Am I unreasonable about this? - Page 4

[goldingoddess]

You were totally in the right.

I have two dogs. One an aussie shepherd who is extremely obedient and walks at my side, has no interest in approaching other people and comes when called. I still walk him on a leash in any area that is not specifically a no-leash area. And the reason is because I have another dog who is an Akita, and who if approached by another dog off-leash while he is on-leash will attack and pin down the other dog in defense. IMO it is not ok to have a dog offleash unless it is specifically an off-leash area. Because if my Akita thinks your 'well-trained' offleash lab is a at all a threat when he approches us, your dog will be hurt, and I don't want that.

Also, even though I love dogs I am not OK with dogs running towards, barking or circling my toddler. I have actually been in a petsmart when someone had no control over their on-leash 50 pound lab puppy who dragged their owner over to my toddler and started barking and lurching and I YELLED at the owner to keep their dog away from us (we were crouched down looking at the fish tanks at that moment.)

I don't care how well you know your dog or how well it is trained, keep it on a leash.

[NYCVeg]

I, too, would have been pretty angry--and I am an absolute dog lover. But my dd is terrified of them AND she's allergic. There are leash laws for a reason.

I also think that the responsibility runs both ways--that is, the dog should be on a leash not only out of respect for other people, but also out of respect for the dog. Not all toddlers know how to respect animals. When we had a dog, if a child was interested in her and approached, I always instructed the child how to interact with our somewhat neurotic (but quite sweet) dog--e.g., "yes, you may pet her, but please only pet her here because she might get scared if you reach over her head" etc. I didn't want my dog to bother any child who might be scared of her, but I also didn't want HER to get scared, to be handled roughly, to get her ears pulled by a rowdy toddler, etc.

[neetling]

I agree with this. I abhor unleashed animals coming at my family and I really don't want to interact with a dog unless I initiate the contact. I have always taught my children that they may not pet or approach an animal without the owners permission.

Originally Posted by NYCVeg

I, too, would have been pretty angry--and I am an absolute dog lover. But my dd is terrified of them AND she's allergic. There are leash laws for a reason.

I also think that the responsibility runs both ways--that is, the dog should be on a leash not only out of respect for other people, but also out of respect for the dog. Not all toddlers know how to respect animals. When we had a dog, if a child was interested in her and approached, I always instructed the child how to interact with our somewhat neurotic (but quite sweet) dog--e.g., "yes, you may pet her, but please only pet her here because she might get scared if you reach over her head" etc. I didn't want my dog to bother any child who might be scared of her, but I also didn't want HER to get scared, to be handled roughly, to get her ears pulled by a rowdy toddler, etc.

[snoopy5386]

we went to the park today and there was an unleashed dog there and I immediately thought of this thread! The dog was a medium size shepard mix and the park was a crowded playground type park. I didn't see a no dogs sign, but I wasn't looking and that kind of park is not appropriate for a dog period, certainly not an off-leash one.
The dog was sitting by the picnic tables with the owners while their kids I assume were playing on the playground. We were there about an hour and over the course of the hour they had to call the dog back to them about 10 times at least. She kept wandering away to haunt folks eating at the other picnic tables.
I just can't understand why these people didn't have her on a leash?? Especially if they just wanted the dog to sit right next to them the whole time.
I also kept thinking of my friend whose son is allergic to dog saliva. She would have driven to the park with her kids all excited to play and then would have had to turn around and leave - all because some jerk couldn't be bothered to leash his dog.

[Latte Mama]

Originally Posted by NYCVeg

I, too, would have been pretty angry--and I am an absolute dog lover. But my dd is terrified of them AND she's allergic. There are leash laws for a reason.

I also think that the responsibility runs both ways--that is, the dog should be on a leash not only out of respect for other people, but also out of respect for the dog. Not all toddlers know how to respect animals. When we had a dog, if a child was interested in her and approached, I always instructed the child how to interact with our somewhat neurotic (but quite sweet) dog--e.g., "yes, you may pet her, but please only pet her here because she might get scared if you reach over her head" etc. I didn't want my dog to bother any child who might be scared of her, but I also didn't want HER to get scared, to be handled roughly, to get her ears pulled by a rowdy toddler, etc.

Yes! First, I dogs. However, if some stranger's dog came running up to my toddler, I'd be steamed. My son is not very familiar with dogs as we don't have one nor do we spend time with anyone that has one (well, not a lot of time). So he might just bop the dog on the nose and then what if the dog decides to take a chomp at my son's face? ANY dog can nip no matter how friendly they are. Sorry, I don't want my son injured because some irresponsible dog owner can't be bothered to leash their pup.

OP, you were perfectly fine.

[sapphire_chan]

Originally Posted by Irishmommy

You sound nicer than I would have been.

And thank goodness your kids didn't do anything to set the dog off. My MIL's dog would've been 100% okay in that situation, but he's had special training (canine good citizen). And I can't imagine any dog with that training having ended up near your kids on a no dogs beach so I'd assume that the wrong move would've gotten someone hurt.

[snoww]

We went to the park Saturday-one of these Federal parks with a big lake, were eating lunch with my husband ,6y.o. son and 3y.o. daughter right next to the water. The old junky looking camper drove in to the parking lot and the rough looking family came out of it and they all started smoking. Their Doberman got out of the camper and started running circles around us and toward children. I told them in a nice voice that my children are afraid of the dogs-the man answered "he is a good dog, he is harmless" My daughter started running around shaking and screaming and I told them again that my children are afraid of the dogs-the same answer. My husband is just standing there and telling me not to panic because "I am making children more afraid of the dog and if I just stay still and don't look dog will go away" He didn't say anything to these people, he was just telling me not to panic. I got my daughter up in the ear and when the dog came another time and tried to jump on us I make a kicking motion toward him. The mother of the family said to me" if you kick my dog I will kick you in the f*****g face" That finally got my husband's attention and he said "I think I will call the police now",- and he started dialing the number. The family immediately left. My husband was blaming me for the situation, saying "you don't mess with this kind of people, they are far more dangerous than their dog is, you will get us all killed, we are lucky they didn't come back with the guns" I said if he supported me from the beginning and tried to protect his children instead of telling me not to panic-these people would probably get their dog away. But because they noticed he didn't support me-they feel they dodn't have to do anything.
Our weekend was completely ruined, we were arguing with each other for the last two days, we are mad at each other,my husband still saying that he can tell by looking at the dog if he is aggressive or not, and that Doberman was just playing. I told him that I don't care and don't want to know how friendly the dog is-I just don't want him to run toward my children.

[MissLotus]

OP, you were completely justified in saying something firmly to those people. I love all kinds of animals, but it's very presumptuous when dog owners don't keep their dogs leashed in situations like that. Others shouldn't have to worry about large animals jumping around them.

I was at the beach with my son a couple years ago; we were at at the entrance section where it's rocky (not a cliff, just rocky as it was Maine) and we stood for a moment watching the waves crash. Suddenly a large dog came bounding up, barking - my son turned around, startled - the dog leaped on my son, "just playing" as the owners pointed out. My son fell over backwards over a rock! Thankfully he wasn't hurt, but I was burning mad. CONTROL YOUR DOG. That is NOT just playing! And guess what - we didn't ASK to play with your dog. Keep it on a leash when you're not home.

And I myself took a walk one morning recently after dropping my son off from school, and was across the street from a house where the door suddenly opened and this huge dog came flying out, and ran across the street to me, barking - I seriously thought that was the end of me, when a woman came out and yelled at him to stop. He stopped. I was too shaken to even properly tell her what I thought, just that she should NOT let him out like that! She apologized, but I could not care less - that doesn't make up for letting your pet go wild over other people. An elderly person could have had a heart attack on the spot, seeing that thing flying towards them!

If you know your dog goes nuts the minute you open the door, put on the leash FIRST! I really can't stand some people's self-centeredness when it comes to their dogs. We don't all think it's cute.

[Trinitty]

You were much nicer than I would have been.

Sadly, some people are ignorant jerks, think that rules and reality do not apply to them and they also own dogs. They give dogs a really bad rap.

For the record: I value dogs. I was raised with GIGANTIC dogs. I just really really really dislike bad owners.

Trin.

Also: I carry pepper spray at all times when I am with DD. For rotten dogs and rotten people.

[Storm Bride]

Somehow, I missed this thread until now..

I'd have probably gone ballistic, to be honest. DD1 is absolutely petrified of dogs (we have no idea why, and she's fine with other animals, even large ones). It would have taken forever to get her calmed down and relaxed after something like that, and it would have destroyed our outing completely. It drives me nuts when people just say, "oh, he/she is friendly". We sometimes used to go for walks in an off-leash area (before dd1 became so scared - she was just a baby back then, and usually in a carrier), and it didn't bug me so much there, but it makes me nuts when it's a leash required or no dogs area.

[hibiscus mum]

Grr. You were totally justified, OP. I get so frustrated when we go to our favourite campground - it has several beautiful beaches, including a dog beach. But last time we were there, there were all kinds of dogs on the regular, non-dog beach. I really wanted to say something to the families with dogs there, but I was too chicken.

Last summer, I took DD to the splashpad near our house and there was a man playing with his dog. : And i mean, playing in the actual splashpad. We have a big golden retriever, so DD is used to dogs, but it made me uneasy. The guy was throwing a ball for his dog in the splash pad, so of course all the kids were chasing after the ball too. I didn't say anything in that instance either, because there were no rules posted about dogs or anything...but it seemed a little off to me.

[laila2]

I would have been annoyed

The first time a similar situation happened, me on the beach with my 13 month old in a back pack, a dog ran at me, then behind, barked, and jumped up almost knocking me over. I could not distinguish whos dog it was, but had a good idea of a very guilty looking person carrying a leash. I was pissed, and yelled at the dog,NNNNOOO, in a ferious voice. Dog stopped.

Next time now 6 year old and I are walking in a dog park, she is afraid of dogs, an older border collie, hearding dog, keeps running after my dd and barking near her heels with me repeatedly rounding then dog runs off. I finally said to the older owner, who could barely walk and is sitting on a log, "sir, please control your dog". He said she is friendly so I felt sorry for the guy and took dog by the collar and led her to master so he could hold her while we walked off. I felt good that I was able to be the advocate I was not at the beach.

[lab]

my thoughts

I started to post this the other and am thinking of making it my Facebook status......

FYI - If I am running through the trails of a park that requires dogs to be leashed, and your unleashed dog starts chasing me with the hair on its neck raised.....I'm gonna pepper spray it.

So no - I don't think you were unreasonable AT ALL!

[labdogs42]

Originally Posted by Just1More

Yes, I am still annoyed. Sorry to bite back on the internet.

My response was honest. Would you have done those things and thought it was okay? Why? Because you trusted your dog? Had you been the dog owner in the situation in the OP, would you have thought I was a jerk?

I did want other perspectives. I wanted to know if I was out of line to be so mad.

I would have rolled my eyes had there been a dog there, but wouldn't have said anything or even been bothered by it if it had been in control (leashed or not) and not run up to us while it's owner didn't even do anything. I was bothered that it was up on the kids, friendly or not. And I couldn't know right away if it was, in fact, friendly.

I own big dogs and I have a kid. I would have been upset if I had been in your situation and I think you acted appropriately.

I have let my dogs off leash in places where, technically, they should not have been off leash , BUT if I see any people in the area, I call my dogs back and they are put back on leash. If anyone ever said anything, (no one ever has, I guess because my dogs promptly returned to me) I would be deeply apologetic and would promptly put my dogs back on leash.

The woman in this instance was wrong for not calling her dog away from your children.
It is tough to find places to let dogs run and play these days. I wish there were more dog-friendly beaches and parks around. Then there wouldn't be so many people breaking the rules (although in this instance, it sounds like she had a dog beach she could have been on instead!)

[New_Natural_Mom]

No, I don't think you were wrong. They weren't supposed to be there with the dog. It was unleashed though it was posted. And they let the dog run up to your kids. Not ok to me. I used to have 2 little pomeranians and I wouldn't let them run up to strangers.

[lab]

I don't understand people.

I was running again today in the park on the trails and encountered a lady with a dog off leash. Little white jack russell type dog, except larger.

The dog actually started darting in and out at me and growling. Not barking, but growling. He would dart away from her and then run at me. She laughed when I asked if the dog would chase me when I started running again.

This was fear based aggression and she was clueless. She had a small child around 18 months with a crazy little dog.

I thought about this thread as soon as I saw the dog. I need my pepper spray!!!!

And the best part is when I firmly told her dog no one of the last times he rushed at me - she got ill!!!?!?!?! UGH!

[St. Margaret]

I've had a dog jump up on me two times in a row during my evening walks with DD in my front mei tai. The owner (there were a few chatting, letting their dogs run around the housing assoc's park, which is all leashed areas except the HUGE fenced greenbelt that has free-dog hours, which is bigger than any other area we have!) wasn't even looking at his dog. The second night I asked him, as nicely as I could, to please call his dog. His BIG dog was jumping on me, scratching my baby's legs with his paws. And the owner went OFF on me, saying I was teaching my DD to be afraid of dogs. I was SO peeved. I love dogs. I miss my dog terribly (but my MIL is actually phobic of dogs so out of respect, since she likes to come play with DD, I don't have one... but DD has started asking for one! ). That owner and the others like him here, who always let their dogs run up to DD and bite toys out of her hands, knock her down, bite and deflate her favorite/only ball... they are the one who made my DD afraid of dogs for a good year of her life.

It's very simple. Dogs need to be kept leashed unless they're in your yard or an off-leash area. We have plenty of dog parks, beaches, and areas that there's really no excuse. Don't get me started on how owners let their dogs out to poop in the kids' lawn and park and don't clean up... they don't even come out with their dogs. Which leads to their dogs running wild, knocking down the little kids. We will probably wait to get a dog until we have a bigger yard (we'd want a bigger dog). I just feel it's responsible that way.

OP, you were totally reasonable and maybe started them thinking about being more responsible.

[_betsy_]

A "nice, family dog" almost killed me as a child. So yeah, you were way nicer about it than I would have been. WAY nicer.

[StephandOwen]

Originally Posted by Irishmommy

You sound nicer than I would have been.

I would have gone nuts, personally.

Originally Posted by Grace and Granola

I don't know. I am the owner of a very large, but very well behaved dog. He went through obedience training and wouldn't hurt a fly. I think I might forget that people don't know that about my dog. That they should trust me because I know my dog.

Originally Posted by number572

I had a large dog that used to freak people out b'c of her size, we would tie bright colored bandanas around her neck to make her more friendly looking! (((SNIP))) When my dog has been too quick off leash & run up to someone, I feel out the situation & apologize if the other person is offended at all.

Originally Posted by Grace and Granola

My dog would have run up to your kids to sniff the heck out of them! I would have immediately called him back or grabbed his collar so as not to be a pest to you and your kids.

Seriously? Do you all have that little respect for other people? Your dog running up to people and "sniffing the heck out of them" could KILL them. My dp is allergic to dogs. We believe my ds is as well. I cannot tell you how many times we have had our plans ruined because of unleashed dogs with owners who didn't give a d*mn whether they ran up to other people. When that happens to us we all need to immediately get home, shower everyone and throw all clothes in the washer, dp almost always needs his inhaler and sometimes ds does too.

It has nothing to do with whether your dog is "friendly". You could have the friendliest dog in the world and it could still KILL someone who is allergic. If I wanted to be around a dog, I would go to the pet store. We, however, avoid pet stores. We avoid places we know there are animals allowed. We should be allowed to go to a beach (that has no dogs allowed) and enjoy a day together instead of taking a trip to an emergency room.

[Momily]

I'm a dog owner, of a small, well behaved, fluffy mutt. He's always on a leash unless we're in a fenced in area that specifically allows dogs.

I don't understand the reasoning of "maybe they didn't see the signs". In my city there are something like 8 places, other than private yards, where dogs are allowed off leash and a million where they aren't. Almost all of the beaches I know don't allow dogs even if they are on a leash. If dogs are allowed, it's very clearly a "dog beach", but those are rare. To me, dogs being on leash is the default -- unless there's a sign saying the opposite, I assume that's the rule. So, I don't really understand how "I didn't see a sign" can be a defense.

Do other people live in places where it's common for dogs to be allowed off leash and where that might be a reasonable assumption?

I should add that I used to teach at a special ed school where the children played at a public playground attached to a park. I was always amazed when people would come, and let their dog off leash in a group of 20 - 30 children, some of whom would panic. We weren't as nice as you were -- we'd call 911 and then tell the dog owner that the police were on their way. Usually they left at that point.