Baby with reflux, stomach acid question

[Junegoddess]

Please forgive me for not searching more thoroughly before asking a question... I don't have much computer time.

My 6 week-old son has reflux. He has not been officially diagnosed, but it is absolutely clear that he has it. He's miserable, I'm miserable... I'm on the verge of taking him in for a diagnosis and medication. But... they'll most likely give him Zantac or something like it, which doesn't really do a darn thing about the refluxing, just makes it hurt less by lowering the acidity of the stomach.
I would like my son to not hurt as much... and I'd like to give his esophagus the chance to heal. I've thought that maybe he'd only need to be on the medication for a couple of weeks... and then we could see if my diet changes and attention to positioning have made a difference.

BUT... I know that stomach acid does not exist just to burn our throats. It serves many functions. I seem to remember, way back in the foggy depths of my brain, a discussion here about how proper stomach acidity was needed in order to convert certain vitamins and such into usable forms. For some reason I have B 12 and zinc in my head, but I could be totally off. I've tried to dig up that reference, but I haven't been able to find it. Do any of the smart women here know what I'm talking about?

I don't want to shut down his digestion with Zantac... and that's pretty close to what it does. Reduced stomach acid reduces the ability to digest. And I certainly don't want him to be malnourished due to not being able to get certain key nutrients out of my milk. But... I also don't want to cause permanent damage to his esophagus from all the stomach acid that comes up.

I'm already gluten, dairy, soy, and coconut-free, due to my own allergies. Just wanted to put that out there, so no one will waste pixels telling me to try cutting out one of those. I'm getting ready to try a drastically-simplified diet, but it has been hard to get organized so that I have enough to eat.

I really thought I wasn't going to have to deal with any of this again. So naive....

[mellowjello]

I was in the same situation as you with DD, but I didn't know as much as you about the potential harm of acid blockers. We used Zantac, which helped for two weeks, then stopped working, later we switched to Nexium, which helped for two weeks, then stopped working, we tried combining them, which was horrible, meanwhile my daughter suffered and we never addressed the underlying causes. She stayed on Nexium for 9 months and just got sicker.

You are absolutely right about adequate stomach acid being needed for proper absorption of nutrients, including B12. It is also really important for maintaining proper pH balance in the body, immune function (bad gut bugs can't live as well in an acidic environment), and I'm sure other stuff I don't know about!

Short term use is probably fine, and if he is in pain I would not hesitate to start him on a good PPI until things calm down. This way he'll be able to get some rest to help heal, and also will reduce stress for all of you which is super important in healing.

What I wish someone had done was sit me down and tell me in the most gentle, loving way, that my daughter likely had a gut flora imbalance that was causing the reflux, and that I could heal this in myself and in her with the GAPS diet (full diet only for BFing moms), probiotics, fermented foods, and lots of rest and stress reduction. Addressing our oxalate issues was also critical.

Do you know/suspect what your underlying causes are?

[Junegoddess]

Originally Posted by mellowjello

What I wish someone had done was sit me down and tell me in the most gentle, loving way, that my daughter likely had a gut flora imbalance that was causing the reflux, and that I could heal this in myself and in her with the GAPS diet (full diet only for BFing moms), probiotics, fermented foods, and lots of rest and stress reduction. Addressing our oxalate issues was also critical.

Do you know/suspect what your underlying causes are?

Heh... I've been looking at the GAPS diet. Yet again. I've known about it for a couple of years now, but never wanted to do it. I still don't want to do it. Ack.

I am sure my gut flora sucks. It was fairly decent until I relented and allowed a dose of intravenous antibiotics during my c-section (but not until AFTER my son's cord was cut, so he didn't get any.) I had some really good probiotics on hand, knowing that I'd need them... but didn't take enough, I suppose. And ate too much sugar. I hadn't had antibiotics in over 10 years... but I was pessimistic and felt like I'd probably wind up with an infection and a long-term round of antibiotics if I refused... which would be worse than a one-time dose, I figured.

Anyway... I've had some yeast issues since, but not too bad until this last Saturday when I ate a slice of my older son's gluten-free sugar-bomb birthday cake. Made me feel awful, and made my nursling positively miserable. And my bod has exploded with yeast. So, yeah... gut flora issues for sure.

I was very wisely giving him Lifestart probiotics... until I realized they have dairy in them.

Anyway... GAPS, huh? Ack. I had been wondering if I'd need to (or be able to) do the intro while nursing. My digestion SEEMS to be pretty darn good, other than having food sensitivities. My poop is good. LOL But I can tell that something has changed for the worse recently... the yeastie beastie has attacked.

I'm not sure how much longer to keep trying things at home before I relent and get him medicine. He has felt better the last 24 hours... but he has tons of painful gas. I don't know if it stems from the same cause as the reflux or not.

[kjbrown92]

You've already taken 3 out of the 4 biggies out of your diet. The other one is corn. Over on the allergy subforum there are discussions about different kinds of probiotics that are allergen free.

[mellowjello]

You can do it!

Yes, GAPS is a huge undertaking initially, I can't lie. But as a nursing mom you should really only do the full diet, not the intro, and this leaves tons of yummy foods you can have. The cravings are tough initially but then you get through it and feel tons better, and you don't crave those foods anymore. GAPS has enabled me to come off antidepressants and is allowing me to heal many other nagging health issues that I didn't even realize were connected.

The yeast and the food sensitivities are signs that you do have some dysbiosis going on. Healing your gut will really help your son through nursing because he'll be able to get healthy, good flora through you. I wish so badly that I could go back in time and do this for DD before I weaned her. I launched her off on her own with a really bad gut flora issue, and the reflux is gone for her now but she continues to struggle with severe malabsorption and GI infections. I did a lot too... we were GFCF, I cut out the top 8 allergens, we were sugar, preservative, everything artificial free, low glycemic, organic... but this was not enough to heal our guts. I really dragged my feet on cutting out corn because corn chips were my last standing vice. I spent two whole years with severe dietary restrictions, and that whole time I could have spent healing instead of spinning my wheels and delaying the inevitable if I had started GAPS when I first saw the problem.... ah well.

So that is my little cheerleading shpeal for you. =)

[mellowjello]

Originally Posted by Junegoddess

I'm not sure how much longer to keep trying things at home before I relent and get him medicine. He has felt better the last 24 hours... but he has tons of painful gas. I don't know if it stems from the same cause as the reflux or not.

Are you already doing all the natural remedies for reflux, like positioning and elevating and all that? There is a really complete list of ideas like this at Pollywogbaby.com (I'm not affiliated, it's just a great resource.)

We thought DD had gas, too, but it wasn't really helped by Mylacon but it was helped by PPIs (at least initially, before her body started to produce more acid to compensate for the PPI).

Are you doing anything for you and him to support detox, like epsom baths? I had an MD/ND tell me that all reflux is extra "heat" from the liver being transfered to the GI tract. So it seems liver support would be important for you both?

[Junegoddess]

Originally Posted by mellowjello

I spent two whole years with severe dietary restrictions, and that whole time I could have spent healing instead of spinning my wheels and delaying the inevitable if I had started GAPS when I first saw the problem.... ah well.

So that is my little cheerleading shpeal for you. =)

It's a very effective shpeal! I've been gluten, dairy, and soy-free for just over 2 years. During that time I had to avoid eggs for a long time, until I found some chickens that weren't being fed soy, and I became allergic to coconut due to using so much of it to replace other things.
I sincerely thought my gut would have healed enough by now that I wouldn't be allergic to so many things anymore.
Time to wake up and do what needs to be done. But does the GAPS diet heal the gut without the introduction part? I haven't read the book yet, but I got the impression from the website that it's the intro that "seals" the gut.

Are you already doing all the natural remedies for reflux, like positioning and elevating and all that? There is a really complete list of ideas like this at Pollywogbaby.com (I'm not affiliated, it's just a great resource.)

Yup, I've read all that pollywog has to say on the matter. I've got a wedge coming from eBay any day now. I've done what I can to elevate him, but it doesn't seem to be all that effective. Some days he upchucks a lot and it doesn't seem to bother him at all. Other days he upchucks a lot and it makes him scream. So, the upchucking itself doesn't seem to be the culprit. Do food allergies/sensitivities make stomach acid more acidic??

Are you doing anything for you and him to support detox, like epsom baths? I had an MD/ND tell me that all reflux is extra "heat" from the liver being transfered to the GI tract. So it seems liver support would be important for you both?

Ooooh... hadn't thought about that. We haven't started any baths... he's just been a sponge bath baby so far. I'll see if I can get him into the tub with me, without big brother trying to tag along. Liver heat... interesting... makes me want to find a Chinese Medicine doc. I have reason to believe that my liver is seriously limping along, but haven't had any tests to prove it. I've been supporting it with milk thistle, hoping that was good enough. I've been told elsewhere that ALL allergies are based in the liver, because if it's doing it's job, things get cleaned up enough that there's nothing to react to.

[Bokonon]

Is it possible you have overactive letdown? I know the symptoms of that are often the same as those of reflux.

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/fast-letdown.html

[Junegoddess]

Originally Posted by Bokonon

Is it possible you have overactive letdown? I know the symptoms of that are often the same as those of reflux.

I actually did the first few weeks... and my son had the green poop to prove it. But I did the block nursing to calm things down, and now I think I've got it all fixed. He's pooping yellow, too.

By the time I get this all figured out for sure, he'll have grown big enough to not have any of the problems anymore and I'll have no idea what the culprit was.

I'm going to go corn-free, as best I can (as I understand it, it lurks EVERYWHERE even worse than gluten) right away, and the start the GAPS diet in earnest after my book gets here. I want to really understand what I'm doing before diving in. I have printed out a food list, though, so I can start planning menus and inching in that direction.

[missnoodlesmom]

I am downright scared to ask because I don't want to hear that I've been a horrible failure of a mother but are all these things related:
-milk protein intolerance in my son (we've both cut it out, although the allergist said it was bunk basically)
-20 rounds of antibiotics in 20 months
-on prevacid for acid reflux
-antibiotics in labor for being GBS+
-constant ear infections
-next step according to the ENT is adenoid removal and 2nd set of tubes put in.

I want to solve this but I don't want to go too extreme. Some of these posts just seem so extreme....and then half this stuff I don't even know what you guys are talking about! I've spent hours researching allergies/intolerances and ear infections but STILL I feel like I"m spinning my wheels and have barely touched the iceberg of what is going on and what it will take to fix it.

(Sorry to hijack your thread - ya'll are just so beyond knowledgable. I'm a newb and this thread was a complete reminder)

[justice'smom]

I have had 3 boys and all 3 had reflux. My oldest son I was told to let him outgrow his reflux. We ended up putting him on prevacid, but not the correct dose according to marci-kids. Sadly his teeth are ruined due to all the acidic spit up. He has had to go through dental surgery just to save many of his baby teeth from rotting and the dentist told us it was all due to his reflux not being properly treated. I would not suggest letting a baby outgrow reflux. That being said, my second son we tryed zegerid at the correct marci-kids dose and finally had a happy baby. However he did not sleep well at all. With my third son I did many things during pregnancy to try to get him to not have reflux. One of the main things being cutting out ALL dairy. He too ended up having mild reflux. With him I took him to a kinesologist and after only a few appointments he was reflux free. The kinesologist also helped him with his spitting up. I was amazed to say the least. I tryed it, but never in a million years did I think it would truely work. I would highly suggest trying to find a kinesologist as soon as possible to work on your baby. For my boys, diet didn't change it, positioning didn't change it, chiropractic didn't change it. The only thing that truely worked was the kinesology. If you feel you need to do meds. though, I would check out the marci-kids website. Just google marci-kids. They have the most recent research on infant reflux and meds.

[WuWei]

Corn.


Please read reflux baby.

I'd start taking one forkful of Bubbies sauerkraut with each meal you eat. Increase your zinc to improve your stomach acid and digestion. Add whole food dairy-free probiotics. Let baby lick some off of your finger.


Have you eliminated all sources of hidden dairy?
Hidden corn: http://www.cornallergens.com/list/co...ergen-list.php


What other grains are your eating?

Consider adding magnesium and B12 to improve safe digestion and detoxification. Also, vit C and selenium, if you have any mercury fillings in your mouth.


Generally, baby is reacting to YOUR digestion issues. Gut healing Where to start? Help 101


Heartburn/reflux tend to be a sign of *not enough* HCl, because it's the low pH that triggers the valve at the esophagus to close. Undigested grains/proteins often increase gastric gas which "burp" the valve open inappropriately. Improving digestion with adequate stomach acid lessons the occurrence of the valve opening and refluxing stomach acid up the esophagus.


Pat