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Hair care - whose decision? (10 year old) - Page 2

post #21 of 51
As someone with a similar hair type (and similar hair struggles with my mom), a few suggestions.

Suggest she stop washing her hair often. Maybe even look into no-shampoo routines (i.e. "no poo").

Make sure that every time she washes it, she either conditions it or preferably rinses it with diluted apple cider vinegar. While it has the conditioner or vinegar in it (and no it doesn't need to sit 10 minutes), is when she should comb it. The ACV and the hair's natural oils will help substantially with the tendency to tangle.

Between washings, it is great to wet her hair and use a small amount of conditioner to detangle then. I don't even brush my hair otherwise, but mine now has a slight wave to it post-pregnancy.

A cut appropriate to her hair type should help considerably. Is it blunt cut below her shoulders? Maybe a stylist (a young, "cool" one your daughter might identify with) could suggest long layers, having it thinned with shears (not a razor since her hair is so fine and has a tendency to snarl/frizz) and shaped to be low-maintenance.

But, if you set your daughter up for success with all the tools she needs, and she still won't care for it, then I would let it go.
post #22 of 51
Do you have hard water? I know that makes dd's long thick fine hair much more difficult to comb out. Also, it's really important to get ALL the shampoo out before conditioning. The type of conditioner matters too. You may have already tried those things but I thought I'd mention them. Maybe try Wen or at least a sulfate-free shampoo. My hair is so much more agreeable when I'm using a cleanser and not a shampoo.

My mom used to threaten to cut my hair if I didn't take care of it when I was around 10. I really resent it and hate the way it felt. But she sort of taunted me all the time and I started living in fear of being dragged off for a bob.

What I did with my oldest when she had long hair but didn't want to comb/brush it was tell her that she had two choices--either brush it out at least once a day or cut it so it would be easier to brush.

There are very few things in my mind that are non-negotiable and basic personal hygiene is one of them. If a kid is too young to do it alone then I'll happily help, but they have to be agreeable to me helping. If they aren't agreeable to me helping, then they need to learn to do whatever it is, or change the situation so it's less of an issue. JM2C.
post #23 of 51
If it remains a problem and you decide the solution is to get it cut, maybe getting it cut a lot shorter but not all the way to a bob might help? like shoulder length might still feel a little bit like long hair and not be so hard to take care of?
post #24 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magelet View Post
Taking proper care of her hair is a reasonable expectation to have of an 10 year old.
I disagree. This is the age when girls start doing more things for themselves, and letting them do it (and not doing nearly as good of a job as we could!) is difficult. Learning to take proper care of hair can take time and mistakes, how long and how big of mistakes depend on the child and the type of hair.

It's reasonable for young child to let mom do their hair, and its reasonable for a teen to do a good with their hair, put there is an uncomfortable place in between when they do it themselves but not consistently and sometimes not very well!

A lot of girls this age look kinda tatty -- they are old enough to do these things for themselves but often lack the experience to do them well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by journeymom View Post
Well, there was that time I just had to explain to my girlfriend that I was actually aware that dd had a huge rat's nest at the base of her neck, but that I was choosing to do nothing about it.
Sometimes I wonder if I'm doing something because it really is best for my child or because I'm afraid that other people will judge me as a bad mother.

Quote:
When the decision was completely in her hands the whole process went much smoother.
That's been my experience, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeekingJoy View Post
As someone with a similar hair type (and similar hair struggles with my mom), a few suggestions.

Suggest she stop washing her hair often. Maybe even look into no-shampoo routines (i.e. "no poo").
agreed. I really The Curly Girl Book.

Both my DDs has super curly hair that they choose to wear long. They don't want me to touch it. What works at our house is to have super wide tooth comb in the shower and lots and lots of conditioner. They comb it out while showing at least 5 days a week. (depending on what's going on over the weekend, they just pull the whole mess back in a pony tail). One of my DDs find her hair does best seldom being washed, the other washes her hair every day. Encourage your DD to experiment.

Getting the ends trimmed can make it easier to comb, not because the overall length is much less but because the frayed and split hairs at the bottom tangle REALLY badly. 1/2 inch to an inch can make things much easier.
post #25 of 51
Ds age 13 wants a very shaggy haired look. He is very sensitive about his hair, it's thick and grows quickly. He combs it straight forward over his forehead which has started to break-out. To me it looks awful...but I remember my mother being controlling over my looks so he can do whatever he wants. I noticed at his school many of the boys have long hair or shaggy. Most of the girls also have long hair that is not styled or pulled back, it just sort of hangs. They look like the movie Dazed and Confused!
post #26 of 51
Thread Starter 
I also had a struggle with my mother over hair, and she bugs DD too until I tell her to knock it off. I don't want to be in that struggle, which is why I posted.

DD's brother has sensory processing disorder and she's also very sensitive - not in the SPD range, but very sensitive. Hair has been an issue for years, as she really wants to avoid routines related to her hair as it's all uncomfortable/painful to her.

So, this afternoon we had a good, calm discussion about it and she agrees she'd prefer to be tidy, so we've made a plan. Tonight we spent an hour (an hour!!) with the $20 bottle of detangler, the wide comb and some warm water to provide extra lubrication detangling her hair. Thank goodness we both like home reno shows. She then did some more in the shower independently. Then more combing/brushing until the brush in now going through smoothly. Brushed before bed and into a loose braid.

This week she's agreed to me brushing/combing it for her, and we're going to my stylist to discuss layers. If we are successful this week at working on it together, we'll do the Natural Instincts next weekend. Then the next week we'll move to her taking on more responsibility for her hair, and hopefully we'll have practiced the habits enough that they'll become more routine with some support from mom.

Thank you everyone for helping me work through this. I was feeling exasperated and stuck.
post #27 of 51
It sounds like you have a good plan there.

Something else to make sure she does. When she puts the brush in at the top of her hair, make sure when she gets to the bottom, that she pulls the brush right off her hair before going back to the top. I noticed with my 9yo's waist length hair, she'd go so far, the hair would be still on the brush, and she'd go back up and brush again. Not pretty.
post #28 of 51
If she wants long hair, take her to the long hair community and she can see all the gorgeous butt-length hair that comes from keeping hair combed regularly. She can also read about people who are sad that they didn't take the time to get tangles out when young and ended up with split-ends and broken hair and are now trying to grow their hair out from shorter than you're wanting her to cut it.

If she wants long hair, her choices are to take care of it now, or to cut it until she has time to take care of it.
post #29 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bethla View Post
Ds age 13 wants a very shaggy haired look. He is very sensitive about his hair, it's thick and grows quickly. He combs it straight forward over his forehead which has started to break-out. To me it looks awful...but I remember my mother being controlling over my looks so he can do whatever he wants. I noticed at his school many of the boys have long hair or shaggy. Most of the girls also have long hair that is not styled or pulled back, it just sort of hangs. They look like the movie Dazed and Confused!
It drives me crazy! I didn't like the shaggy look on guys back in the 70s, didn't like the parted down the middle, long, no-style look on girls back in the 70s, and I still don't like it.

Dang, I sound like a curmudgeon. That's alright, I'll live.

Hurrah, JoeandSally! Good luck to you and your daughter.
post #30 of 51
I had this issue with my mother at a very similar age. She finally gave up and eventually I figured out how to take care of my hair. I really do wish she'd given me more guidance, though. I really didn't know how to take care of my hair, and we were very poor, such that conditioner was a luxury for us. I also want to add that she had always made a huge deal about how beautiful my long, gorgeous hair was. So, when she made suggestions to cut it, it felt like she was saying she wanted to make me ugly. I know that's not rational, but it's how I felt.
post #31 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarrieMF View Post
The reason it takes so long is becuase it's being left so long between de-tangling. On average we loose 100 hairs a day, if the hair is not being de-tangled then alot of those hairs are stuck in her tangled hair making around 1000 extra hairs tangled up amongst the hair that is still attached to the head.
Not quite that bad since longer hair drops out less than short hair.

Joensally, it sounds like you have a good plan in place. If you do have problems with tangles in the future, I've found that combing in the shower helps a lot. The water running through the hair really aids the comb. As in, a section of hair that a wide tooth comb wouldn't move more than an inch in can be combed the whole length by a fine tooth comb.
post #32 of 51
So glad to hear you found a plan that works for both of you! Let us know how it goes.
post #33 of 51
She probably can't brush through it herself. But, if she won't let you comb the tangles out once or twice a week, I'd say she has to cut it until she can care for it herself.

At least cut an inch off every six weeks. Keeping a fresh cut helps brush through the tangles.
post #34 of 51
Quote:
Not quite that bad since longer hair drops out less than short hair.
my long hair falls out just as much as it did when it was short.
post #35 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by enkmom View Post
No advice, just a story. My 21 year old daughter still remembers (and brings up) the time when she was 6 and I had the beautician cut her hair to MY preference. I have always been of the opinion that it's just hair and grows back - she was traumatized and will only allow her hair to be trimmed in millimeters. Hair is a very personal thing.

I do sympathize with you about the messy hair.
Yup, totally agree with this post. I can't count the number of women I've met with hair down past their waists because they're afraid to have it cut because of a traumatic hair cutting incident when they were younger. I know people in their 20's who still shed tears at getting a tiny bit trimmed off.
post #36 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by eclipse View Post
I really do wish she'd given me more guidance, though. I really didn't know how to take care of my hair, and we were very poor, such that conditioner was a luxury for us.
I find it hard to give the needed guidence in a helpful way without sounding controlling or judgmental (at this point, this is a topic we have history on!).

I take my girls to that same stylist I use and have talked to him about it when they aren't there, and so now he's really great about mentioning little things to them when he is doing their hair. He just works things in conversationally, and I think it comes better from my young, gay, hip, funny hair guy than it comes from me, even if it is the same information.

I also buy my DD's quality hair products, but I know this isn't an option for everyone due to the expense. One DD uses Matrix products and other uses Paul Mitchell. I'm sure there are moms here who can tell you all the great home made and less expensive ways to get good results.

I've used canola oil on hair knots before!
post #37 of 51
OMG.

I totally sympathize, because my oldest dd was your dd. She would NOT brush her hair or care for it, but was very specific about the length.

We tried different conditioners, and finally found one that worked reasonably well.

Still, the big issue was the fact that she just didn't care. Against my instincts, our hair philosophy has been "Your hair, your deal." Hair color, hair style, hair length has always been the choice of the one who has to wear it. So while I would in my head rant and scream about her hair, I did not make any comments and would simply offer to help every once in a while, and help her when she asked.

Her friends would give her a hard time about her hair, and her response was a shrug and the comment "I don't care." She really just didn't care if it was messy, parted or not, brushed or not.

Around entering junior high, she finally started taking better care of it. Now, at 14, she brushes it daily, often it is parted, and sometimes she actually spends quite a bit of time on it.

My advice: ask her what she wants to do with her hair. If she really just doesn't want to do much with it, let her. If she *wants* to do something with it, but just doesn't know how, help her or find her the help she needs (ie, take her to a salon with a hip, young guy or gal as your beautician, explain the situation, and ask for help).

It is her hair. I would not want someone dictating how I wear or care for my hair. At her age, she most definitely has an opinion about it, so I'd try to respect it rather than make it a big battle. If a big rat's nest develops because that is what she wants, well, let it happen.

ETA: I see you have a plan. I posted without reading all the replies. Hope things work out!
post #38 of 51
Could she braid her own hair? If she has a tender scalp she might like the control of doing it herself so she can control the tension.

And no, long hair sheds at the same rate as short.. Cutting hair doesn't affect its growth cycle.
post #39 of 51
i second (third?) the layers. my hair is so thick and it gets so tangly when it is one length. also getting it trimmed often, the split ends etc. those really make my hair impossible to comb.
post #40 of 51
This stuff is awesome at getting out tangles. You put it in wet hair and it brushes right out.

http://www.tigihaircare.com/consumer...y&categoryID=5
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