Worms???!!!

[lmk1]

Gosh, it's been one thing after another here. Last night, MIL was washing up ds after his 4th poopy diaper of the day, and she brought him over because there was a white "thread" type thing sticking out of his anus. It looked like it may have been moving, but only a small part was sticking out, and it could've been ds clenching his bottom....he thought it was hysterical 3 grownups examining his bottom. We didn't manage to get it out to examine it, which I'm very upset at myself for, as it would've answered the question whether it's a worm or not...but ds had enough of everything and started squirming, so we just put his diaper on. Now he's had pretty loose stools for a couple of weeks, and we just attributed that to his being sick, then being on prednisone and xopenex. Yesterday, he had 4 poopy diapers and they were all very weird looking. Lots of unprocessed olive bits (he loves olives). I mean totally unprocessed. I save the diaper and going to call his ped now...
But what should I be prepared for? He's a pretty skinny guy, less than 5th%, and I'm not happy about his losing anything he's eating to parasites.

[lmk1]

Ds just woke up and we did the "scotch tape" thing to see if there are any eggs (from pinworms). I don't see the white "thread" anymore...is that confirmation that in fact, it was a worm?

[sbgrace]

I would run a metametrix comprehensive stool. If you don't have a doctor that will order it you can likely call the company and ask for names of doctors in your area who use their lab. Our insurance did cover it (out of network) but we had to pay up front first. It was worth every penny and more.

In our case there was more than one parasite and worms (can be serious) don't typically cause the loose stools you're describing. He also has the weight issues (so did my kid) and so you may well be dealing with multiple parasites like we were. Metametrix will also pick up bacteria overgrowths and other things that might be causing what you're seeing. You need to know what you're dealing with so you can treat adequately. I'd do this ASAP. And if you do any treatments you have to wait four weeks to test so I wouldn't try anything herbal or otherwise until I've tested. Herbals simply can't kill some parasites completely (the ones my son had).

[lmk1]

I'm still waiting for the Dr. to call me back. I will ask her about the metametrix test. The thing that concerns me though, is that I don't think everything can be picked up by stool testing. From what I've read, pinworms are rarely diagnosed via stool testing, because the eggs are not deposited in the stool. The other thing is that both dh and I were pretty skinny kids, so it's hard to assess how much is genetic, KWIM? Definitely the stools don't look normal though.

What kind of worms did you find? How did you decide to start the testing? What was the treatment like? I'm also very concerned that everybody in our family needs to be treated, as parasites are so easily spread. And I'm pregnant, so REALLY don't want to take anything now. What symptoms did you see that resolved with treatment? What kind of side effects did the treatment have?

[lmk1]

The photos of pinwoms online look a lot like what I saw. I'm wondering if the loose stools is something else? Like the day before yesterday, ds ate 4 mandarin oranges. I've noticed that when he overeats those, he gets a rash around his face...I don't remember the poop though. It really seemed like the yucky poop started after we let him try some capeberries...and I had assumed that they irritated his stomach..but who knows?

[sbgrace]

That's true of typical tests. Worse than that they are not good at catching regular parasites either and don't test for some of the most common parasites at all. My son had three regular ped. ordered parasite tests (he's been sick since early last year ) and we never found anything. Then we ran metametrix. They do DNA testing. You can read about it on their website (please do). Because they are looking for DNA they will catch any trace in a stool of a parasite--all parasites including worms and ones that not all labs run or that you have to order a specific lab to find. It's really far superior. They aren't having to catch a whole bug that will grow in culture to find something.

In my son metametrix caught worms and parasites (edited out the specifics but he had about every thing in the book). Just so you know--we ran the whole house because my son was carrying so much nasty stuff and other family members had (milder than him) symptoms. No one else was carrying the nasty stuff but everyone had parasite unknown. We all did Alinia. None of us had any side effects at all. Hookworm and pinworm treatments (and I assume other worms) are really easy too. They do take treat 1-3 days (depending on worm) and then treat again in two weeks treatment.

Andrew was very sick as you might imagine. His stools are now once a day or every other day and normal looking. No more vomitting either (he was vomitting several times a week). He is eating better and I think gaining weight. We have to wait a couple of more weeks to rerun the test on him.

Here is my thoughts: test him, see what he has. I expect he's got something (s). Assume everyone else is possibly also infected and be careful with stool (handwashing), hot wash and dry bedding, careful w/showering him and toileting and etc. (edited out specifics here)

Figure out what he has and then treat him. Make sure he's done and then test everyone else. My thinking there is the test is expensive and we tested all of us. I'm glad we did but I'm waiting on retesting the rest of us until I know we killed off Andrew's bad guys. I don't want to wonder if we picked up something from him.

If other family members are actually symptomatic or there are other kids I'd test them now. But if I'm reading right you're just concerned because parasites are very contagious and you're only dealing with adults, right? Adults are far less likely to spread their stuff. As far as pregnancy that is hard. But let's not worry about it until you know. Even if you're carrying something that doesn't mean you'll pass it back to him esp. now that you know to be careful. Some people have had luck with d. earth in pregnancy for pinworms I believe. And there may well be other options if there are other bugs. But you may be like us and even with Andrew carrying a world of mess no one else really had anything much.

I may edit some of this message because of the detail about the junk he's carrying so let me know you've read it w/out quoting the message, ok?

[sbgrace]

I saw your follow up. I think your ped. can do a tape test for pinworm eggs. If you are just seeing the loose stools for a few days I'd eliminate suspect foods and see if it goes away. Parasites tend to come and go symptom wise just so you know.

[lmk1]

Thanks! WOW....What kind of pediatrician did you finally get to send off to Metametrix? Just a regular one or a specialist of some kind? I just spoke to someone who also said that after her kid got treated for parasites, a lot of his allergies went away. Since we've gotten to Miami in November, ds has been sick twice with wheezing both times, and I'm wondering if there's any correlation. Did your son have any respiratory issues at all?
What I find interesting as I'm learning all this stuff is that over a year ago, I started going to a bunch of doctors because I'd lost a lot of weight after ds was born and I was already thin to begin with. Nothing was found, and I asked my gastroenterologist to test me for parasites...he was very reluctant as he seemed to think that would not be the issue. The only thing they found was d. fragilis, which I took Flagyl for. I've since cut out gluten, just about stopped breastfeeding, and yet, the only pounds I've put on are the "pregnancy" pounds. I really feel most days I don't have that much of an appetite...and I'm wondering if I couldn't have some parasites myself that the regular test my gastro did just didn't catch. I'm trying to figure out what Dr. I could get here to test me. Because that would just explain so much. Thank you so much for telling me about metametrix...I hope to find some Dr. knowledgeable about it. I can totally believe that my kid has had at least pinworms for a while...I've always thought his poop looked weird, but everyone always told me that I was just so obsessed with it because of my own digestive issues, and that his poop was weird because he was breastfed still, or he got a very varied diet, or ....

Did you wash the pillows too? Use bleach on the shower? We just did all the bedding today, but not the pillows yet...as we live in a condo, and we can't do those here. We don't have any other kids, ds is still in diapers. Thank you for all the suggestions. I'm glad Andrew is doing better. I hope we can get my son's problems resolved too very quickly.

[sbgrace]

Did you retest for fragilis? How far out. Flagyl has a huge fail rate for that--especially if you test a month or two out.

Our doctor did say there is an allergy link and Caleb has had horrible allergies including new serious food reactions and asthma since he started w/diarrhea in June. He only tested positive for unknown though and I don't know how to sort out the food reactions vs. the parasite. But the doctor felt it was significant and that's why we all did Alinia.

Andrew isn't my allergy kid. But hookworm has protective effects allergy wise so who knows how that balanced it all out (I have no idea how long he had hookworm, it's not able to live in Indiana so he had to pick it up on vacation and we hadn't been to a beach type vacation in a long time. I don't know....but yes I think it could well be linked in your son based on the reading I've done. And I think based on your history you need tested too.

We went to a doctor at our local hospital that was recommended to me. He's integrative med. MD so looks at things more broadly even though he's a licensed MD. My son's geneticist, though, was interested in the results and our insurance paid for the test (out of network). It's a really good test...I'm going to edit out the extra information now. Let me know if you need any of it again or have any questions or whatever.

[sbgrace]

I forgot some of your questions.
Call the metametrix company and see if they know of doctors in their area who order their labs.

On the pillows. I didn't worry about pillows for anyone but Andrew's bed. I replaced his pillows. Probably over kill but you can imagine how I felt when I read that lab with all that stuff on him.

Bleach won't kill many parasites. Washing things away/physical removal is the most effective thing for parasites and so that's what I attempted to do. We spray down after showers and I'm the only one who takes a shower after Andrew (I'd rather get something myself than anyone else here). I would not do baths if he's at all old enough to do a shower.

The diapers help. I'd try to do clothing that he can't dig in his diaper in esp. for sleeping as many parasites will cause itching. That was an issue with Andrew. Get some vinyl or nitral gloves for you (or other adults) for diaper changes. You'll wash hands anyway but a layer of extra protection can't hurt and also you're not washing junk into your sink either (at least that's my thinking).

I wanted to mention that we did Flagyl first. It was so horrible. Worst drug I've ever taken personally side effects wise. Alinia was a piece of cake. No problems at all for any of us. We did do it for 28 days because shorter would likely fail for blasto hominus and fragilis.

Parasites are often carried under nails. Keep his nails clipped. I clipped my own short too....

Oh, blasto is carried in the end of the stool. So when you do samples (if you do) make sure you're including the last part of stool. Metametrix should find it anyway but in my reading I still felt it was significant. There has to be something there to find after all even with DNA.

[lmk1]

Finally just got a call from the Dr. She said to bring him in and we'll do all the testing. I'll ask her about the metametrix when I bring him in tomorrow.
I soooo regretted doing the Flagyl, as I was b/f ds a lot then. I did get retested, but who knows...I went to several other gastroenterologists after because I started having more symptoms, and they all said that usually d. fragilis is usually benign.

After a while, one just feels so helpless, going from Dr. to Dr. without any answers.

Ds still sleeps with us most days...so I guess we'll wash all the pillows. I already cut my nails today very short...
We'll have to come up with a different plan for diaper changes...as we've always washed his bottom after poopy diapers and also in the morning. We don't bathe him every day (and we only have a shower here, no bathtub), so we wash his bottom often, as well as hands and face. Yuck, yuck yuck! I have my fingers crossed that the ped has heard of or is willing to do the metametrix.

[sbgrace]

You might print out metametrix information for the appointment. Let me know how it goes, ok? I would not mess w/ a typical parasite lab as it's not going to test for all of them. It was not helpful here even w/all that stuff my son had. I might do a pinworm look though. I don't know what to suggest on diaper changes. Gloves for sure and I'd do wipes I think even if you finish up with a spray off or whatever. They sell disposable diaper changing paper and med. supply stores sell cheap exam paper. I'd think about changing out the surface under the bottom in some way. Ugh. I'm sorry.