what is best for overnight visitation (3 yo & 6 yo)?

[flowmom]

Here's our sitch:

• H suddenly separated 2 months ago with only a few days' warning
• H is an involved dad and has been spending lots of time with the kids and making an effort to minimize changes to their routines
• H has only EVER in his life put the kids to bed by himself 4 times...(once a week for the past 4 weeks, twice here at home and twice overnight at his apartment)
• I think the children are very distressed at the separation (it spite of efforts to maintain their routine, etc), but H doesn't acknowledge it
• ds has a lot of issues (high functioning autism, ADHD, sensory issues)
• dd is quite highstrung and only recently nightweaned
• children are both homeschooled

I was OK with the children staying with him one night a week, but now he's pushing for more

H works day and night shifts on an 8 day cycle so his schedule of night shifts is different every week. In the short term he wants the children to stay at his place 2 nights out of every 8, according to when he would be able to do that (there are only 3 nights a week out of 8 that he would be able to have them stay overnight). So it would look something like tues/wed one week, wed/thurs the next week, thurs/fri the next week. He then wants to build up to 3 nights out of 8.

H believes that the children can have "two homes". I guess I fundamentally believe that two homes = no home. I think that my attached, sensitive children need a lot of consistency around where they go to bed and where they wake up...predictable environments and routines.

I feel angry that H expects me and the kids to work around his crazy schedule that has no relationship to their weekly routines and activities. We're already doing that during the day, but I don't feel good about doing that for overnights.

I don't even know how to tackle this. I assume that there's research to support all sorts of different coparenting/custody models depending on which advocacy group is behind it. I don't think that the research is going to tell me what my kids need. And I don't feel totally sure what my kids need either. Frankly I haven't had a lot of time to absorb this and come to terms with my children living a completely different lifestyle than what I hoped for them.

I know that children need their fathers as well as their mothers, but is shuttling back and forth between two homes really what's in their interest?

PS: I have never even seen H's apartment

[meemee]

no one can answer that question.

the only way is to try and see and work it out.

however i come from a philosophy that says 2 homes = 2 homes.

you seem to be doing what ex and i did and it worked really well for our then 3 year old.

we started gradually. he came over and put her to bed at my place and then after a few times he took her over. the first couple of times she cried for me so he brought her back. but after that they adjusted.

yes your plan is complicated, but this is the time to do the changes. not that they get used to one way and then it changes again.

here is my thing. yes children of course are very stressed by a separation. however if you had to keep them 24/7 and him just visit, it would still be very stressful for them. the shuffling back and forth of course will take some time to get used to. however it is doable if you parents help them along. if you both feel you are doing the right thing.

the thing here is - you say he is an involved dad. he obviously loves his kids. yes he hasnt had much experience with them.

and btw yes shuttling back and forth between two homes has worked well for my dd. my dd loves her dad and mom equally. that's exactly how it should be. however she would not have develoved that bond had she not been spending overnights with ex. ex first started overnights for child support reasons, however it worked really well for my dd. she got more time with her dad.

as long as both you and ex have the best for your children at hand and are willing to work together on this - that will be the best for your children. sit and work with your ex about ds. your schedule looks a bit daunting to me but the children are too young to really be affected by the days of the week. and if daddy calls them everyday and then says when he will pick them up - or you do that - that will keep some consistency in their life. i dont know about how this would affect someone like your ds.

however saying that they should get v. limited overnights with their dad without giving it a shot is unfair to him. unless it really is a medical no no for ds.

I think that my attached, sensitive children need a lot of consistency around where they go to bed and where they wake up...predictable environments and routines.
i think this can totally be done with two loving homes. now if he was going to pick up sleeping children - then no.

[tiffani]

just coming in for a hug.

I think you just give it a try and see how it goes. how is the communication going between you two? I would think that in order for him to be able to truly keep the kids best interests in mind, you have to keep this all really non-combative and make sure he doesn't fall into a competitive mindset. I honestly don't think you'll know what is best for the kids until you try a certain arrangement until they're somewhat used to it -- if they never get used to it, it's not working, if they do, maybe it is? It sucks horribly that you have to deal with this at all, but at this point, you just have to be strong and open and willing to work with dad to find the best arrangement for the kids.

I lean towards letting the kids be with dad as much as possible. It's too bad the shared kid's home, shared adult apartment thing won't work out, conceptually I really like that idea. I would make sure that the kids feel like both homes are their own homes, and that requires them having stuff at both places so they don't have to pack things back and forth. It requires creativity with how you refer to both houses, and how you and dad refer to each other's houses. tricky, but possible, and essential. maybe instead of saying "you're going to dad's house tonight" you say "tonight you're going home with dad" -- the language surrounding two households can be the worst part, but the kids need to feel like both homes are their homes, and it can be done for sure. my brother and his ex have always had a 50/50 split, and it works really, really well. I'm really proud of my little bro for being such an awesome dad through all the crazy, and as much as it hurts, you have to give your ex the same chance. The whole thing is unfair and awful, but all you can do is make the most of the situation, and make it as easy as possible on the kids.

miss you, wish I could come hang out on one of your kid-free evenings! how are they going so far? does ex tell you how bedtime goes?