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Father's Rights - Page 3

post #41 of 72
Thread Starter 
Oh the Irony, you are right... the advice then was the same as now... to get the paternity test. However, for obvious reasons he could not then as his GF (not wife ) was still pregnant and it's invasive to get the sample to do the DNA test then.

Well, while she was still pregnant... she is the one who took off and left him and moved states away.

He had consulted a lawyer at that time, and the lawyer counsled him to wait for her to initiate the paternity test. He was told the same thing that he could not be the one to request it... that his ex would have to do so when she initiated the proceedings for support.


Right now he is still waiting for the domestic office to set up a date for the paternity test... it's still not up to him to set it up. Domestics told him they will notify him when and where to go to have it done.
post #42 of 72
If it is true that a man cannot request a paternity test - that is messed up beyond belief. If true.
post #43 of 72
In the context of the current laws, Sweetmama, you have behaved exactly as you were supposed to. I don't think anybody here believes otherwise. You were more than reasonable (offering to prove paternity on your own dime, offering to take less than you were legally entitled to if he wopuld keep things out of court). You didn't do anything wrong in any way.

But now you risk sharing custody with this guy. In fact, unless he has some serious black marks on his record, he is LIKELY to get some custody if he actually requests it. Was it worth it? If you'd had another choice financially, would you have pursued child support from this UAV?
post #44 of 72
Uh he could have gone into any court and requested Paternity testing, on the grounds of wanting to develop a relationship with his child, I doubt a court would tell him no. His lawyer gave him bad advice.
post #45 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smithie View Post
In the context of the current laws, Sweetmama, you have behaved exactly as you were supposed to. I don't think anybody here believes otherwise. You were more than reasonable (offering to prove paternity on your own dime, offering to take less than you were legally entitled to if he wopuld keep things out of court). You didn't do anything wrong in any way.

But now you risk sharing custody with this guy. In fact, unless he has some serious black marks on his record, he is LIKELY to get some custody if he actually requests it. Was it worth it? If you'd had another choice financially, would you have pursued child support from this UAV?
Damn rights I would have, its what my child is entitled to, I never went for child support because I needed the money, I've done fine on my own, I did it on the principle that he is financially responsible for a child he helped create, and he keeps creating babies. He has a son who is 7 that he rarely sees or pays for, he has another baby who he has never seen, paid for nor has the mother taken him to court, and now has a baby on the way with his current gf. If the circumstances were different and I actually knew about the other 2 kids I never would have looked twice at him. I found out well after the fact that he has his name registered on the child abuse registry in Manitoba, that right there and the fact that he has never once attempted to see, contact or know his son doesn't make it very likely that he will get anything above access, I'm not scared, and I have never once said that he could not see his child. In fact if he actually wanted contact I'd welcome it, but I know he's doing this to be vindictive because I proved in a legal setting what an idiot he is.
post #46 of 72
Fair enough. I don't agree with the basic premise (that a child conceived and carried by a single woman should be legally attached to the man who participated in said conception in the absence of any other kind of social or legal tie), but I think it's something that reasonable people can disagree about. Since you believe it's a matter of honor to pay him pay, then obviously, honor requires that you pursue it.
post #47 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by laohaire View Post
If it is true that a man cannot request a paternity test - that is messed up beyond belief. If true.
It is true, depending on the state you are in -- this one law that is changing slowler than it should. Also laws for husbands being "default" dads if mom has a baby by affair. This poor guys can go through h#$@, even in cases were mom's know he is not the dad and DNA proves it. Right now how our laws are established, a husband can be in prision or seperated by a sea and the husband would have to pay child support. He also could gain custody of this child. Yes, I am a believer that people should be able to contest paternity at birth. On a military board I belong to this has become an issue for one mother.

That could be part of the problem. SHE left their home state. A lawyer in the homestate didn't know the laws in the other state.
post #48 of 72
I came back to this post because of an article today.

It shows how messed up our system is: A man in Fl had his taxes delayed because the system said he owed child support. He was 7 at the time the child was born!

Though that article's convestion I learned that Grandparents canbe responcible for child support for grandkid. Which, I think could create a lot of issues in itself. This is all for the state not to have to pay welfare ---- I do think sometimes the state just needs to let go.
post #49 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeannine View Post
Let's be clear!

What I think is despicable is a mom who understands enough about parental responsibilities to pursue the father's obligation to pay support, but who ignored her own responsibility to facilitate her child's relationship with the father.
It is not her responsibility to make him step up and be a father. You damn sure bet that if someone had a child out there that might be mine I would be doing anything and everything to see that child.

And I highly doubt she is just now going after support. These things take years and years. The system is slow to the point of stagnation. I have been waiting for almost a year and a half and still nothing has happened with my case. So you are ill informed if you think she just went on down to the child support office and then he was served just after. She probably filed last year and she has every right to file for that support. It's not for her it's for the child.
post #50 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by alacrity View Post
It is not her responsibility to make him step up and be a father. You damn sure bet that if someone had a child out there that might be mine I would be doing anything and everything to see that child.

And I highly doubt she is just now going after support. These things take years and years. The system is slow to the point of stagnation. I have been waiting for almost a year and a half and still nothing has happened with my case. So you are ill informed if you think she just went on down to the child support office and then he was served just after. She probably filed last year and she has every right to file for that support. It's not for her it's for the child.
Thank you this was what I was trying to point out in my posts. It is not our job as mother`s to ensure that our children have a relationship with their father`s when they know full well we are pregnant and the child is or potentially could be theirs. It is also not easy to get a case before a judge for child support.
post #51 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by alacrity View Post
It is not her responsibility to make him step up and be a father. You damn sure bet that if someone had a child out there that might be mine I would be doing anything and everything to see that child.

And I highly doubt she is just now going after support. These things take years and years. The system is slow to the point of stagnation. I have been waiting for almost a year and a half and still nothing has happened with my case. So you are ill informed if you think she just went on down to the child support office and then he was served just after. She probably filed last year and she has every right to file for that support. It's not for her it's for the child.
Facilitating does not mean making step up. Facilitating means proper notification. Facilitating means not moving to another state. Do we really want to tell a mom she cannot move because she "might" be pregnant with a guy?

Playing devils advocate, should he be allowed to make her not move out of a certain radius because it "might" be his kid?

I agree that the system is slow! But at the same time this mom did move out of state. This mom did not notify dad at birth (to our knowledge).

I think we as women need to understand women know that child is theirs, guys do not have that privilage.

Until the baby is born and a DNA test is done, there is not much if anything legally that a dad can do. If she has moved out of state that hasn't facilitated a relationship.

Trust me, I understand your shoes. My ex is 12 or so behind in child support. We relialize that there are dead beat dads out there, but as a mom I have certain responciblities. No matter how dumb my ex is, it would be wrong if I "hid" my son or moved and did not notify of address change. While a woman is pregnant she has the unique ablity to move and lie about the possiblities.
post #52 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marsupialmom View Post
Facilitating does not mean making step up. Facilitating means proper notification. Facilitating means not moving to another state. Do we really want to tell a mom she cannot move because she "might" be pregnant with a guy?

Playing devils advocate, should he be allowed to make her not move out of a certain radius because it "might" be his kid?

I agree that the system is slow! But at the same time this mom did move out of state. This mom did not notify dad at birth (to our knowledge).

I think we as women need to understand women know that child is theirs, guys do not have that privilage.

Until the baby is born and a DNA test is done, there is not much if anything legally that a dad can do. If she has moved out of state that hasn't facilitated a relationship.

Trust me, I understand your shoes. My ex is 12 or so behind in child support. We relialize that there are dead beat dads out there, but as a mom I have certain responciblities. No matter how dumb my ex is, it would be wrong if I "hid" my son or moved and did not notify of address change. While a woman is pregnant she has the unique ablity to move and lie about the possiblities.
I moved out of province, in fact I moved 2 provinces away, he knew I was pregnant, I called him to tell him that I had the baby and I even offered to pay for the DNA test, he dicked around and now that I`m in this province he can`t force me to move back because I have a support system here, I knew no one in Manitoba and I wasn`t about to stay where I had no support. He`s had AMPLE opportunities to see his son, instead he chose to spend his money going to BC, ontario and quebec. I`m not going to facilitate anything for him, if he wants to see his child he knows full well where to find me.
post #53 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweetmama26 View Post
I moved out of province, in fact I moved 2 provinces away, he knew I was pregnant, I called him to tell him that I had the baby and I even offered to pay for the DNA test, he dicked around and now that I`m in this province he can`t force me to move back because I have a support system here, I knew no one in Manitoba and I wasn`t about to stay where I had no support. He`s had AMPLE opportunities to see his son, instead he chose to spend his money going to BC, ontario and quebec. I`m not going to facilitate anything for him, if he wants to see his child he knows full well where to find me.
Sweet then he is in the same class as my ex....a dumb@#$# but no matter what anger I have for my ex it does not mean it applies to all situations.

You did the righthing! But NOT all women do. That is what we are talking about on facilitating a relationship.

We talk about men behaving badly and not doing the right thing/s, but women can behave badly also. There is a balance and both parties have responciblities. YOU did yours. YOU let him know. You did your part in facilitating a relationship. The rest is his choice and his problem. Your responciblities in facilitating a relationship. *unless magic happens and that because a different situation and does not apply in this time period of the child life.

If your ex would have stepped you your responciblites would be different.
post #54 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marsupialmom View Post
Sweet then he is in the same class as my ex....a dumb@#$# but no matter what anger I have for my ex it does not mean it applies to all situations.

You did the righthing! But NOT all women do. That is what we are talking about on facilitating a relationship.

We talk about men behaving badly and not doing the right thing/s, but women can behave badly also. There is a balance and both parties have responciblities. YOU did yours. YOU let him know. You did your part in facilitating a relationship. The rest is his choice and his problem. Your responciblities in facilitating a relationship. *unless magic happens and that because a different situation and does not apply in this time period of the child life.

If your ex would have stepped you your responciblites would be different.

I can totally relate to Women behaving badly. My cousin left his wife because he could not handle all the fighting and her telling everyone that he was an asshole and untrue things about him, so he filed for divorce and he`s been living at his mom`s in Alberta since before they split up because he`s got to make money and there is none to be made where they were living. Meanwhile she`s SHIT talking him all over her facebook and calling him an immature loser and a deadbeat, meanwhile he PAYS her alimony and support for his kids and she downright refuses to let him talk to or see his kids because she`s pissed off that he finally stood up to her and left her ass. And when ANYONE takes his side she gets really immature and pissy about it If only my cousin was actually a deadbeat. I told her once she doesn`t know how lucky she has it when it comes to him supporting her and their kids because a lot of women don`t get it that good. She is a prime example of women behaving badly.
post #55 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by alacrity View Post
It is not her responsibility to make him step up and be a father. You damn sure bet that if someone had a child out there that might be mine I would be doing anything and everything to see that child.

And I highly doubt she is just now going after support. These things take years and years. The system is slow to the point of stagnation. I have been waiting for almost a year and a half and still nothing has happened with my case. So you are ill informed if you think she just went on down to the child support office and then he was served just after. She probably filed last year and she has every right to file for that support. It's not for her it's for the child.
So what do you think my friend should have done? Followed her on a move states away just in case he was the Father so he could be there in her face to make sure she initiates the paternity test... because he could not?


And no she did not just file last week... but it was a full year after the child was born. My friend said the dates on all the papers were November 2009. The child was born November 2008.
post #56 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSMa View Post
So what do you think my friend should have done? Followed her on a move states away just in case he was the Father so he could be there in her face to make sure she initiates the paternity test... because he could not?


And no she did not just file last week... but it was a full year after the child was born. My friend said the dates on all the papers were November 2009. The child was born November 2008.
Just to let you know the dates on the papers aren't when it gets seen in court or filed by the mother the dates on the papers are when he actually I filed my papers in July but they aren't dated till about 3 months after because that's when it was finally filed with the court clerks, just because it says a certain date doesn't mean that's the date she filed.

ETA : He didn't have to move but he could have kept in contact with her, he knew she was pregnant and that there was a possibility if even a slim one that he could be the father.

Also it may look like I'm on the mother's side but I'm not, a lot of people are ill informed as to how the court process works if you haven't been in it before.
post #57 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by alacrity View Post
It is not her responsibility to make him step up and be a father. You damn sure bet that if someone had a child out there that might be mine I would be doing anything and everything to see that child.

And I highly doubt she is just now going after support. These things take years and years. The system is slow to the point of stagnation. I have been waiting for almost a year and a half and still nothing has happened with my case. So you are ill informed if you think she just went on down to the child support office and then he was served just after. She probably filed last year and she has every right to file for that support. It's not for her it's for the child.
I never addressed how or when she filed for support. As others have said, maybe the state did for her because she applied for some form of public assistance. How could we possibly know?

Also, I've said all along that if JSMa's friend really is the dad, it's right that he contribute financial support, regardless when he discovered the child was his.

I've also criticized men who show no interest in children they father and said it's not the mother's responsibility to force them.

But a man can't show interest in his child if he doesn't know he has one!! If, say, a woman has a one-night stand with some out-of-town guy whose last name she doesn't know and she has no way to track him down, then she can't really tell him he has a kid. (He probably can't be tracked down to pay support, either...) But if a woman chooses not to tell a man they have a child together, she is unilaterally deciding that he can't have a relationship with his child AND that the child can't know his/her other parent.

According to JSMa, her friend reasonably thought his ex's child was fathered by the guy she was sleeping with when she left him. All the more so because for more than 2 years (while she was pregnant and after the kid was born) she never attempted to contact him and suggest she thought he was the father. She moved away and for all he knew, she was still with the other guy, raising their kid together.

Then, one of two things must have happened:
1- She decided to pursue child support from him; OR
2- She gave his name as her child's father on some form and the government decided to pursue child support from him.
In EITHER case, she thought he was the father - and told OTHER people that he was, but she made no effort to pick up the phone, e-mail or send a letter, telling him he had a child. She left it up to some attorney to notify him, in the form of legal notice that he was being sued for back support.

Either way, that. is. crummy. behavior. NOT the seeking of support! The fact that she knew he had a child, but didn't tell him and thereby give him the chance to be a stand-up guy from the beginning!

As you can see from some of the responses here, plenty of people will look at him as a jerk who didn't care about or support his kid, until a court forced him to. The fact that he will be judged a deadbeat by some, but people resist calling her a jerk is one aspect of feminism that really confuses and disappoints me.
post #58 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeannine View Post
I never addressed how or when she filed for support. As others have said, maybe the state did for her because she applied for some form of public assistance. How could we possibly know?

Also, I've said all along that if JSMa's friend really is the dad, it's right that he contribute financial support, regardless when he discovered the child was his.

I've also criticized men who show no interest in children they father and said it's not the mother's responsibility to force them.

But a man can't show interest in his child if he doesn't know he has one!! If, say, a woman has a one-night stand with some out-of-town guy whose last name she doesn't know and she has no way to track him down, then she can't really tell him he has a kid. (He probably can't be tracked down to pay support, either...) But if a woman chooses not to tell a man they have a child together, she is unilaterally deciding that he can't have a relationship with his child AND that the child can't know his/her other parent.

According to JSMa, her friend reasonably thought his ex's child was fathered by the guy she was sleeping with when she left him. All the more so because for more than 2 years (while she was pregnant and after the kid was born) she never attempted to contact him and suggest she thought he was the father. She moved away and for all he knew, she was still with the other guy, raising their kid together.

Then, one of two things must have happened:
1- She decided to pursue child support from him; OR
2- She gave his name as her child's father on some form and the government decided to pursue child support from him.
In EITHER case, she thought he was the father - and told OTHER people that he was, but she made no effort to pick up the phone, e-mail or send a letter, telling him he had a child. She left it up to some attorney to notify him, in the form of legal notice that he was being sued for back support.

Either way, that. is. crummy. behavior. NOT the seeking of support! The fact that she knew he had a child, but didn't tell him and thereby give him the chance to be a stand-up guy from the beginning!

As you can see from some of the responses here, plenty of people will look at him as a jerk who didn't care about or support his kid, until a court forced him to. The fact that he will be judged a deadbeat by some, but people resist calling her a jerk is one aspect of feminism that really confuses and disappoints me.
post #59 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ione View Post

Lying about BC: totally unacceptable and worthy of more indignation than I can summon tonight. Way more.
Im agreeing with your other parts, but as for lying about the birth control pills.. its his penis/his sperm and his responsibility to cover his guy parts.
Women lie about the pill, they forget, its not fool proof, it does not protect against disease.
Men absolutely need to learn to take full responsibility for thier own actions if they do not want children.

oh and I do not think having to pay back support is fair at all, nor should he have to pay anything at all until paternity is established adn visitation is worked out.
I do think the guy should have demanded paternity from the beginning since he DID KNOW she was pregnant and HE WAS having sex with her. It's his own dang fault for not getting to know this child from the very beginning.
but it is not too late to get to know her now if she is indeed half of his.
post #60 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProtoLawyer View Post
He needs to get a lawyer versed in interstate custody and child support; he will need Michigan counsel if he wants representation in court there, but a local attorney can get him off on the right foot.

(Standard "this isn't legal advice" disclaimer applies.)
Ok, I am also going to Ditto what PL said here, but also add, that there maybe jurisdictional issues here. Even though she is living in MI, the child was not conceived in MI, and he has not had contact most likely enough to allow MI to obtain jurisdiction over him personally.

If baby was born in November 2008, most likely conception was late January/early February, with a BFP in late February/early March.

Do you know how long she and the child have been residing in MI, because they may not even have Jurisdiction for purposes of anything regarding the child if it has not been at least six months.
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