hello there!

[DirtRoadMama]

I am going to try, very hard, to be cheerful. See?

I packed a bag and DD and left my home about three weeks ago, after I asked stbx (*cries at that*) to leave and he refused. (not married, been together for over 3 years) I felt he was becoming unsafe, and he was threatening me. I've been asking him to leave ever since (the house is completely in my name), and I've been getting changing answers about whether he is going or not. Yesterday he said he should be out by Sunday. He has been saying a lot of hurtful things.

I'm facing up to the fact that he is verbally abusive, and has full potential to be physically abusive if the road we were on didn't change. I told him that I wanted him to go to individual counseling, that I would go with him to couple's counseling, and after 6 months I would sit down alone with his counselors to find out where he is and what kind of progress he is making and whether they felt he was safe to come back into the home. He gave a lot of reasons why he couldn't start counseling yet (his truck wasn't running), why he couldn't do it one he moved out (he would have to take an out-of-town job (he's a union steelworker) so that he could afford to pay all his child support, and how is he supposed to go see a counselor on the road?), why he couldn't move out (not enough money to live on his own (that's a whole other rant of mine)), why it was all my fault...

I really wanted him to get help until he was downright mean this past Saturday. He cheated on me last summer, and I found out when I had my yearly exam done and they found gonorrhea. Good times! Anyway, he's tried to blame his cheating on me. He was also saying that he doesn't believe that I ever wanted him to get better, that I was just saying all that so he would get out of my house. It's a lot easier to see someone's head games when you are more than two feet away from the situation, and it infuriated me. Anyway, now I just want him out. If he goes and gets counseling, and makes major improvements, I'm still willing to go to couple's counseling to see if this can be saved, but I'm not counting on him to follow through if there is no guarantee that I'll take him back.

Oh, and did I mention that I'm 9 weeks pregnant? Oh yeah, let's pile on a little more stress! Yay!

Well, I think that's enough to start with. I'm sad and lonely, I feel like I'm losing everything, and I just wish I could lay down and sleep all day...

[Learning_Mum]

If the house is in your name, couldn't you just call the police and get him removed?

[DirtRoadMama]

First, thank you for the reply. I was getting kind of bummed out because I saw that people had read my post, but no one was saying anything...


On to your question; in one word, no. He is considered a renter, as he was paying money towards the bills, and I carried renter's insurance on him. So, I would have to give him a 30 day eviction notice. I was trying to be nice, because I was hoping we could work things out. He said he should be out by Sunday, so that is why I didn't give him a 30 day notice letter yesterday.

[josybear]

he does sound verbally abusive. you need to read up on that so you can spot his lies when he starts spewing his crap all over. his behaviour is not your fault. it just simply isn't. he's a big boy, he makes his own (crappy) choices. you're well rid of him and should get some legal assistance in removing him from your house.
there are several mamas here who have lived through emotional abuse, and i think they'll have some good things to say.
welcome! congratulations on getting free!

[~Charlie's~Angel~]

Originally Posted by Learning_Mum

If the house is in your name, couldn't you just call the police and get him removed?

Thats what I was thinking too, but was afraid to be the first to post, since I really dont belong here......

Also, I would strongly advise against couples counseling if your STBX is as abusive as you say. Souples counseling will only make things worse.

[DirtRoadMama]

Why would couple's counseling make things worse?

[~Charlie's~Angel~]

Originally Posted by DirtRoadMama

Why would couple's counseling make things worse?

Any of the other super knowledgable mamas out there want to give her the proper answer to this question? I was just quoting you guys, and I don't want to screw it up or step on any toes by mis-quoting. Thank you!

DirtRoadMama, over in the Parents as Partners forum, there are quite a few threads going right now with posts in them about how couples counseling is a very bad idea in situations of abuse. That is where I learned that little tidbit. Heres one.. http://www.mothering.com/discussions...1200429&page=2 post 35.

ETA it was also something I did not know until very recently. I even asked about it in another thread.

[Freedom~Mama]

Originally Posted by DirtRoadMama

Why would couple's counseling make things worse?

There are many reasons. An normal healthy relationship is about trust, love and respect. An abusive relationship is about power, control, and violence. What would work for a healthy relationship does not work for an abusive one and in fact can make things worse. For ex. if a couple goes to counseling together and the woman tells the counselor that her DH is abusive, the DH might pretend to own up to it, cry, act sorry etc in front of the counselor but then when they get home there is hell to pay. Any good counselor or Therapist would advice against counseling in an abusive relationship because the problem is not a lack of communication but the abuse itself...when someone is abusive there is only a small chance of them changing because the habits, thought patterns, sense of entitlement etc is so ingrained. If they truly see what they are doing is wrong, enter into an abuse counseling program and work very hard to change there is a small chance of really changing but the percentage that actually change is very very low. In most cases the abuser does not see what he is doing as abusive and therefore does not see any reason to change and obviously if he doesn't want to change he isn't going to.

hope that makes sense!

[Freedom~Mama]

BTW to the OP I just wanted to wish you luck. You can do this. I just left my DH a week ago and am feeling so much better already. He was very abusive. It is hard to leave and I am sure being pregnant and all the emotions that go with it makes me even harder but you sound very strong and you can do this and make a better life for you and your children.

[Learning_Mum]

Originally Posted by DirtRoadMama

First, thank you for the reply. I was getting kind of bummed out because I saw that people had read my post, but no one was saying anything...


On to your question; in one word, no. He is considered a renter, as he was paying money towards the bills, and I carried renter's insurance on him. So, I would have to give him a 30 day eviction notice. I was trying to be nice, because I was hoping we could work things out. He said he should be out by Sunday, so that is why I didn't give him a 30 day notice letter yesterday.

I'm sorry that your first reply wasn't very supportive! I'm in a crappy place mentally this morning, so although I wanted to reply to you, I couldn't really summon much up! I'm sorry about that!

I hope that he leaves OK on Sunday. It might be an idea to have a police officer escort you to make sure he leaves OK. If you think he could become physically abusive it's probably not worth the risk. Also, I don't know whether I'm being melodramatic here, but STBX sounds like he could be quite spiteful and I would be concerned about him damaging the property as 'revenge' and it would be good to have someone with you so that you can document any damage that may have been done.

I think you are making an excellent choice to leave. Anyone that cheats on you, gives you gonorreha (sp) and then blames you for it, is not a good guy! I imagine that things look pretty scary right now but let me say that you *can* do this. You would be surprised at how well you will manage and how much better things will be, even with a babe on the way. Also, I was completely amazed at the 'kindness of strangers' when my husband left me. There are alot of good people out there, don't be afraid to take any help offered to you.

I hope this post makes sense! I have a feeling it's a bit rambling!

[DirtRoadMama]

Thank you all so very much for your responses. It does make sense about the counseling. I have been in couple's counseling before, in a prior relationship, but that one wasn't abusive, just annoying.

This all just sucks. I'm going to see if he is out by Sunday, and if not, I'll start legal action to get him out. This is the first time he has given a time frame, and I'd like to keep this as peaceful as possible. I do live out in the middle of nowhere, and when I'm back I'll be there alone with DD, so I'd rather not have any drama.

I should clarify that, for short periods of time, he is not scary. It's the three days of calm followed by the fourth day spent being cranky and then being mean that is scary. He has been pointing out that I've been back to the house several times (3 times) since I left, so I must not be that scared of him. I tried to explain that he is not scary when he's calm and happy to see me; it's when he's falling back into one of his moods that it freaks me out.

[Halfasianmomma]

Just wanted to chime in to say kudos to you for leaving an abusive and unfaithful man. It takes a lot of courage and strength. I too left a verbally abusive spouse about 4-5 months ago, and my life is so much more serene now. I do have to see the man regularly because we have a child together, and sometimes when I see him and he acts so NORMAL, I ask myself if I wasn't crazy or making things up. That's all part of his game though: Dr. Jekyll and Mr.Hyde, and never knowing who I'd be dealing with.

Sounds like yours is somewhat similar in that respect.

Good for you for getting him kicked out of your place.

I wish you luck!

[DirtRoadMama]

So the saga continues. I thought there should be a little more detail, so here is a better timeline. We really got into it last Saturday, as my original post talked about, and Sunday afternoon I got a text from him asking me to bring DD to the house so he could see her. I was asleep when the text arrived (wasn't feeling well so my friend was watching DD so I could nap), and I didn't respond when I got it later.

Monday I asked him if he talked to his job about work, and he said they said there wasn't any. Then he said he needs to talk to me. Cue the phone call, which was completely unproductive. That night he sent some mean emails about not having DD call him at night anymore, because it's pointless, because he's not going to be a part-time dad. He also says he should be out by Sunday. I had DD call him that night to say goodnight, as usual. He answered the phone, and the next night (without further communication with him) I had her call him again. Again, he answers.

Today, he texts me in the morning begging me to bring her over. After several messages back and forth (with him being rather nice, and just asking nicely over and over), I asked him when he was leaving. He said he should be out Sunday. I said I'd think about it, but don't bet on it because I'm sick. I slept all day and woke around 3, feeling better. I asked him if he would like to meet us in a public place to eat dinner and let her play at the indoor playground. He said yes, and we all met (my friends knew where I was going).

It went really well. He was nice, DD was glad to see him, and there was absolutely no drama. We ate first (he paid, that surprised me), then we went to the play area. We sat down, and he shyly held my hand. It was nice. When we finally left, he gave me a long hug and a few nice kisses.

I know this all sounds weird, but keep in mind that I know that this was just today. I know that he has to move out, and he has to get a lot of professional help before he can think about coming back. I know he can be nice for an afternoon, and I know that the storm can roll in with almost no warning. I just figured that ya'll would need to know the whole story if I'm going to get good advice. I know it could all swing the other way in two days. I also know that he could leave the house with the intentions of getting some help, get started and get pissed at the process, and quit. Of course I'm holding hope that it all gets fixed, that he gets the help he needs, and everything goes hunky-dorey. But right now I feel like that is a 50-50 chance.

[Theia]

Please be careful. It is good that you recognize that he could change his mood in an minute. TBH, it kinda creeped me out when you said he was being affectionate. In my experience, an abuser only does that because they want something, or they are trying to pull you back in so you will be under their control still. I hope that's not harsh, but the way you described it sounds exactly like a manipulative technique on his part. If I were you, I'd do things legally, and documented. If he leaves as promised this time, then fine. But if he delays it beyond Sunday (is that when he said he would leave?), then I would officially write him something and give the proper 30 days notice. If you have to, mail it registered to the house so that he has to sign receipt and that way you avoid a confrontation.

Have you researched verbal abuse? A website I liked when I was first learning about these behaviors was drirene.com Also, google "abuse stockholm syndrome", you will find some good info there too.

Stay strong and come back often for support. There are many women here that have been in this type of situation.

[DirtRoadMama]

more updates

So, I asked him where he is going to be staying, since he has not mentioned anything, not even a hint. (This first part is completely via text)

He said hopefully in a certain part of town, but most likely in his truck. He said he didn't want to talk about it because it was making him want to literally blow his brains out. Then he started saying that the weekend I came home really confused him, so he started spending money on the things he need to do a repair at the house. Then he said that the people he could stay with are not on the side of us working things out, and how that is what he is going to have to deal with if he doesn't want to live in his truck.

So I said that I didn't think he had done the repair, so if he had I would reimburse him for the costs of materials and equipment. He then called me. He said that he had not done the repairs but had started buying the stuff for it. He didn't say how much he had spent. (So, I'm thinking it wasn't that much, or the figure would have been mentioned, right?) Then he started saying that the people he could stay with are laughing at him for wanting to work it out, and saying that me coming over that weekend doesn't make any sense. I asked him if they know how I feel that he is fine for days, then blows up, and is fine again for a few more days, and he said they know that. So I said that I came over because I do still love him, and the "off day blow up" thing is why I thought it was safe to come over. Then I agreed that it would have been confusing, but it made sense to me because I still love him. Then he started getting angry, and repeating that it was confusing, and it doesn't make sense. Then he kept repeating that and started throwing curses in, and at that point I said "you are getting mean, so I am going to get off the phone now". So he said bye and hung up.

Why is this so hard? Why do I feel like he is going to get out of the house and then give up and not go to counseling? I keep telling myself that I wouldn't be so emotional if I wasn't pregnant. Right? *frowns*

[*MamaJen*]

Oh, man, you're right in the thick of it, aren't you?
So. Emotional abuse. The funny thing about emotional abuse is that it is so freaking textbook. I mean, obviously there is some individual variation, but in general there are these patterns that nearly every emotionally abusive relationship follows. The good thing about this is that you can research all about emotional abuse and learn about your own situation.
Okay, here is some really basic stuff:
--The cycle of abuse. If there is one thing that any woman in an abusive relationship should understand, this is it. Damn near every abusive relationship follows this pattern: eggshells, explosion, honeymoon. Basically, you get that walking on eggshells sensation. You know the bad stuff is coming, and sure enough, he explodes. Maybe he calls you names, maybe he hits you, maybe he picks a ridiculous fight. It could be one big explosion of abuse, or it could be several days of low-level emotional abuse, constant belittling, that sort of thing. Then, and this is the part that really makes abuse work, he gets to the honeymoon stage. He's sorry. He's so, so sorry and he'll never do it again. He says all the right things, he helps around the house, he shyly holds your hand, he's the man you fell in love with. He may even promise to go to counseling, acknowledge how messed up he is, say it's all his fault and he'll do anything he can to get better. But this is just another phase in the cycle, and before long, you'll be back to the eggshells phase. Only, it will be worse, because by staying and forgiving him you have implicitly told him that it's okay for him to abuse you.
--Couples counseling doesn't work and may make it worse. Like Beautiful Life said, couples counseling is a really, really bad idea in abusive relationships. Maybe, maybe, if he truly wants to change, individual counseling may in a very small percentage of cases help HIM. But. But. If there is abuse, that is the ONLY issue. It's not that you need to change the way you make requests, or have more sex, or anything. The issue is that he is abusive. The abuse isn't a reaction to you, it's an instigation. It's about control and manipulation. Couples counseling may give him more psychological tools to further abuse you. Also, many women in abusive situations tend to downplay the abuse in front of the counselor, for a number or reasons.
Here's more on this: http://ezinearticles.com/?Emotional-...orse&id=150156
--The Stockholm Syndrome connection. Stockholm Syndrome works when you are in a dangerous situation, and the person endangering you shows you a glimmer of kindness. As a survival mechanism, you emotionally latch onto them in a very powerful way, even though they may kill you. Abuse has a similar dynamic. They hurt you, then in the honeymoon phase they are kind to you. It literally creates an addiction.
--Abusers are master manipulators. They tend to be really canny and know just how far they can push you, and what to say to keep you under their thumb. They make it really hard to break free from them. Sounds like your guy isn't going to move out quietly. Oh, and all that "wah, wah, I'm going to be sleeping in my truck" -- he's guilt tripping you.
--It doesn't get better. It gets worse. Seriously, after escaping an emotionally and verbally and borderline physically abusive relationship, I got kind of obsessed with learning everything I could about the dynamics and psychology of abuse. I've heard a lot of stories of abuse, and there's never been a single one that ever got better. Many got worse, fast. A lot of women would say it was suddenly, magically better, and it was, for like a month or two, before it exploded in to even worse abuse. What they took for real, permanent improvement was really just a long honeymoon phase, because the abuser realized he was about to lose them.
--There is always an excuse for everything. In the mind of an abuser, nothing is ever their fault. Nothing. It may be your fault, but never theirs. There's always a reason why they hit you, lashed out at you, got angry. They justify their abuse by taking zero responsibility for their anger and their emotions. There is also always an excuse why they can't move out, be responsible, etc. And they can be quite convincing. Remember, they manipulate with the best of them. So get laser vision and see through the web of lies and excuses.
--Leaving is a dangerous time. You may well be in real physical danger at this point. Men who have been verbally abusive very frequently escalate to physical battering when you try to leave them. Remember, abuse is all about control, and if you leave them, you are eliminating their control over you. This is tremendously threatening to them.
--The best way to leave them is by eliminating all contact. Remember they are good at manipulating. So if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile. If you get them on the phone, they'll start working hard to regian that control. Don't talk to him at all, for sure don't see him face to face. If you have to communicate, do it via email. Be short, clear and to the point. We're over. You need to move out. End of story.
--Many abusers have other mental illnesses. Borderline personality disorder is super common among abusive men. Narcissism can be as well, though that tends to be a different kind of emotional abuse than what you're describing. And some of the worst abuse can come from good old fashioned sociopaths, though that is pretty rare and tends to not follow the normal patterns. I'd read up on borderline personality and just see if it rings any bells -- in fact, some of his statements do remind me of bpd.
http://www.bpdcentral.com/resources/abuse/evabuse.shtml
http://www.heart-2-heart.ca/men/page20.htm

Okay, I'm going to say this very gently, but I also think it would be worthwhile to ask yourself how you feel about continuing the pregnancy. I don't know the background here, but it's not uncommon for an abusive man to deliberately get his partner pregnant so she is less likely to leave him. And it's also very very common for physical abuse to start during pregnancy. (http://www.womensweb.ca/violence/dv/pregnancy.php) Sounds sick, but it's really common because you are so vulnerable. If you choose to continue it, remember that you will have to interact with your abuser for 18 more years, and he will likely have unsupervised visitation with the child.
(ETA: Sorry, it didn't sink in at first that you already have a child together. That may change the decision making process for you.)
Anyway, it's super hard to leave abuse. It takes a ton of willpower and strength. We're all supporting you here. I wish your post count was high enough for the surviving abuse forum -- it's an awesome resource.

Here are some other threads:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1181210
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1196668
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1200429
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1197869

[josybear]

this post should be stickied. it's exactly what i wanted to say, but couldn't. way to go, mamajen!

Originally Posted by *MamaJen*

Oh, man, you're right in the thick of it, aren't you?
So. Emotional abuse. The funny thing about emotional abuse is that it is so freaking textbook. I mean, obviously there is some individual variation, but in general there are these patterns that nearly every emotionally abusive relationship follows. The good thing about this is that you can research all about emotional abuse and learn about your own situation.
Okay, here is some really basic stuff:
--The cycle of abuse. If there is one thing that any woman in an abusive relationship should understand, this is it. Damn near every abusive relationship follows this pattern: eggshells, explosion, honeymoon. Basically, you get that walking on eggshells sensation. You know the bad stuff is coming, and sure enough, he explodes. Maybe he calls you names, maybe he hits you, maybe he picks a ridiculous fight. It could be one big explosion of abuse, or it could be several days of low-level emotional abuse, constant belittling, that sort of thing. Then, and this is the part that really makes abuse work, he gets to the honeymoon stage. He's sorry. He's so, so sorry and he'll never do it again. He says all the right things, he helps around the house, he shyly holds your hand, he's the man you fell in love with. He may even promise to go to counseling, acknowledge how messed up he is, say it's all his fault and he'll do anything he can to get better. But this is just another phase in the cycle, and before long, you'll be back to the eggshells phase. Only, it will be worse, because by staying and forgiving him you have implicitly told him that it's okay for him to abuse you.
--Couples counseling doesn't work and may make it worse. Like Beautiful Life said, couples counseling is a really, really bad idea in abusive relationships. Maybe, maybe, if he truly wants to change, individual counseling may in a very small percentage of cases help HIM. But. But. If there is abuse, that is the ONLY issue. It's not that you need to change the way you make requests, or have more sex, or anything. The issue is that he is abusive. The abuse isn't a reaction to you, it's an instigation. It's about control and manipulation. Couples counseling may give him more psychological tools to further abuse you. Also, many women in abusive situations tend to downplay the abuse in front of the counselor, for a number or reasons.
Here's more on this: http://ezinearticles.com/?Emotional-...orse&id=150156
--The Stockholm Syndrome connection. Stockholm Syndrome works when you are in a dangerous situation, and the person endangering you shows you a glimmer of kindness. As a survival mechanism, you emotionally latch onto them in a very powerful way, even though they may kill you. Abuse has a similar dynamic. They hurt you, then in the honeymoon phase they are kind to you. It literally creates an addiction.
--Abusers are master manipulators. They tend to be really canny and know just how far they can push you, and what to say to keep you under their thumb. They make it really hard to break free from them. Sounds like your guy isn't going to move out quietly. Oh, and all that "wah, wah, I'm going to be sleeping in my truck" -- he's guilt tripping you.
--It doesn't get better. It gets worse. Seriously, after escaping an emotionally and verbally and borderline physically abusive relationship, I got kind of obsessed with learning everything I could about the dynamics and psychology of abuse. I've heard a lot of stories of abuse, and there's never been a single one that ever got better. Many got worse, fast. A lot of women would say it was suddenly, magically better, and it was, for like a month or two, before it exploded in to even worse abuse. What they took for real, permanent improvement was really just a long honeymoon phase, because the abuser realized he was about to lose them.
--There is always an excuse for everything. In the mind of an abuser, nothing is ever their fault. Nothing. It may be your fault, but never theirs. There's always a reason why they hit you, lashed out at you, got angry. They justify their abuse by taking zero responsibility for their anger and their emotions. There is also always an excuse why they can't move out, be responsible, etc. And they can be quite convincing. Remember, they manipulate with the best of them. So get laser vision and see through the web of lies and excuses.
--Leaving is a dangerous time. You may well be in real physical danger at this point. Men who have been verbally abusive very frequently escalate to physical battering when you try to leave them. Remember, abuse is all about control, and if you leave them, you are eliminating their control over you. This is tremendously threatening to them.
--The best way to leave them is by eliminating all contact. Remember they are good at manipulating. So if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile. If you get them on the phone, they'll start working hard to regian that control. Don't talk to him at all, for sure don't see him face to face. If you have to communicate, do it via email. Be short, clear and to the point. We're over. You need to move out. End of story.
--Many abusers have other mental illnesses. Borderline personality disorder is super common among abusive men. Narcissism can be as well, though that tends to be a different kind of emotional abuse than what you're describing. And some of the worst abuse can come from good old fashioned sociopaths, though that is pretty rare and tends to not follow the normal patterns. I'd read up on borderline personality and just see if it rings any bells -- in fact, some of his statements do remind me of bpd.

Okay, I'm going to say this very gently, but I also think it would be worthwhile to ask yourself how you feel about continuing the pregnancy. I don't know the background here, but it's not uncommon for an abusive man to deliberately get his partner pregnant so she is less likely to leave him. And it's also very very common for physical abuse to start during pregnancy. (http://www.womensweb.ca/violence/dv/pregnancy.php) Sounds sick, but it's really common because you are so vulnerable. If you choose to continue it, remember that you will have to interact with your abuser for 18 more years, and he will likely have unsupervised visitation with the child.
Anyway, it's super hard to leave abuse. It takes a ton of willpower and strength. We're all supporting you here. I wish your post count was high enough for the surviving abuse forum -- it's an awesome resource.

Here are some other threads:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1181210
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1196668
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1200429
http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1197869

[DirtRoadMama]

Mamajen - thank you for your post. I feel that all you are saying is true. I'll admit that I'm still holding hope that he gets help and gets better. I'm also telling myself repeatedly that it may not happen.

I'm going to read your post several more times, and I think I'll print it out, too.

To your last question, honestly, I had considered termination, but for other reasons. I was on birth control, and took it every morning, at the same time, and would double check at 3pm every day just to make sure I didn't miss it. I never missed a pill. This was just one determined kid. Additionally, we were discussing sterilization. I looked into it for myself, but found that both of my options were extremely invasive. That left him. He has said, since I have known him, that he would never do it, but it seemed like he was coming around to the idea, especially since there was no safe alternative for me, and for him it would be a very minor surgery. Anyway, that was to say that this baby was a surprise, and could not have been done intentionally by him. My pill packs are always sealed, and I get the doses myself.

I am not sure how I am going to afford two kids (I have a DD with him, so we are already linked for life), and that was the main thing that had me considering it. I didn't want my kids to not be provided for. I am pro-choice, meaning that I feel every person has the right to make their own choices, but I am personally pro-life, in that an abortion isn't something I could deal with for myself. So, I decided that I would just have to get creative with the finances and figure it out.

To the fact that leaving is a dangerous time, I agree. I am not currently in the house. I am not going back to the house until he says that he is gone, and my friends are going to accompany me on the first trip home. After that point, I don't think there is anything I can do, short of calling the police, if he comes over. If he asks to come over, I am going to decline, and offer to meet him in public so he can see DD.

He has other kids, and his pattern for them is to not pursue a relationship if it is made difficult for him. While I have no intention of making it difficult, there are certain things that I won't allow, such as unsupervised visits. That, of course, may be viewed as making it difficult, but I am not going to compromise on that.

I'm doing much better than when I first posted this. I had time to calm down and see what parts of the conversation were manipulative. Which, was pretty much the whole thing.

One last thing. I tried those links, but they wouldn't open for me.

[Theia]

Listen to MamaJen. That post rocks!

My abuser also became abusive during pregnancy. It sucks. I stayed through the pregnancy and most of our DD's first year thinking/waiting/hoping he would change. He didn't, and it only became worse. Much worse. During pregnancy was when the abuse escalated to physical in my case. Yes, you are emotional and hormonal right now But abuse during pregnancy took such a toll on me physically. I normally have very low blood pressure. When it came time for delivery my BP was so high they were afraid I'd have a stroke. There is no way to know, but I am pretty confident that the stress of the abuse played a huge part in my health. I was pre-e, retaining tons of water, spilling protein despite my best efforts at a healthy diet. And I was so messed up emotionally that I had a hard time even breastfeeding my DD. I do believe so many of the difficulties are completely related to being abused. I didn't get the birth experience I wanted, and I wasn't able to maintain the BF relationship I wanted with my DD. Now her father is gone and I can't go back and get those special things. I often feel like my entrance into motherhood was a trial by fire.... it's a horrible way to start a major life change.

[Theia]

If some of those links don't work, it might be that they are in a part of MDC that you don't have access to yet due to being new and with a low post count. I think they are in Parents as Partners (PaP). Just keep posting and hanging around here. You'll get there.