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Critique my method: DD is hitting/pinching/mean voice - Page 2

post #21 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shami View Post
Mommily, or anyone, if I do what mommily suggested, should I have little conversations with her at other times of the day about gentle hands and practicing with gentle hands. Or, should I drop all of that for a time? She knows my schpeel by heart. If she could really speak, she could spout it back to me, line by line. She probably hears me in her dreams! lol I mean, it's been a whole year already. Good Lord have mercy!
I think what I'd aim for is reinforcing other ways of getting what she wants (i.e. your attention). So, if you're doing something and she comes and asks you to stop and play with her, then try really hard to say "Yes, you asked nicely, I'd love to play with you." If you see her handling frustration, even tiny frustration, without pinching, then tell her what a good job she's doing. Similarly if you see her using careful, gentle hands in whatever capacity (e.g. she's playing mommy with her dolls, or patting a cat, or pretending to style your hair) then make a big deal about that too. Make your praise very specific so she knows exactly what you like about her behavior.

Good luck!
post #22 of 31
you sound like a loving mom!

some recent info on MDC has opened my eyes about challenging the conventional ideas about kids testing us and having power struggles. I am just starting my research, but I have been recommended some books and I thought I would share--they sound really interesting in terms of GD with not using time outs and cultivating a non-power based relationship between parent and child

Unconditional Parenting, The Natural Child, and check out www.continuum-concept.org and the book discussed there

Also, Dr Karp in Happiest Toddler on teh Block has an idea to have "special time" sessions each day with your kids that you might check out--they can be 5 or 10 mins, and might be a way for your DD to know (if they are scheduled) that full attention time to do whatever she wants is coming up soon.
post #23 of 31
once you show her a way of touching that IS gentle, you get a teachable moment in while punishing her (removing her from the situation she can't handle herself in, which is being on you when she wants 100% undivided attention) i think if you get her out of reach and go right back to what you were already doing when she hit you then you will have met two important goals in gentle discipline
post #24 of 31
i should have added that the dialougue can be like: "ouch! i would like it a lot better if you touched me gently like this. until you can be gentle with mommy, you can not be on mommy's lap". remove her from your personal space, and go right back to your day. give her any more attention, and she will have won the battle.
post #25 of 31
Thread Starter 
Man, I wrote a detailed post answering every one of you and lost it in the sending, ugh!

Too tired to start over.

Wanted you to know I am hanging on every word and really considering all of your suggestions.

Thanks for all of the book recs.
Have read these and for the most part, agreed with them all:
Unconditional Parenting
Attachment Parenting
Playful Parenting
Continuum Concept
Science of Parenting
No Cry Sleep Solution
Happiest Baby on the Block
How to talk so kids will listen...
Consensual Living articles/blogs
And, of course, MDC Rocks! because of all of the ones trying to put into practice what we've read.
post #26 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shami View Post
Man, I wrote a detailed post answering every one of you and lost it in the sending, ugh!

Too tired to start over.

Wanted you to know I am hanging on every word and really considering all of your suggestions.

Thanks for all of the book recs.
Have read these and for the most part, agreed with them all:
Unconditional Parenting
Attachment Parenting
Playful Parenting
Continuum Concept
Science of Parenting
No Cry Sleep Solution
Happiest Baby on the Block
How to talk so kids will listen...
Consensual Living articles/blogs
And, of course, MDC Rocks! because of all of the ones trying to put into practice what we've read.
omg, i hate when that happens on forums. it happens to me a lot more than i'd like to admit, and it triggers moodswings

and yes, the mamas have great suggestions for books. thank you for those! i am thinking some might be more for the itty bitty baby stage like happiest baby (happiest toddler would be better) but its a great starting point. i also have a book called Positive Discipline that i read while i was preggo (dh laughed at me! he thought i should be like the other moms catching up on What to Expect, but i'm a doula. lol) its an older book but i highly recommend it. it is by Dr. Jane Nelsen. it helps you follow your intuition 'hey, maybe this harsh punishment isnt really benefiting my daughter' and gives you the answer to what will work. great perspective from the psych and parent portions of the Dr and i know from experience it is exactly what i think you're looking for as a gentle parent.
i also love Naomi Aldort, and all her articles and letters to mothering/parents. i regard her as a saint who knows all so it's hard to try and follow everything to a T. its like being a christian you can never be too godly enough read her articles online b/c those are free. you will find what you need, but it takes a lot of adjustment on your part. GL!
post #27 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momily View Post
I sometimes think of myself as the "Pearl" of the gentle discipline world. I don't hit, I don't yell, but I do intervene early, swiftly, and decisively with my child, and he knows it when he does something I don't like.

I believe that growing up in a household where people hurt people they love is confusing and scary and overwhelming to children, regardless of whether they're the ones hurting or being hurt. While I understand people's concerns about time out, and isolating a child, I have bigger concerns about the message it sends a child when they are able to repeatedly hurt people they love.

My guess is that something is "reinforcing" your child. Another way to put it is that something is happening after she pinches that she leads to her doing it again. Based on your description, I'm going to guess that it's the processing, and the attention she gets afterward, the part you describe as "your heart melts". From your description, I'm imagining a situation where she's upset about something, often your lack of attention, and so she pinches, she gets about 30 seconds or a minute of something unpleasant (being led to her room, or you leaving her room) and then a much longer period where your attention is fully on her, and off whatever was bothering her in the first place.

My other guess is that at 27 months she is old enough to have some impulse control (not perfect impulse control, that takes a life time, but the fact that a child is not good at something yet isn't a reason to not teach the skill, if we waited until people were good at things before we taught the how to do them they'd never learn anything), and that she already knows that pinching hurts, that you don't like it, and that you'd rather have her use her words.

Given that, here's what I'd do (and I'm putting on my flame proof suit here, because I know people will say I'm cruel and heartless). If she hits or pinches or whatever, I'd say one strong "NO" (not yelling, but a quiet firm tone, no added words, just "No") and then I'd separate myself from her for a moment. In my house it worked better to carry my child (facing away from me, so he wasn't all snuggled up with me) or lead him to the sofa, and leave him there and then walked away. When she followed and apologized I would simply say "Thank you, I need you to play by yourself". If she continued to follow me, I'd ignore her. If she pinched or bit me again, I'd repeat "No" and carry her to her spot, and then go on about my day. Once she finally engaged in something independently, I'd let her play for a while and then find an opportunity to include her in what I'm doing, but it would be light -- no dramatic forgiveness, just "I'm going to the mailbox, would you like to come" or "if you'd like to help me sort these socks you may", and then go about your day, including her as you normally would.
My youngest dd is 26 months, and is a biting/hitting/pinching machine. Her older sister (7 years old) receives the brunt of it, so I also move very quickly and decisively. I'm definitely on the far end of the GD spectrum (no hitting/yelling/shaming) but I definitely have extremely firm boundaries, and even at 26 months, my dd knows when she's crossed the line.

Anyway, we pretty much operate exactly the same as above. I've found it to be very effective.
post #28 of 31
Can I ask a dumb question? Why are these children being so violent? I mean, I have kids (OK, a lot of kids) and we have had an occasional pinching or hitting episode, but this kind of constant aggressive behavior is very foreign to me and I've never witnessed it before. Why do they do this? I don't quite know how I'd react to a constant barrage of injuries from my own child.
post #29 of 31
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchymomofmany View Post
Can I ask a dumb question? Why are these children being so violent? I mean, I have kids (OK, a lot of kids) and we have had an occasional pinching or hitting episode, but this kind of constant aggressive behavior is very foreign to me and I've never witnessed it before. Why do they do this? I don't quite know how I'd react to a constant barrage of injuries from my own child.
It's not a dumb question! I have asked this so many times! Why? I consulted with the mamas on MDC from the very beginning. I read and believed all of the advice in the books I listed above. I consulted my OT (occupation therapist) friend and got help with sensory issue stuff and did that! For example, right now she's got a huge piece of bubble wrap that she is happily popping while I type! lol Neither me nor my husband grew up in yelling/spanking household, so we are peaceful people. If you can figure it out, I'll pay you! lol

All I can figure is that it became a button for her to push for attention. Maybe at times it was a power struggle. Since I tried all kinds of things, maybe it was inconsistency on my part. Maybe I should have stuck with something longer. Maybe its a combo of her disposition and my methods that caused it. Maybe it's like personalities, your either shy or out going, and you can't really change that without a lot of work. Some people are more physical than non physical. I have a friend with a girl (same age) who sits so calmly and moves so calmly all the time. It's just who she is.

I think my dd has issues with personal space. She really doesn't like people/kids getting in her space unless she's ready for it. Another example, when she's playing with a lot of kids in a small space, it is a recipe for disaster. If a kid even so much as brushes up against her she pushes/pinches them. Other kids are bouncing off of each other like little molecules. Not her! BTW, hoping for another child...maybe it will help? I could keep going, but those are my basic thoughts on it, and I've thought about it a lot!
post #30 of 31
Hi Shami!

Thanks for responding to my questions! I'm so glad you took them as I meant them...I was worried it sounded (as my 17 year old says), "judgy" but I didn't mean them that way. I want to be able to help and I'm at a loss because I'm just so unfamiliar with the circumstance! I wish you luck - and if I come up with anything I'll let you know...and, if you want to borrow a couple of kids to get her used to the idea - let me know:-)
post #31 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchymomofmany View Post
Can I ask a dumb question? Why are these children being so violent? I mean, I have kids (OK, a lot of kids) and we have had an occasional pinching or hitting episode, but this kind of constant aggressive behavior is very foreign to me and I've never witnessed it before. Why do they do this? I don't quite know how I'd react to a constant barrage of injuries from my own child.
Good question, and not offensive at all! I think my 26 month old does it because she has SPD and it's another sensory input, kwim? She's also a spinner and a jumper, hurts herself often while playing roughly - but doesn't seem to register the pain. In her case, I truly think she doesn't grasp that it 'hurts' someone else to be pinched or bitten, so we're working on instilling the idea.

My dd is also non-verbal (well, has about 6 to 8 words) and finds it extremely difficult to be understood. She goes from calm to screaming in 5 seconds flat when she's misunderstood. It's definitely a learning process for both of us.
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