How do you help the baby sleep?

[Astraia]

We're getting a lot of very fussy periods due to an overtired baby. SIL says to avoid the fussiness just make sure the baby goes down for a nap 90 minutes after they wake up, which is great in theory and I'm sure would help.... if I could make him sleep. He will sleep sitting on my lap and either nursing or snuggling a boob. He will NOT sleep in a wrap or sling unless I am walking at a good pace the whole time, which is obviously not possible with a 1 yr old. He won't sleep if I put him down anywhere. Right now I just sit on the couch for hours with my shirt up and let him sleep that way but DH goes back to work soon and I need Orrin to sleep so that I can care for my daughter. Any advice? Words of wisdom? Tricks or tips? (if not, then as it warms up the dog is going to be the most highly exercised dog in the world!)

[boigrrrlwonder]

My DD just turned three, so she's quite a bit older than your oldest DC, but putting my DS in a wrap and bouncing on an exercise ball has worked well for us. I can still read to her, play dolls, etc... and do this.

[sunshadow]

Max won't even sleep in my lap nursing. I have to walk and walk with him. Sometimes I put in music and my daughter joins in as we dance. Have you tried a swing? My daughter would sleep great in a swing.

[mamakims]

Sophie won't usually fall asleep on me and falls asleep on her own in the bassinet with her sleep sheep. I love the days she falls asleep nursing but that's rare! She will also not sleep in the wrap or sling unless we're walking around but as soon as I stop she's up!
But if she's really overtired and fussy then we swaddle her and stand in the kitchen with the fan on high and bounce/rock her. THis works like a charm. Putting her down when she's alseep in the swaddle is easier than if she wasn't swaddled.
What if he was swaddled when you nursed him so it might be easier to lay him down?

And question... are our babies supposed to be up for 90 minutes? I get about 45 minutes at most with Sophie before she's back asleep....

[Helensmom]

Have you tried swaddling? Mine will fall asleep when I walk with her on my shoulder but will wake up when I put her down in the crib if she isn't swaddled.

Someone once suggested putting a hot water bottle in the crib (and then removing it) before putting your baby down. They'll think the warmth is you or something like that. I haven't tried it, but it sounded good in theory.

-Linda

[caefi]

Originally Posted by mamakims

And question... are our babies supposed to be up for 90 minutes? I get about 45 minutes at most with Sophie before she's back asleep....

my thinking went there, too. Matthew's awake 15-20min at at time. If I tried to get him to be awake for an hour he'd be a huge fussbucket, I cannot imagine an hour and a half!


Astraia, have you considered hiring a mother's helper?

[geo_girl]

Originally Posted by caefi

my thinking went there, too. Matthew's awake 15-20min at at time. If I tried to get him to be awake for an hour he'd be a huge fussbucket, I cannot imagine an hour and a half!

I *know* that they are supposed to be down again within a 2hr window, but I find it quite impossible to dedicate the amount of time required to Margaret to sleep with the older 2 running around. It was much easier with the first, and somewhat easier with the 2nd...

I feel bad for Margaret because I know she isn't getting as much sleep as she needs, but I'm not sure how to juggle things around....

...and then once she misses the "window", she's up for another *LONG* time...

this too shall pass.
cheers,
charlene

[AfricanQueen99]

Once I figured out that my daughter needed the sucking motion (more than the nursing) to sleep I started sticking my pinky in her mouth to soothe her...it eventually worked to let her suck to sleep. The same thing is working for Griffin. This helps when I want to eat or spend time with my daughter.

I just needed to figure out what they needed to cope.

[StrawberryFields]

In the morning I set the oldest 2 up with breakfast and PBS. I change and nurse dd2 down for her nap and then wrap her up and put her in the swing. She sleeps there for a good hour or two while I quick do the laundry, dishes, and lunch/dinner prep that I need to do for the day.

[nola79]

DD likes to be rocked, or have me walking while bouncing her in my arms. I am not BFing, though, so I'm not sure if that makes a difference.
If she is extremely fussy, I take her for a car ride, and she will usually fall asleep and then I lie down with her, if I lay her down by herself she usually wakes up.

[Marylizah]

This baby will only sleep during the day in the Beco. If I put him down, he's awake in 10-20 minutes. He won't sleep in the swing-- heck, he won't sit in the swing for more than 5 minutes before he starts to fuss.

It's funny, because at night he sleeps just fine in his side-carred crib. Not sure why he's so adamantly opposed to that during the day.

I think the trick is to try absolutely everything you can think of until you find the trick that works. I think of my cousin, who somehow discovered that putting his twin girls in a toy wagon and pulling it around the house helped them fall asleep for naps! He must have been pretty desperate to try that! Lol.

Good luck...

[akat]

This thread answers a question I was going to post, how long do your babies stay awake at a time. Ben is often awake for a couple of hours at a time [sometimes with a short doze in the middle], he's had a virus so even longer a few times.

He sometimes falls asleep nursing, but often falls asleep from me walking him around. I can walk in a circle in my downstairs, so that really helps. If my 5 year old is busy being loud and rowdy downstairs, I pace in the bedroom or put on Pandora and dance around with lots of bouncing. One thing I've noticed is he's pretty particular about how he wants to be held - sometimes he wants to be up on the shoulder, sometimes he wants to be in 'baby tree kangaroo' hold [draped over an arm parallel to the floor, facing down or sideways], once in a while he'll consent to cradle hold - and he'll cry if we pick the wrong one, settle down right away once we get it right.

[smokeylo]

I think our babies are about to hit a transitional period when the move out of that newborn ability to sleep a ton and sleep anywhere and into the period where they need certain comforts to nap. I'm nervous about this since I think I got DD1 into some bad habits at this point last time and don't want to repeat that with Holly!

Right now, Holly naps in a few places during the day:

1. The bouncy seat, with the vibrations on. I'm pretty excited this is working now, but I don't expect it to last.

2. My lap or the sling -- this is working less well because she's getting more distractable. However, by the end of the day she seems to want to be on me more so I try to use the sling and she will usually conk out.

3. The bed where she and I sleep, with white noise on. This is the trickiest place to get her down but if she STAYS down, she can nap there for over an hour at a time.

I definitely have to keep the lights down, sounds quieter, and movement down with Holly now. White noise -- LOUD white noise!! -- is a big help.

[hakeber]

I don't really time Emily's naps (she's two months now). She really just has one long one now in the middle of the day, and then falls asleep around 6 or 7 pretty much for the night, I wake her for one feeding and she wakes for her second feeding, and then we're up for the day...she does cat nap in my arms after each feeding in the day but like for five or ten minutes, tops.

At night when I wake her for her first feeding Around 10, I nurse her, bathe her, swaddle her then nurse her again in the rocking chair with the white noise BLASTING. She is usually comatose in minutes and I lay her down and she stays asleep for anywhere from 5-7 hours (last weekend I got just over nine but that was a total fluke.), The white noise stays on all night.

For her long nap, I nurse her to sleep, lay her in her pram, give her a pacifier to suckle and she sucks it for about 30 minutes (sometimes it pops out when she is still drifting off and I need to replace it for her, sometimes she finds her own hand and happily goes back to sleep) before she falls deep asleep, if she needs it I give her a wee jiggle for a few minutes to resettle her.

She always sleeps in the wrap or the sling, but I find I get more done with her in the wrap, she's just more secure for me. So, if I need to get things done and she's awake I change her, feed her, pop her in the wrap and do my stuff. I usually get an hour or so of her either asleep or very very happy to be so close to the milk source (just to make sure I haven't left the building).

She's awake sometimes for three or four hours without trouble, but she is a very calm kid. Right now as I type she is sitting on my lap, happy as Larry, just smiling away. I generally try to follow her cues, though I must say she seems to know what she's doing as far as sleep needs and food.

DS was a different story. He had to be swaddled for every nap, or in the fleece lined sling and he needed all five of the S's to get down and constant sucking and shushing to stay down. We actually tried swaddling him so the pacifier would stay in his mouth. I was sure he'd suck that thing till he was five...but he spit it out at 6 months all the same and never looked back. He was down to three naps and one night feeding by two months, sttn by three months, but still at 5 years old NEEDS certain rituals to fall asleep. That being said, sometimes we would pop him in the sling if he was fussy or having a hard time going down and he wouldn't sleep but he would just go dead calm for a while and bliss out in that thing as we shushed and bounced about our business. Sometimes that was enough for him, just quiet restful time.

I think sleep is less important to some babies than constant contact. Is he happy enough in the sling? If so, I say wear him and if doesn't sleep, at least he's with his favorite person while he's going through it all, ya know? A lot of experts say that is the key to STTN, just constant touching all day.

I don't know, but at least then you could get on with your day and your older child, ya know?

[Astraia]

Originally Posted by Helensmom

Have you tried swaddling? Mine will fall asleep when I walk with her on my shoulder but will wake up when I put her down in the crib if she isn't swaddled.
-Linda

He unfortunately hates being swaddled. He's always got his hands near his face and if I try to swaddle he fights until his hands are out.

Originally Posted by caefi

Astraia, have you considered hiring a mother's helper?

I have family and friends who have offered to help, but I can't have someone here all the time so I'm trying to find some way to cope with the day to day

Originally Posted by hakeber

Is he happy enough in the sling? If so, I say wear him and if doesn't sleep, at least he's with his favorite person while he's going through it all, ya know? A lot of experts say that is the key to STTN, just constant touching all day.

He is not a happy child, generally speaking. He's not angry or anything but he needs to be held the *right* way or he'll cry. I can't put him down anywhere for more than about 5 minutes, and he screams in the sling, wrap, pikkolo, etc. Yesterday he was awake and fussy from 9:30 am until almost 2 in the afternoon. That's INSANE. He then had a really good nap, but he was so over tired by the time he finally went down that he was completely inconsolable and finally cried himself to sleep. This is especially hard for me because my daughter is a crappy sleeper. Horrible. Awful. She's up every 2 hours at night and her naps are hit and miss. She's cranky and miserable because she's too tired and it can take hours to get her down for a nap just to have her pop up 5 minutes later. I was really hoping for 1 good sleeper, one happy and well rested child. Grr.

[hakeber]

Originally Posted by Astraia

He unfortunately hates being swaddled. He's always got his hands near his face and if I try to swaddle he fights until his hands are out.

I don't mean to be obnoxious, but have you tried swaddling him after he has nursed into a milky state of bliss? Then nursing him a bit more to top him off?

This is what I have to do for Emily, otherwise she clenches her wee fists and tenses her arms...well the first few times she did, now she knows what's coming so she relaxes. The first few times I did it she was not sure what I was doing and really fought it with this face: , but once it was done PROPERLY she loved it and was like this ...are you sure you are doing it tight enough? A good swaddle is inescapable...have you tried the double swaddle? This is the only one that really works for DD, and I tie it up with a small square scarf to boot.

I didn't realize how tight it has to be done at first, ds would fuss and hit at it and wriggle free and wake up all the time at first. Once we got it right though he was so damn happy, he looked at us like... god almighty, took you idiots long enough! My friends were all shocked at how tight we swaddled him, my MIL was angry with me and still holds a grudge, but he woke up so happy and well rested, I didn't care what they thought.

Here are some links that show the appropriate tightness:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOnsKlluHIg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5K4Vd...eature=related (I do this one and fasten it with my scarf good and tight.

[hakeber]

Originally Posted by Astraia

He is not a happy child, generally speaking. He's not angry or anything but he needs to be held the *right* way or he'll cry. I can't put him down anywhere for more than about 5 minutes, and he screams in the sling, wrap, pikkolo, etc. Yesterday he was awake and fussy from 9:30 am until almost 2 in the afternoon. That's INSANE. He then had a really good nap, but he was so over tired by the time he finally went down that he was completely inconsolable and finally cried himself to sleep. This is especially hard for me because my daughter is a crappy sleeper. Horrible. Awful. She's up every 2 hours at night and her naps are hit and miss. She's cranky and miserable because she's too tired and it can take hours to get her down for a nap just to have her pop up 5 minutes later. I was really hoping for 1 good sleeper, one happy and well rested child. Grr.

You're right, that is insane.

What about white noise? Sucking? Have you tried the 5Ss (do you know what I am talking about?)

DS was a really crappy sleeper until we tried these.

[Astraia]

I didn't realize how tight the swaddle should be, haebeker. I can try that this time. DD needed and loved the swaddle. We could have it pretty loose and it was fine, she'd settle right into it. I figured if he didn't like it right of he'd nevr like it, but I could be doing it wrong. /// For the 5 S's (sorry, no enter key, this is a new paragraph!) he isn't too big on shushing but white noise helps (though a screeching 15 month old negates the effect somewhat!). He likes bouncing more then swinging and he would nurse to sleep except if he's overtired or full... then when my milk lets down he has a fit. If I try to let him suck on my finger or give him a pacifier he makes awful faces and screams louder than ever. //// But today, I'm trying new things (not just what worked with DD) and we're having more success. Holding him in your arm facing out, like your arm is a chair, and bouncing him seems to work. Once he's able to fall asleep that way you can often transfer him (and he'll sleep there for 10 min to 2 hours, depending on his mood). I'll try swaddling him up first and see if i can consistently get a longer stretch of sleep. I also think that trying to CALM DOWN has helped me a lot. I've been getting into panicky states recently and that obviously helps nothing.

[akat]

Astraia, I know what you mean about getting panicky. Not to overuse this term, but I almost feel like I have post traumatic stress syndrome because of what a bad sleeper my older son was. Any time Ben doesn't go to sleep when I expect him to, it triggers it. Sleep deprivation is used as torture, after all. So far Ben seems a better sleeper, but we haven't hit teething yet, so I'm nervously anticipating that. Ben had a cold and stayed up a couple of nights like all night, that was no fun.

[devasma]

I think Ethan would have a fit if he was swaddled that tightly! He HATES having his arms pinned down.
Ethan has been a fairly good sleeper so far. He has been going through a phase the past few weeks where he doesn't want to sleep for more than 30-40 minutes at a time during the day. It is getting better this week though, thankfully. A few days last week, by the late afternoon he was sooo tired and cranky, but didn't settle enough to sleep deeply until about 9pm.
Ethan usually falls asleep nursing, and then he is put in his swing. When he stays sleeping, he usually sleeps for 2 hours or so. My oldest had to be rocked to sleep most of the time, it was pretty frustrating.
Ethan usually stays up for at least 90 minutes, often for 2 hours. He's trying to figure out how to coordinate his hands/arms to move the way he wants, apparently this takes much time and concentration. He loves looking around and seeing what is going on around him, I think sleep sometimes gets in the way of this, lol.
Out of no where this week, Ethan has been sleeping for 7-8 hours at night. He spends from about 7pm on nursing, snoozing for 5-10 minutes, sucking his fists, looking around, and then repeating the cycle, until between 9 and 10 he just passes out cold. Hopefully the long night sleeping will last!