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Is it impossible and would value any input

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 
This is a mess.

We carry no mortgage, had no car payments for 12 years until this summer when we had to borrow from my dad, etc. We live on one income of about 50K and have years of experience of living well within our means. My husband and I get frugality basically.

But my son is medically expensive to put it mildly. We have a high deductible plan (best through husband's employer/state of Indiana) and his outright medical expenses monthly are outrageous and the necessary but not covered expenses are almost as bad. Yet they really are necessary. And my other son and I have expensive health issues too much of which also isn't covered. It's all snowballing lately and we're really, really struggling. I spent almost nothing for Christmas or my son's birthdays (70 I think combined on them for Christmas and birthday both and 50 for all other family). I need to go through everything I guess but it seems like almost everything we buy is necessary.

And we aren't making it. We're spending more than we're making which goes against every fiber of my being. We thought we would be ok because we got huge insurance reimbursement from the end of last year (1500 reimbursed that we had paid to providers) and a sizable tax return. It's all gone and then some. We've had had three major appliances completely break and they couldn't be repaired/had to be replaced just since Thanksgiving and those bills haven't even been covered/are looming over us. A six months same as cash on one of those appliances is coming due in May. A water heater is being paid off a little at a time with our local hardware store. That follows replacing an oven and dishwasher in June (couldn't repaired/we tried) and replacing a roof (only paid 1000 insurance deductible on that fortunately). Our transmission went out for the third time in 1.5 years this summer and so we felt we had to replace a van as well and borrowed from my dad at a low rate of interest. We've always paid cash for cars and drove them until they broke while we saved so that alone shows we're failing to save anymore. My husband is worried we won't be able to pay off our credit card this month for the first time in our lives. He told me Ramsey says his plan won't help if there are major health expenses. Our second vehicle won't start (stopped running this week) and we can't afford to repair it and with my son's issues it makes me nervous to be trapped here without a vehicle. And how do I homeschool without transportation? Yet I have to be without.

Even without all that extra though my husband told me this week-end that our day to day expenses lately (talking basically food, heat/water/etc and medical alone) are outpacing his income. I feel like I've been punched.

I'll be honest...finances have always ranged from making me bored to making me anxious and I avoid them. They are very much my husbands thing. I don't know where we are except when he tells me we are in trouble I know it's true.

I think probably we should lay every penny out and figure out how to make this work somehow but if it's really impossible the thought of that makes me entirely depressed and stressed. I know there are small things--like my husband drinks 2 liter cokes and eats candy a lot--that maybe can be trimmed but he seems to think that it's too small to matter and you can't cut discretionary things out completely (I admit, he spends very little but it has to add up to something, right? I bought a book yesterday I've been really wanting as I think it might help me with anxiety and now I'm feeling like I should have not spent the $12). We have really cheap internet w/our phone company and I feel like I need it for sanity and homeschooling both. No cable, no dates, no eating out, etc. though. Still there are small things like my book and his cokes. Can you really cut discretionary entirely? Would you? Is really impossible to manage finances with high medical expenses? Does anyone have insight?
post #2 of 16
the only think I could think of: The medical expences that are not covered by insurance, is there a way to fight to get them covered? Are there therapies similar that would be? Local nonprofits that have scholorships? My daughter had a very expensive therapy, and we paid nothing, we were lucky enough to have a local nonprofit offer services. (hbot) If you need me to research anything, let me know. I want to help.
post #3 of 16
Honestly? and this might get flamed, but what i would honestly do is drop the health insurance you are paying for, and get the child insured through the state. the hoosier healthwise income limits for a family of 4 is 55, 128 per year, or 4594 per month. The catch is, the children have to be uninsured for 3 months prior to the coverage kicking in. But then, once you are on it, you pay 30-70 dollars per month and have 100% coverage. you pay NOTHING else. Not for dr visits or treatment or tests or therapy, nothing. zero dollars. How much would it help your budget to go from whatever you are paying now to paying a flat fee of 30-70 dollars per month, period, for medical care for the children?
post #4 of 16
I'm sorry you're in such a frustrating situation.

You don't seem completely sure of where your $ is going each month, so perhaps a month or two of writing down every penny you spend would give you greater insight? Often even just the first week of tracking spending can be a real eye-opener. Make sure DH tracks his spending, also, and then sit down together and see if there are areas that can be reduced. If an amt seems too small to be of consequence, be sure to multiply that amt to see how much it would cost per month/year. Then give some thought to what else the $ could go for.

Ex: If I were getting fastfood for $2.75/wk (love soft tacos, but bring my own drink in the car to save $) it doesn't seem like much. But when I figure that $2.75 x 52 weeks = $143, I realize that the $ could go to buy a pair of new glasses for my dd.

I hope you are able to "find" some $ in your budget to make things easier. I'm sorry I have no advice for the insurance/medical situation, but honestly, if things are as bad as you say, then what a pp said about state insurance may be your logical choice.
post #5 of 16
Unfortunately, I've been put in the position of juggling therapies between the kids to manage the load that copays/driving put on the budget. Two of the therapies that my oldest does are completely out of pocket. I had to take a long hard look and find more balance w/ the therapies and other household expenses. We may be opting out of music tx this spring and waiting til the end of summer before school to do a 10wk session. Is there wiggle room in the therapy schedule to take every x week off or switch up the frequency of sessions/do some co-treats??
post #6 of 16
Congrats on having your house paid off.

I understand that the overall financial picture is too scary to look at in detail sometimes. You could focus on tracking just 2 things for the month - cost of food (something you have control over!) and medical costs.

as others have said, investigate state health ins plans. can your son get ssdi? would that help? don't be afraid to ask for a discount or payment plans from the care providers.

My opinion may be a little more high risk and consumerist than where you are coming from. I would suggest a home equity line of credit, for emergency use. the medical expenses, imho, count as an emergency. with a child sick and needing medical care, that care is prioritized over financial security. a heloc, 401k loan or even a planned bankruptcy could be preferred over going without needed medical services. It looks like you are dealing with mito issues, therefore long term expenses... that could figure into your decision making

I am sorry you are dealing with this. Maybe health insurance reform will eventually happen.
post #7 of 16
That is a LOT of financial crap to have to absorb all at once. I agree that you should start looking into assistance from other sources.

You might as well sit down with your husband, go through everything, and find out exactly what is going on. It will be painful, but it is necessary to experience the pain to get your family to a better place, financially.

Set a small amount of discretionary money for each of you to spend, even if it's only five or ten dollars a week. It will actually save you money by helping you to resist impulse purchases.

Write down every penny you spend; you need to be very conscious of your spending.

Many of us manage to do without the second car.

Dale Carnegie said in one of his books that if you're backed into a corner, the best thing to do is figure out where you are, and what the absolute worst case scenario could be. Then he advised that you accept that the worst case could actually happen. (If you can accept it, you won't waste your energy worrying about it, I think his reasoning was.) Then you can throw yourself fully into improving your situation. Anyway, problems won't go away until you face them.
post #8 of 16
Thread Starter 
Wow. From the bottom of my heart (how corny is that but feels accurate) I want to thank you all for your replies. When I wrote that last night I really felt it was hopeless. But these are great thoughts and maybe this is doable--we won't know if I won't face it to figure out. I am going to tell hubby I think we need to track to the penny. Interestingly, he can probably figure that out for our recent months of spending as he keeps records but compiling it all will take some time. Then we'll just look at numbers and see what we can and can't do--medical wise (insurance and other choices as well), I know the second vehicle is out and I'll be ok with that once I adjust, and even if a loan might be the best option. I love the idea of hoosier healthwise but I don't think I'm medically stable enough to manage without insurance. The three of us do have mito but Andrew is most effected. It's still possible it's going to be cheaper so we'll look into that. It's very good to have someone (other than my husband ) tell me that a little discretionary is actually a good idea.

I told my mom we can't afford some (very necessary) tests for Andrew and she and dad decided to have us stop paying our loan to them for now. Though I feel really, really upset about that on an emotional level it will help.

I don't mean to babble again but thank you all so much for your help!

I'll put my anxiety aside or just plow through it and look at all the stuff you guys mentioned.
post #9 of 16
Can you negoitiate payments/cost of services with the doctors/hospitals?
post #10 of 16
OK I only had time to read this really quickly so I apologize if I repeat things someone else said or whatever...

Yes, I would cut out discretionary spending completely (or limit it to $X a week at least) -- find alternatives (i.e. get books from the library, get your DH to drink water, check freecycle for things you want)... it really does add up quickly, DH & I save a ton but never getting coffees or buying lunch or toys or books etc. and we don't feel deprived.

I don't really understand your insurance situation (I hate insurances!!) but do you qualify for state insurance to supplement your regular insurance? When I was younger I was really sick & in the hospital for a year & my parents were able to get state insurance (even though their income would've been too high under normal circumstances) to bridge the gap. Also make sure you are deducting your medical expenses on your tax returns & use a FSA if you can.

Then there are always the little things that you may already be doing but I'll mention them anyway just in case, may spark some ideas for you... switch to cloth (instead of paper towels, toilet paper, etc.), use baking soda & vinegar to clean instead of store-bought (everything from your hair to furniture to toys...), compare the 'per unit' prices on everything you buy, stick to a very basic grocery list & only get one 'treat' (i.e. more expensive item) per week... get 'needed' items/clothes second-hand (yard sale season is about to start!) You get the idea, I'm sure you're doing some or even all of those things already but you never know...

Also I know it's stressful to think about laying out your budget, accounting for each penny, etc. but I find it a relief when I'm done... not knowing where you stand can be much scarier than having all the numbers. You can work with numbers, you can't work with the unknown!!

Anyway... I can only imagine how rough it's got to be to deal with all those medical expenses (not to mention the stress of having medical issues in itself!!) I hope you can work through this & find a good solution!!
post #11 of 16
On the issue of discretionary spending I would say it is possible to completely cut it out but it is very difficult for most people in the long-term. You say that your husband drinks soda and eats candy...would you say he spends five dollars or fifteen dollars on these things each week?

My best advice for fun money for you and your husband is that you include a small allowance for both of you in your budget. With the level of money problems that you are talking about in this post that allowance may be VERY small, but it will be yours to spend in any way you want.
post #12 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbgrace View Post
I'll be honest...finances have always ranged from making me bored to making me anxious and I avoid them. They are very much my husbands thing. I don't know where we are except when he tells me we are in trouble I know it's true.
I know how hard it can be to finally sit down and look at your finances. I've been there, and there are still times I want to avoid looking at my checking account balance or budget and just buy the things that I want and figure it out later. I've found that it is less stressful to just bite the bullet and take an honest look at the finances.
post #13 of 16



Yes you may qualify for "bridge/gap" Medicaid (or whatever various state programs/insurance in your state) to have medical bills above and beyond what your insurance pays to be paid. And def look into the tax deductions for extreme medical costs!!!!!




Also see if there is any of the therapies that you can do yourself at home too, with maybe the right equipment (not exactly sure what you need).




Is there anyway to share the car with DH? Can you drop off/pick him up some days?
post #14 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbgrace View Post
We have a high deductible plan (best through husband's employer/state of Indiana) and his outright medical expenses monthly are outrageous and the necessary but not covered expenses are almost as bad. \
I'm SO sorry this is happening to you. Insurance in the US is such a friggin' mess it just pisses me off!

Do you have any other options with DH's work OTHER than the high deductible plan? You say it's "Best" but I don't know what that means. Generally people who don't use/need insurance take the high deductible plans and figure they will pay out of pocket. Since you DO need the insurance and are using it regularly, I'm wondering if there are some other options for you? Would it be an option for him to be on a different plan than the 3 of you dependents?

Oh yes - are you itemizing your taxes? Because I think there are deductions for medical bills - esp if they will exceed 10% of your income.
post #15 of 16
I would still look into the state insurance. I always heard that the child had to be uninsured for several months, too, so I kept ds on our insurance for a long time while going into debt. But it turned out that what they really meant was that the child had to not be covered by a policy covered by someone else like through the workplace. So I was able to switch ds over to CHIP (PA's Children's insurance) with no gap in coverage because we had our own policy (always been cheaper for us than the ones through work due to our low income status).

If you can't get the kids on state coverage, maybe you can switch the family to a private policy, first. We have something for low income (Blue Cross's "Special Care"). I don't know what the income cut off is for a larger family. I think it's about 36,000 for a family of three.
post #16 of 16
You may qualify for medicaid if your son is diagnosed.
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