or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Understanding Circumcision › Regret NOT circumcising?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Regret NOT circumcising? - Page 3

post #41 of 62
I don't post here often, but this thread caught my eye. One of the PP said, "people don't just stop in here to note that their son had another uneventful non-circed day." That is exactly why I don't post here!

My DS is 3 and intact, we have never had a problem. I have two close friend with intact sons, both of which have not had problems. However, one of my friends sons recently had a botched circ, leaving an un-finished surgery behind for 6 months, then another to correct it, and another likely soon... My brother is 27 and intact, as is my father (who is European). I talked with my brother before we firmly decided not to circ and he said not only has he never wished he was, he is very glad he is NOT, that he was never teased, and it was never an issue. And my brother did have some childhood issues with smegma build-up, etc. but it wasn't an issue once my mom found a doc who didn't push her to have him circed to deal with it.

I remember reading on here once to just think of DS's uncirced penis like the tip of your finger, and the reminder that we don't freak out if our DD's have red or irritated vulva's, that those things happen. Those two pieces of sage advice helped me stop fussing, and to accept my sons body as normal, and that I was able to care for it.
post #42 of 62
I haven't read all the replies, so I may say stuff that has already been mentioned.

I live in Europe and hardly anyone I know is circed that I know of. It was only after I started to come to discussion boards and forums that I realised that it is normal to circ boys in the US and I was shocked. After that I started coming here and doing my tiny bit to stop it from happening.
I too have read all the posts about redness etc and I have never ever encountered these problems in real life. Here really intact is a non-issue. I don't know anyone who has ever told me about having problems with their intact sons and it never even occured to me that there even COULD be problems till I started coming here. I have three children and I am in touch with an awful lot of mothers, daycare employees etc and the discussion of foreskin just never comes up cause it is a non-issue. It's just how penises are. The only times I have entered into discussions about the matter in real life is when I have brought it up myself. I spoke to a lady at my sons daycare about it as they have an occational circ'ed kid (usually with a different cultural background) and she has never seen foreskin problems in real life.
The whole issue of retraction really doesn't come up at all, as it's just another non-issue. You just don't mess around with your sons penis beyond normal washing - period. Whatever he does with it himself is his business really and you can trust that he wont do anything to hurt it.

I really really think your worries largely come from being in an environment where circ is the norm. Try to let it all go and rather than think about the possible problems that could occur, think of the fact that so far nothing has happened. Your son has a normal healthy penis and you have no reason to think that will change.
post #43 of 62
I think most of the important stuff is covered in previous posts, but think of it this way:

Say you are a breastfeeding mom in a formula feeding family. Let's say you have a baby who is in the 5% for growth compared to cousins who are 95% for growth. You would likely have the same questions from family, fears about his future growth, and regrets about your choice to breastfeed - even though you *know* you made the best choice.

This whole parenting thing is hard. We make the best decisions we can and that is all we can do.
post #44 of 62
OP, sounds like a purely psychological issue. Nothing has gone wrong with your son's foreskin, you just get worried something will, and then think it wouldn't happen if he were circumcised, and get yourself all stressed out about it. Just try to chill. Even if he gets a UTI or something it's not the foreskin's fault, and it's not the end of the world. You can't worry about things if they aren't happening...if you got or had got him circumcised would you stress out constantly in case he developed an adhesion? Meatal stenosis? Touched himself and instead of touching the foreskin, damaged his glans or urethra?

It's just cultural conditioning it seems, you have to tell yourself to let it go. You made the right choice and the chance of a problem is, as I said, unlikely and not the end of the world. I know a 21yo with phimosis and he never has pain or problems and can have sex and masturbate fine...he's got what some people would call a bad condition blah blah but he's absolutely fine (though I think it should still be dealt with, that's another issue). Also all the adults I've been with are intact and never had a problem and are happy...that's the norm!
post #45 of 62

Thread seems a bit old, but wanted to add I have been feeling this way also about my 5 year old.  He tells me often that at school that ALL the other boys look different and they look at him and have even noticed he looks different.  This shocks me a bit, I had always told my (intact) husband there will be other boys the same as him, as it is becoming more common in the US. My husband feels his confidence would be better in adolescence if he was circ'd he might have even played sports he says.

 

Also just recently my son had an infection, was so painful for him, first time he saw me cry, i felt horrible.  But it cleared up quickly with bacitracin. We have a newer nanny and she didn't remind him to clean at bath with water (he is mostly retracting now, but some still attached.) so now he is rinsing every day at bath pulling back a little and putting under running water.

 

Also, I am not suspicious of studies in reputable journals and on pubmed, and some are showing less chance of infection passing with circ'd boys (hiv,hsv, hpv)  but i have always said in my mind, any boy is in trouble if they are depending on being circ'd to prevent an STD,  this is not safe sex anyway.  this thread does help, reminding me if he really wants it at some point when he is older he can make that decision (wheras my husband never felt that was a choice)

 

plus my husband alwasy says it is SO painful to have it done when older, is this true? i mean just because a child doesn't remember doesn't mean it was less painful.  if a person gets alzheimers, doesn't mean when they broke their knee 40 years ago it didn't hurt..  

 

Just to let you know i think about it all, but still wonder sometimes if all would be easier if i had done it. also i know no one IRL that has had problems either way, except one older man who had it done in the army because he was getting infections.

post #46 of 62



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacKinnon View Post

I don't post here often, but this thread caught my eye. One of the PP said, "people don't just stop in here to note that their son had another uneventful non-circed day." That is exactly why I don't post here!

My DS is 3 and intact, we have never had a problem. I have two close friend with intact sons, both of which have not had problems. However, one of my friends sons recently had a botched circ, leaving an un-finished surgery behind for 6 months, then another to correct it, and another likely soon... My brother is 27 and intact, as is my father (who is European). I talked with my brother before we firmly decided not to circ and he said not only has he never wished he was, he is very glad he is NOT, that he was never teased, and it was never an issue. And my brother did have some childhood issues with smegma build-up, etc. but it wasn't an issue once my mom found a doc who didn't push her to have him circed to deal with it.

I remember reading on here once to just think of DS's uncirced penis like the tip of your finger, and the reminder that we don't freak out if our DD's have red or irritated vulva's, that those things happen. Those two pieces of sage advice helped me stop fussing, and to accept my sons body as normal, and that I was able to care for it.

 

Stopping in to say my intact son had another uneventful non-circed day. Now someone has stopped in to say that.  ROTFLMAO.gif

 



 

post #47 of 62

When my brother was little probably about 5 he noticed that him and his cousin looked different. He asked my mom why they looked different to which she replied "when your cousin was a baby the doctor cut part of his off". My little brother got a terrible look on his face and said "I'm glad the doctor didn't cut me".

 

As far as sports I think its a non issue my DH is intact and played sports from 5th grade through high school and never had any issues. 

My brother is currently in HS and plays sports and he has never had an issue either.

post #48 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by emnic77 View Post

In short, I don't spend any time at all worrying about my intact ds's penis. Not anymore time than I spent worrying about my dd getting labial adhesions, or yeast infections, or UTIs. I just don't. I've never worried about it, I've never had a concern (except for when a stupid doctor tried to retract him once) and it occupies no space in my head.

I think people get it into their heads that they are doing something really radical and dangerous by leaving their son intact, when really, you're just leaving him normal. There's no reason to spend time worrying about it, really.


Exactly! 

post #49 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by drs0410 View Post



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacKinnon View Post

I don't post here often, but this thread caught my eye. One of the PP said, "people don't just stop in here to note that their son had another uneventful non-circed day." That is exactly why I don't post here!

My DS is 3 and intact, we have never had a problem. I have two close friend with intact sons, both of which have not had problems. However, one of my friends sons recently had a botched circ, leaving an un-finished surgery behind for 6 months, then another to correct it, and another likely soon... My brother is 27 and intact, as is my father (who is European). I talked with my brother before we firmly decided not to circ and he said not only has he never wished he was, he is very glad he is NOT, that he was never teased, and it was never an issue. And my brother did have some childhood issues with smegma build-up, etc. but it wasn't an issue once my mom found a doc who didn't push her to have him circed to deal with it.

I remember reading on here once to just think of DS's uncirced penis like the tip of your finger, and the reminder that we don't freak out if our DD's have red or irritated vulva's, that those things happen. Those two pieces of sage advice helped me stop fussing, and to accept my sons body as normal, and that I was able to care for it.

 

Stopping in to say my intact son had another uneventful non-circed day. Now someone has stopped in to say that.  ROTFLMAO.gif

 



 


Very true.  And the MOST uneventful non-circ'd day of his life was the day he didn't get cut because we didn't choose circumcision.

post #50 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by drs0410 View Post



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacKinnon View Post

I don't post here often, but this thread caught my eye. One of the PP said, "people don't just stop in here to note that their son had another uneventful non-circed day." That is exactly why I don't post here!

My DS is 3 and intact, we have never had a problem. I have two close friend with intact sons, both of which have not had problems. However, one of my friends sons recently had a botched circ, leaving an un-finished surgery behind for 6 months, then another to correct it, and another likely soon... My brother is 27 and intact, as is my father (who is European). I talked with my brother before we firmly decided not to circ and he said not only has he never wished he was, he is very glad he is NOT, that he was never teased, and it was never an issue. And my brother did have some childhood issues with smegma build-up, etc. but it wasn't an issue once my mom found a doc who didn't push her to have him circed to deal with it.

I remember reading on here once to just think of DS's uncirced penis like the tip of your finger, and the reminder that we don't freak out if our DD's have red or irritated vulva's, that those things happen. Those two pieces of sage advice helped me stop fussing, and to accept my sons body as normal, and that I was able to care for it.

 

Stopping in to say my intact son had another uneventful non-circed day. Now someone has stopped in to say that.  ROTFLMAO.gif

 



 


Wow, we had another uneventful day too! Going on something like 1000 of them! 

post #51 of 62

My family has never remotely commented on the fact that both of my ds are intact.  I would actually be a bit disturbed if they did and I would try my hardest to make them feel pretty creepy about bringing it up.  For goodness sakes, as a pp said, it's been 2 years!  Stop thinking about my sons penis would you!  I would also ask them why he was born with it if it wasn't needed.  I mean, did any of your complaining relatives have their tonsils removed right after birth?  How about their appendix?  Gallbladder?  You know those pesky organs can cause some painful and life threatening problems down the line for some.  Why not just rid yourself of them right off?  So silly, the thought process.  hug2.gif You followed your mama instincts and they are always right.  Don't question them because of "peer pressure" and tell the old men in your family to get their minds off your sons penis! LOL  His body, his choice.  :)

post #52 of 62

 

Quote:
Only the people who are having problems are going to post questions. People don't come on here to post "My son had another uneventful day being intact." I'm not saying that to be snarky, just to remind you that the percentage of people having problems is probably really low compared to all the people not having any issues.

Yup. Did you breastfeed? Look at the breastfeeding forums on MDC - they're chock-full of "problem" issues. Nipple pain, mastitis, concerns that the baby isn't gaining enough, worrying about milk production, low supply, oversupply... it certainly looks like breastfeeding is a fraught and hazardous enterprise! But for most of us, it's not - some people sail through the whole experience, and others (like me) have just one or two issues, but feel it's overwhelmingly worth it and the right choice nevertheless. But because of the nature of the forum, you don't get a true proportion of people saying "DD nursed 5 times today, it was fine, la la la" to counteract the problems and concerns. Nor do you get formula-feeding mothers with their questions and concerns and health scares. You know?

 

And the same can be said for the Family Bed forum, and the babywearing forum, and pretty much every forum we've got - Parents as Partners can be freaking depressing sometimes! So it's important to remember that people post when they have problems, not when things are going swimmingly. Which is why things like studies are very important, to put it all into perspective.

 

We're having a boy this June, who will be intact, like nearly all Kiwi boys. I honestly don't worry about his penis at all, any more than I worry about DD's parts - the culture here doesn't fearmonger about the foreskin, SIL has had no problems with her intact son, it's just... SO not an issue! I can imagine why you're worried with your family members carping at you all the time, though. And I think it's high time you told them firmly that they need never, EVER mention your son's penis again, because it is not up for discussion and frankly way out of line.

post #53 of 62

Smokering, you have a GREAT signature (even though I don't understand a few of them.)

post #54 of 62

I totally understand what you mean.

 

I don't worry I've made the wrong decision, I worry that my son will be hurt by a doctor or nurse who doesn't know anything about foreskin. 

 

I catch myself worried every single time I take him to the doctor that they will hurt him for no good reason other than their ignorance.  I'm jealous that mom's of circ'ed boys never have to deal with this but I also, don't for a minute, regret doing it.  It was the right thing to do.  Sovereignty over your body is something that cannot be replaced.

post #55 of 62


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by stacyann_1 View Post


Also, I am not suspicious of studies in reputable journals and on pubmed, and some are showing less chance of infection passing with circ'd boys (hiv,hsv, hpv)  ...

 

plus my husband alwasy says it is SO painful to have it done when older, is this true? i mean just because a child doesn't remember doesn't mean it was less painful.  if a person gets alzheimers, doesn't mean when they broke their knee 40 years ago it didn't hurt..  


I'm sorry you have mixed feeling sometimes but have you ever read through the thread here on MDC from all the moms who regret circing their sons? They feel really bad too but unfortunately, their situation can not change. At least your son does have the option of changing his status if he desires. In the meantime, it's easy to explain that all boys are different and the penis is no exception. Even with a room full of circed boys, they won't all look exactly the same. Same for intact boys. Is he bothered by the shape and color of different eyes? Skin color or body shape? With those things, most parents just explain that everyone is different and one isn't better than the other. If he's young and so worried about it, maybe just a simple explanation of "that was exactly how you were born, just like daddy was, that's how you're supposed to look" would help.

I do not believe most of the studies that say circ decreases infection. In the US we have a TON of men who are sexually active, circed and have std's. Many countries with a high intact rate have a much lower std rate than we do. Many intact nations also have a much more progressive sex education protocol than we do. Some school districts in the US teach abstinence only and won't discuss condoms or infections. I personally think that is why we have a high std rate. If circumcision really reduced std's, the US would have an almost non-existent rate of them.

As far as the pain goes, no, pain is pain. It is not less painful when done on an infant. Much of pain perception also has to do with fear. An adult knows what is happening and why. An infant doesn't. Plus, an adult gets nice narcotics for after the procedure. A child does not. A circ is worse for a baby because he pees and poops in his diaper and it gets on the open wound. Then mama wipes it off. All of that makes the pain worse.

post #56 of 62

 

 

Quote:
My main reason for feeling like I wish he had been is because I feel like the boys who are circumcised, although there is a window of time after the procedure where there is concern about infection, that is the only time they really have to worry about the penis and it's developement.

 

Some couples get lucky, but often male circumcision results in sexual pain for his female partner, especially as she gets older. (Google "Sex as Nature Intended" for more info about why.) This is not a problem that occurs with botched circumcisions, but normal successful circs. The lack of a foreskin is a problem that will linger for the rest of his life.

post #57 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_Nurse View Post


As far as the pain goes, no, pain is pain. It is not less painful when done on an infant. Much of pain perception also has to do with fear. An adult knows what is happening and why. An infant doesn't. Plus, an adult gets nice narcotics for after the procedure. A child does not. A circ is worse for a baby because he pees and poops in his diaper and it gets on the open wound. Then mama wipes it off. All of that makes the pain worse.


I've always suspected that an infant's circ is inherently more painful, because of the foreskin still being attached. I mean...it's going to hurt a lot to cut it off, but an infant also has the pain of having it torn free. I just...ugh...every time I think of that, I want to puke.

post #58 of 62

That is true. Since the foreskin is attached in infancy but not usually by adulthood, they would have that forced separation in addition to the cutting.

post #59 of 62

I can understand how it can feel to be the "odd one out," and often AP/NFL moms stick out in some ways or more obvious ways (like being a breastfeeder in a room full of bottle feeders or breastfeeders who aren't comfy nursing in public, or objecting to the terrible snacks at preschool, etc.) Some of these issues go away after the very baby years, some of them still come up as kids get older. It can be hard to feel like an outsider around people who might think you're weird for doing or not doing xyz.

 

On the other hand -- put the shoe on the other foot, and pretend you were living in a society (in Africa, or some Muslim countries outside of Africa, for example) where most if not all girls get circumcised, ranging from very minor to extremely invasive and terribly wounding cutting. Would you feel as self-conscious about your choice to keep your daughter intact, even if she might notice a difference in the shower room or the public toilets or wherever else? Of course not, because my guess is you know as a woman the value of having all of your parts and you would never dream of subjecting yourself or your daughter to genital cutting for any reason whatsoever, whether hygiene, fitting in, etc.

 

Would you feel badly about not cutting her if she got an infection? Of course not, you'd get it treated, change up the hygiene routine as necessary, and just accept it as a normal part of life that kids get infected -- sometimes their fingers, sometimes their toenail, sometimes their ears or tonsils, sometimes their genitals. It happens. You can be sad for any pain they're going through but you can't cut off all the body parts that can get infected, because truly, just like fingers and toenails, the genitals are not optional, disposable body parts.

 

It really, truly is no different for boys. The amount of cutting you would have subjected your son to if you'd had him circumcised as a baby is just as bad as the vast majority of all female genital cutting types out there (most girls do not undergo the most damaging type). You'd have removed half the nerve endings of his penis and destroyed the foreskin's natural gliding action, permanently altering its structure and function. Can you imagine if half the nerve endings in your sensitive parts were gone?

 

It's really only in this country where we have this cultural, non-religious tradition of cutting baby boys that circumcision seems normal. If you step outside and imagine how you'd feel if it were your girl we were talking about -- I'm pretty sure that even if 100% of all families at her school circed their girls that you wouldn't go along with it, knowing what you know about your experiences and the realities of being an intact woman.
 

Please feel confident that you made the right decision (or non-decision, really) because the foreskin is not a bonus, extra, disposable body part, and the amount of harm you would have done to your son far, far, far outweighs any possible, transitory, non-essential "good" you might have done him in terms of fitting in socially.

 

(Oh and FYI my dh DID play sports from middle school through college and saw lots of intact as well as circed penises -- the rule was always don't look and above all don't comment! Even for a guy born in the late 60s in the Northeast, a very cut-happy part of the country, the locker room was simply a non-issue.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by stacyann_1 View Post

Thread seems a bit old, but wanted to add I have been feeling this way also about my 5 year old.  He tells me often that at school that ALL the other boys look different and they look at him and have even noticed he looks different.  This shocks me a bit, I had always told my (intact) husband there will be other boys the same as him, as it is becoming more common in the US. My husband feels his confidence would be better in adolescence if he was circ'd he might have even played sports he says.

 

Also just recently my son had an infection, was so painful for him, first time he saw me cry, i felt horrible.  But it cleared up quickly with bacitracin. We have a newer nanny and she didn't remind him to clean at bath with water (he is mostly retracting now, but some still attached.) so now he is rinsing every day at bath pulling back a little and putting under running water.

 

Also, I am not suspicious of studies in reputable journals and on pubmed, and some are showing less chance of infection passing with circ'd boys (hiv,hsv, hpv)  but i have always said in my mind, any boy is in trouble if they are depending on being circ'd to prevent an STD,  this is not safe sex anyway.  this thread does help, reminding me if he really wants it at some point when he is older he can make that decision (wheras my husband never felt that was a choice)

 

plus my husband alwasy says it is SO painful to have it done when older, is this true? i mean just because a child doesn't remember doesn't mean it was less painful.  if a person gets alzheimers, doesn't mean when they broke their knee 40 years ago it didn't hurt..  

 

Just to let you know i think about it all, but still wonder sometimes if all would be easier if i had done it. also i know no one IRL that has had problems either way, except one older man who had it done in the army because he was getting infections.

post #60 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by drs0410 View Post

Stopping in to say my intact son had another uneventful non-circed day. Now someone has stopped in to say that.  ROTFLMAO.gif

 


Here too. My 15 year old son has never had any issues.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Understanding Circumcision
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Understanding Circumcision › Regret NOT circumcising?