Think I've got it figured out--Haemophilus influenzae

[rzberrymom]

My 3 1/2 month old has Haemophilus influenzae in her eyes, which my doctor says is because I didn't vaccinate her for meningitis at 2 months. I'm headed with her to the hospital today, but I want to be prepared with info--is this because I didn't give her the Hib vaccine? Does this mean she has bacterial meningitis? How do I help her now? My understanding is that this is *REALLY* bad and my husband is FURIOUS with me now for not vaccinating.

I first need to get her better, but I also need to be prepared because I swear my doctor is ready to report me to CPS.

[coh5108]

mama. I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this. How scary!!

Just curious...Did your Doctor type a sample from your child's eye to make this determination? Such tests are done by state health depts or other reference labs? Also your doc said she had HI in her eye, not HIB. Unless it is HIB, vaccine status is irrelevant. HI eye infections are usually not due to type B anyway. An HI eye infection is basically bacterial pinkeye. I would laugh at the hospital staff if they actually theatened to call CPS for a case of Pinkeye

Pre vaccine HIB was a bacteria that was often found in the mouths and respiratory tracts of individuals. Oter types are still found in healthy asymptomatic individuals and can cause things like eye infections, ear infections, sinus infections and if it (any type, but most often HIB) becomes invasive it can cause meningitis and other more serious maladies. It does not sound like your baby has meningitis at all. It sounds as if she has an eye infection cause by some type HI bacteria.(most likely not type B)
http://www.childrenshospital.org/az/...ageS976P0.html

conjunctivitis - an inflammation of the conjunctiva of the eye. The conjunctiva is the membrane that lines the inside of the eye and also a thin membrane that covers the actual eye. Symptoms may include:
redness
swelling
drainage from one eye or both eyes
burning of the eyes
photophobia (eyes sensitive to light)

Did this happen because your baby is unvaxed? Maybe maybe not. If the HI is not type B than whether or not your baby was vaxed is irrelevant since the HIB vax only protects against the type B strain. If it is HIB, The HIB vaccine is given to children in 3 doses. At 3.5 months, your baby would have only had 1 dose anyway and babies are not fully immune to HIB until they have had all three doses.

Meningitis only occurs of the bacteria becomes invasive. This depends more on the overall condition of the host than it does the actual bacteria IMO.
Your baby will likely require antibiotics, probably both eye drops and oral. I know we have had moms post on here about their kiddos who got HI ear infections. They treated them and they were fine. I hope your baby feels better soon.

[AFWife]

It's not meningitis unless the meninges are inflamed...and the meninges are not in your eyes. It was not cool for him to scare you like that.

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by coh5108

Did your Doctor type a sample from your child's eye to make this determination? Such tests are done by state health depts or other reference labs? Also your doc said she had HI in her eye, not HIB. Unless it is HIB, vaccine status is irrelevant. HI eye infections are usually not due to type B anyway. An HI eye infection is basically bacterial pinkeye.

About 6 weeks ago, they said my DD had pinkeye--since then, she's been on 3 rounds of antibiotics (2 different kinds), and it went away and came back all 3 times. So, they thought it might be strep and finally cultured it last week--they called me today to say that it came back from the lab and it's Haemophilus influenzae. She didn't say bacteria, but she told me that it's because my DD is not vaccinated for HIB.

[AFWife]

Originally Posted by rzberrymom

About 6 weeks ago, they said my DD had pinkeye--since then, she's been on 3 rounds of antibiotics (2 different kinds), and it went away and came back all 3 times. So, they thought it might be strep and finally cultured it last week--they called me today to say that it came back from the lab and it's Haemophilus influenzae. She didn't say bacteria, but she told me that it's because my DD is not vaccinated for HIB.

Just because she said that it doesn't make it true, it could be a scare tactic.

[coh5108]

Originally Posted by rzberrymom

About 6 weeks ago, they said my DD had pinkeye--since then, she's been on 3 rounds of antibiotics (2 different kinds), and it went away and came back all 3 times. So, they thought it might be strep and finally cultured it last week--they called me today to say that it came back from the lab and it's Haemophilus influenzae. She didn't say bacteria, but she told me that it's because my DD is not vaccinated for HIB.

I highly doubt it is from HI type B. I would ask to see the lab results for myself, request a copy and go pick it up asap. If it is from any HI strain other than B, vaccination status is irrelevant and your ped is trying to scrae you. If that is the case, Id be finding a new doctor. Inexcusable!

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by coh5108

Your baby will likely require antibiotics, probably both eye drops and oral.

They told me that the antibiotics by eye were not going to kill this (and that's consistent with the fact that it keeps coming back after she's had antibiotics), and that there's no oral dose that will kill this and is approved for a baby so young. So, they told me we most likely have to do an IV at the hospital, which freaks me out because I'm worried 1) she could get more sick there and become more vulnerable to the meningitis and 2) I'm worried about being able to breastfeeding on demand while we're there--she nurses like crazy during the day because she sleeps 8 hours at night, so I'm scared that she'll get even MORE sick if they're testing, probing and taking her from me and I'm not able to breastfeed her like she normally does. I want to trust doctors, but I don't.

But, at least I have info about the vaccine before we go to the hospital this afternoon.

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by AFWife

Just because she said that it doesn't make it true, it could be a scare tactic.

Yes, that's probably true. I know she's highly pro-vaccine, but I hadn't picked a doctor for my DD yet because my midwife did the well-baby checks until 2 months. When she came down with this pinkeye, I just went to my regular doctor (not a pediatrician). I KNEW I didn't want to go to this woman because I wouldn't know whether she was trying to scare me into vaccinating or whether something was indeed life-threatening. I won't be going to her after this.

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by coh5108

I highly doubt it is from HI type B.

Why is that? Because it's so rare?

They're not answering their phones (probably at lunch) so I'm sending DH down to their office to look at the lab results.

[coh5108]

Have you tried squirting Breastmilk in her eye??

You could also put colloidal silver in her eye.

some alternatives you may want to try, but it sounds like it's beyond that at this point. I would be very wary of what they want to "do" in the hospital and would stay withher at all times. Keep us posted

[AFWife]

Originally Posted by rzberrymom

Why is that? Because it's so rare?

They're not answering their phones (probably at lunch) so I'm sending DH down to their office to look at the lab results.

I'm assuming your DD is EBF? Are you a SAHM or has she been in daycare?

[carriebft]

The B type if the Hi bacteria (hib) IS known to cause this type of eye infection. It is much rarer now because of the vaccine. Without the test, I would have said that there was very little chance that it was caused by hib simply because the vaccine has done away with most hib carriage. However, if she really did do a test and it came back positive and she isn't lying..well...even then the vaccine isn't going to make the current problem go away, as far as I know. I don't think the vaccine will have anything to do with a current infection; the vaccine allows the immune system to recognize the protein coat "worn" by the hib bacteria, but since she is already infected, I don't think this would do any good?

maybe someone with more knowledge on that side of things can let you know more.

[coh5108]

Originally Posted by rzberrymom

Why is that? Because it's so rare?

They're not answering their phones (probably at lunch) so I'm sending DH down to their office to look at the lab results.

Type B is pretty rare nowadays, not that it couldn't cause eye infections but it is more liekly to be from a non type b strain

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by coh5108

Have you tried squirting Breastmilk in her eye??

You could also put colloidal silver in her eye.

some alternatives you may want to try, but it sounds like it's beyond that at this point. I would be very wary of what they want to "do" in the hospital and would stay withher at all times. Keep us posted

I did try breatmilk in the eye for about 3 days when she first got it, but it didn't help (which is when I went to the dr.) I'll look into colloidal silver.

And that's a good point, to just demand to stay with her at all times.

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by AFWife

I'm assuming your DD is EBF? Are you a SAHM or has she been in daycare?

Yes, she's EBF. I'm at home and she's not in daycare, but I live in a co-housing community and kids are constantly in my house and she's been exposed to a crazy amount of stuff (and has been sick on and off for most of her little life). I'm taking cod liver oil, vitamin D supplements, flax oil and raw milk to *try* to keep her healthy, but she's still getting sick.

[carriebft]

A question you want to ask, once you know whether or not it really IS hib, is if a hib related eye infection has the potential to become invasive hib disease- penumonia, meningitis, epiglotitis, etc. Honestly, I have no idea what the answer is to that question; I've never considered if a bacteria attacking the eye is likely to travel elsewhere and cause an issue. And, if it is possible, will vaccination now affect that possibility?

[Grace and Granola]

I'm so sorry you're going through this. I know how scary it can be when you don't feel like your doctor will advocate for you and support your choices. Can you search MDC to find a ped in your area who is ok with not vaxing and get in with them asap. I would hate for you to end up in the hospital and not have a doctor in your corner.

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by coh5108

Type B is pretty rare nowadays, not that it couldn't cause eye infections but it is more liekly to be from a non type b strain

I just talked to her and the lab report did not say type B. Just said HI.

But, my doctor didn't know whether it would have said type B if it indeed is (huh?), so she's calling the lab now.

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by carriebft

A question you want to ask, once you know whether or not it really IS hib, is if a hib related eye infection has the potential to become invasive hib disease- penumonia, meningitis, epiglotitis, etc. Honestly, I have no idea what the answer is to that question; I've never considered if a bacteria attacking the eye is likely to travel elsewhere and cause an issue. And, if it is possible, will vaccination now affect that possibility?

That's exactly what my doctor thinks--that it doesn't really matter whether it's type B since it's an infant so young.

I wouldn't want to vaccinate now though, since I imagine that would make her more vulnerable to getting sick when she's trying to fight this off.

But, is there any effectiveness to getting vaccinated when a baby already has the bacteria?? If that's what the hospital wants to do, I need to be prepared.

[carriebft]

Yeah I think that is important to find out because, from the little reading I have done in last 10 minutes since reading this thread, eye infections can become invasive...so it would seem to me that they should pinpoint what HI it is, if possible. That would help you make decisions...how can you make a decision about the vaccine/ vaccine for contacts (say you had other unvaccinated kids, kwim?) without the information? if it's not hib, then there's no vaccine to help the situation, so why waste time arguing about it?

Plus, if she doesn't know if it's hib or not, then you might want to tell her that there's no way to tell if it was vaccine preventable and no reason to be upset with you about it!!!