3 yo tantrums - help me, flame me, vent with me...

[hopefulfaith]

My older son was pretty much done with the throw-yourself-down-and-scream/cry sorts of tantrums by the time he turned three, and it completely astounds me that my daughter still does it.

There's no reasoning, there's no calming down and talking, there's no...nothing. Except her tantruming and me wanting to crawl out of my skin, it drives me so completely crazy.

She had to get dressed this morning so that we could take my son to preschool, but she "didn't feel like it." It is still very cold here in the mornings, and I can't take her in her PJs - she does have to be dressed. I try to be gentle about it, and the kids are used to the routine: I've even sweetened the deal by allowing them to watch Curious George on PBS after they've gotten dressed/brushed teeth/combed hair/PJs in closet. For a formerly TV-free family, this is a big deal in our house; we have George on 3-4 mornings a week and a family movie on Fridays, but generally no TV other than that.

This morning, she wanted to watch George without getting dressed. I gently but firmly reminded her of the deal - clothes first, then George.

She threw herself down on the floor and screamed for fifteen minutes. I spent a few minutes trying to help her calm down, and then I got in the shower. She was still mad when I got out, and I told her that she needed to stop screaming and get dressed. I was still calm and focused on trying to help her, but then I heard my voice come out of my body: "If you cannot stop crying and screaming, we will not be going to playgroup this morning. Playgroup does not allow tantrums."

The voice in the back of my head yelled NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! *I* want to go to playgroup! I want to drink coffee with the other moms! Don't take that away!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!But I did.



She got dressed in time to take A to preschool and she's since calmed down and is much nicer now that she's had a few minutes to breathe and eat some breakfast. She is quite lovely now, and chattering and drawing at the table behind me. I so desperately want to go to playgroup because I haven't been out and about in days with other adults (dh didn't even come home from work last night until we were all in bed), but that little voice in the back of my head is trying to reason that there should be consequences to actions, while the other little voice is still tantruming itself: Mama wants to go to playgroup! Mama wants to go!


I feel ridiculous.

This day needs to start over.

[pianojazzgirl]

I think you can still go to playgroup. You put not going to playgroup as a natural consequence to her: if she was tantrumming you couldn't go, because they don't allow that kind of behaviour there. But now she's settled down. You could say "I'm glad you're feeling better now. Now we can go to playgroup" (assuming it's playgroup time and she's still calm). Before going you can remind her of the kind of behaviour expected at playgroup.

It sounds like getting dressed in the morning is a regular trigger/difficulty? What I do (not to avoid tantrums, but just because my 5 yr old takes a million reminders to go get dressed which drives me nuts) is to dress her in her next-day clothes the night before. She sleeps in her clothes, but they don't look messy or anything. It's not like little girls are going out in the world in linen pant suits or something.

Besides that just wanted to send hugs and empathy. From reading here on the GD board it seems like tantrums are actually more common for kids aged 3 than 2. I know my dd was still having some major blow-outs at that age. It is normal and will pass.

[hopefulfaith]

Kate, thanks so much for your response. I did end up taking her after a long talk, and we haven't had much drama the rest of the day.

It just felt like a fake natural consequence, because my daughter never tantrums at playgroup - she lives for it, and dreams of the day she'll go to school... -- and I felt like I was dangling playgroup in front of her in exchange for stopping. She did calm down, we did talk, we did discuss the behavior expected of her at playgroup ... all of that -- and she was fine after her meltdown. I know she's not a morning person, and I'm actually signing her up for 3 yo preschool next year (which I didn't do with my son) instead of 4 yo because I think she's going to need year or three before she's able to function at a level where she has to do what she needs to do, even if she doesn't want to.

I am just tired today. Thank you for your support. I find it very hard to GD tantrums these days because my natural inclination is to walk away and tell her to come find me when she's done. I know that's not appropriate, but I fight very hard with myself not to do that.

[flower01]

Glad you feel better. My daughter is not quite three and her tantrums have really escalated in the last couple weeks. DH and I are really at a loss...if they were the throw yourself down and scream kind I think we would be ok. But, they are more like flail and kick and scream and follow us around screaming to pick her up, but then when we do she continues to scream and kick...we honestly have no clue what to do...We've tried leaving her alone and holding her close. Nothing works and it ends with us all in a heap.

It's the one thing that mothering.com hasn't helped me with. I've read advice over and over and nothing seems to be effective in any way.

[2cutiekitties]

flower, have you just acknowledged that she is mad and then not said anything? How to Talk So Kids Will Listen & Listen So Kids Will Talk really helped me in this dept. I just say, oh you are mad and try and have a soothing look on my face and the results have been amazing. I dont try and fix or reason or do anything. I just acknowledge and move on. I highly rec the book if you havent read it!

[hopefulfaith]

That is a great book. I actually bought it, and I refer to it pretty often.

Flower, I'm totally with you. If it were just a flailing/crying thing, I think it wouldn't make me as upset. As it is, it's a *screaming* thing (which I can't deal with well; my first question is "Has your leg been torn off by wolves?" if I hear someone screaming) accompanied by kicking the wall while she's laying on the floor, and other obnoxious stuff. I don't mind my child being sad and angry -- I do mind the screaming and kicking.

The thing that is making it worse for me is that I am so freaking tired these days. I can GD pretty well most days, but when I'm tired ((because said 3 yo is going through a nightmare/dream phase of waking up terrified)) because I've been engaged in nighttime parenting all freaking night....well, I feel like having a tantrum a lot of days, too.

[pianojazzgirl]

You said in an earlier post that your natural inclination is to walk away and tell her to come get you when you're done. Well, after you've empathized, tried to offer comfort, distract, or whatever then I think it is ok to walk away. Especially if the alternative is you going bonkers and maybe yelling or whatever (not accusing you of being a bonkers-gone yeller... just that that's a reaction that tantrums sometime provoke in me!). I don't know if this is the *right* answer or not, but if I were at the end of my rope I would definitely walk away to a quieter part of the house and just let my dc "let it all out" (as long as they were safe - ie. not banging their head against a wall or throwing things or something).

[mamazee]

My daughter's tantrums were pretty violent looking and sounding. I don't think you can tell a child how to tantrum. Unfortunately. It's by definition a loss of control. I would empathize, let her know I was there for her when I was ready, and she'd eventually want me. It's frustrating but I think tantrums are a normal part of development. Regardless of how they look, I'd do the same thing: give words to describe the feelings ("You look frustrated!" "I hear that you are angry."), empathize (I wish we could ***), and wait it out. They are learning a few things, like futility - that no matter how much we'd like some things to happen, they jsut won't - and about strong emotions, and also about relationships, that no matter how angry and upset we get, those who love us still love us. And that their love is constant as well. It's scary for kids to get angry at their parents at that age. Does anger mean the love is less, or gone for that time? Those are hard things to work out. I think showing that our love is constant is a big part of helping kids outgrow tantrums. And I think that is the goal - not to stop them, but to help the child outgrow them.

I know they're hard, though. I personally found colic harder to deal with, but all ages have their difficult spots. I think with tantrums, and to some extent with colic too, things got easier for me when I stopped feeling like if I couldn't fix unhappiness that I wasn't doing my job. Unhappiness is part of life, even very strong unhappy feelings. Kids have those feelings too, and it's ok.