become deficinent in many nutrients when first starting out as a vegan (I imagine it eventually becomes second nature). 11 is old enough to make food choices for sure, however it is not old enough for all kids (some, probably) to make the effort to make sure their diet is balenced. I would suggust helping her keep track of her diet, and if she can't keep it balenced enough, help her find a way that she can fit ovo-lacto with her ethics. If she can, that's great.

(and if you have some small farms, it is possible to visit them, even it doesn't seem common.)

[wytchywoman]

Try this site:

http://www.peta.org/accidentallyVega...tegory=Staples

It's called "I can't believe it's vegan." and it lists a ton of foods and pantry staples that are readily available in normal grocery stores.
As for the rest of your concerns, discuss them openly with her. If she's old enough to make the choice to go vegan then she's old enough to assume some responsibility for it ( ie cooking vegan meals when you have an omni meal planned for the family, cleaning up her mess, doing the research to ensure she gets a balanced diet, etc...)

forgot to add that she should look at the Vegan Lunchbox blog and consider getting the cookbooks. There are a lot of really kid friendly recipes there.

[somegirl99]

In addition to all the other great resources suggested, I'd suggest that you and your daughter both read the Vegetarian Starter Kit. It's not long, is straightforward, and has lots of useful health and nutritional information as well as recipes. You can download the whole booklet as a PDF or order a print copy.

http://www.pcrm.org/health/veginfo/vsk/

ETA: Thanks for being a supportive mom!

[Kailey's mom]

Originally Posted by kathymuggle

-I have no idea where she is going to get the iron, calcium, B12, and the protein she needs. I have no idea what it will do to her, physically, if she does not get the nutrients she needs.
any advice?

Help!

Enriched rice milk It's good btw, I have no need to ever drink cows milk ever again (and I'm not vegan or a vegitarian, yet)

[lilyka]

I think it is great that you are supporting her. She is not going to eat meat even if it is the only thing you ever serve. She is after all a teenager. So just that you are willing to work with her on this will go miles and miles towards making sure she gets the nutrition she needs.

[purslaine]

Originally Posted by Kailey's mom

Enriched rice milk It's good btw, I have no need to ever drink cows milk ever again (and I'm not vegan or a vegitarian, yet)

We have it. I was very happy to see all the B12 and Vitamin D in it! She thinks it tastes sweet - but is palatable. She thinks it will go great in cereal.

[Owen'nZoe]

Best of luck to you - I think it is wonderful that you are working with your daughter to come up with a solution that works for both of you. I'm currently transitioning to vegan myself and have a 5 year old who wants to go vegetarian (after being omni), so I'm enjoying all of the links that others have posted, too.

[ShadowMoon]

My favorite book on veganism and children is Joanne Stepaniak's Raising Vegetarian Children.

http://www.amazon.com/Raising-Vegeta.../dp/0658021559

[boater]

It's nice to see that you are trying to support your daughter as she discovers her own set of personal ethics. I was an 11 year old vegetarian and later a teenaged vegan in a family of adamant carnivores. My Dad and step-mother would often serve a meat main dish and I would be left with a pretty nutritionless iceberg lettuce salad for my dinner (luckily my mom was more considerate of my nutritional requirements). When I was that age I did not have the cooking skills or sophistication to shop, plan, cook, and do the necessary research to fend for myself in a way that would really meet the needs of a growing child.
Perhaps you could challenge her to try one new dish with beans/lentils per week. You could make it fun, get vegan cookbooks out of the library together, pick a yummy sounding recipe, cook and clean up together and enjoy the new dish as a family. Some cookbooks for yummy, familiar and easy vegan recipes are "How it all Vegan", anything by the authors of "Vegan with a Vengance"/ "veganomicon"
In the mean time, you could try some foods that have hidden beans/legumes as a part of her every day diet. Some ideas: Ezekeil bread (I like sesame, cinnamon raisin, and that brand's english muffins. You can find it in the freezer section of whole foods and some other grocery stores) is very yummy for toast and sandwiches and high in protien. It is made with whole grains and lentils. She might like soy yogurt, another source of beans. You could also try tempeh bacon (light life brand) BLTs with ezekiel toast, veganaise and dijon mustard (you could have yours with turkey bacon or regular bacon) She might also enjoy smoothies. The possibilities are endless and she could easily make them ( and clean up) herself. She could add silken tofu, peanut butter, even kale. When I was 11 and didn't like tofu that much I loved it deep fried in chinese food, then later liked it in many other forms but that might be a good start. Your whole family might also like "vegan dad" sausages, just google that blog for the recipe. They are pretty easy to make, high in protien and have "hidden" beans. They are also considered yummy by meat eaters. Over time as she grows and her palate gets used to the new flavors I bet she will start to eat all kinds of healthy stuff. She may just need your patient support and encouragement. As she enters her teenage years you could use this as a way to strengthen and maintain your attachment. Trying new foods together, researching recipes and nutrition, being supportive of her definition of who she is.
HTH.