conflicts of religion and diet - Page 2

[Holiztic]

Very loose translation of "religion", but same kind of challenge--I am trying to combine Ayurvedic recommendations for diet/lifestyle with TF and it is so difficult!

In winter everything was fine: Ayurveda says eat oils, fats, meat, root veggies, etc. There are specific recommendations for how to take dairy, but that's no a big deal.

Now its spring and we're "supposed" to be dairy and wheat free (I know, plenty of GFCF TFers in here!) but also low fat and high grains. We haven't had beef in a month! We are still doing CLO/BO and using plenty of butter and ghee, eating 2 pastured eggs a day, and eating the whole chicken with skin (Ayurveda says white meat, no skin in spring). Getting plenty of bitter and astringent veggies/sprouts, dandelion root tea, and avoiding the heavier fruits (banana, avocado) and veggies.

Ayurveda recommends a really high carb summer (that apparently doesn't crash blood sugar IF a good cleansing spring diet is followed).

The biggest issues I have now are this: John Douillard (speaking for Ayurveda) says that what we take in over the year is more important than getting everything we need every day--that our body builds and stores, and that we need certain things at certain times of year (esp. based on what is available locally at the time). Sounds good to me. But then what if I get pregnant right now? Okay, I have all the good fat soluble vitamins stored up from winter, but I am not getting hardly any more--until November??? I'm just not so sure!

I think about the (oh how to spell this) Loeshenal Valley and how they ate dairy all year and I doubt they were mad crazy mucous-producing people that god colds and flus constantly.

But we were eating a very solid TF diet and getting colds left and right--but otherwise very healthy, colds never turned into anything worse and we never got anything else--until we start living Ayurvedically and now we rarely get sick, and when we do its very mild.

I do not know the answer yet, but I am determined to figure it out!

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by Holiztic

I think about the (oh how to spell this) Loeshenal Valley and how they ate dairy all year and I doubt they were mad crazy mucous-producing people that god colds and flus constantly.

But we were eating a very solid TF diet and getting colds left and right--but otherwise very healthy, colds never turned into anything worse and we never got anything else--until we start living Ayurvedically and now we rarely get sick, and when we do its very mild.

I do not know the answer yet, but I am determined to figure it out!

One of the really interesting things, from a different traditional health/medicine perspective, is that along with all that dairy, they were eating rye. In TCM, dairy and rye have different properties, in a way that, say, dairy and wheat do not. Dairy and wheat are similar in some ways that are more problematic when eating conventional Western diets. Now, we can't do dairy or rye or wheat, so it's not an issue for my family, but it was really interesting to see that.

FWIW, I'm trying to use TCM flavors, but modified for our particular health needs. We are starting from a point of weak health, so we need more of the building foods that TCM discusses, but still some balance.

[Holiztic]

Originally Posted by TanyaLopez

One of the really interesting things, from a different traditional health/medicine perspective, is that along with all that dairy, they were eating rye. In TCM, dairy and rye have different properties, in a way that, say, dairy and wheat do not. Dairy and wheat are similar in some ways that are more problematic when eating conventional Western diets. Now, we can't do dairy or rye or wheat, so it's not an issue for my family, but it was really interesting to see that.

FWIW, I'm trying to use TCM flavors, but modified for our particular health needs. We are starting from a point of weak health, so we need more of the building foods that TCM discusses, but still some balance.

Interesting point, Tanya. Yes, rye is a warming and lighter grain while wheat is cool and heavy-- and the combo of wheat and dairy (both heavy and cool) is a big problem in spring (which is also heavy, wet and cool). We've gotten most of the wheat out in the last 3 weeks. but I am going to be more serious. Picking up rye sourdough from our farm club on Wednesday, but we've been doing rye porridge for a few weeks. Even still, DS had yogurt everyday for the last week (goat, usually spiced) BUT he had pizza (gasp!) and then cheesy grits two consecutive days and the next day--woke up with a cold!

This is our first spring trying to introduce ayurveda, and its after a bad (in ayurvedic terms) summer last year (DS was seriously overheated--3 month perioral rash, hives, loose stool, etc). So I am not expecting miracles, but I do expect as we get further into a seasonal building/cleansing diet (mixed with TF!!!) we'll see improvement in cold frequency and DH's allergies.

Thanks for the thoughts on rye!! I hadn't even put that together for the Swiss (not butchering that valley name again!)

[organicmidwestmama]

Originally Posted by greenmamapagan

Yes, yes, yes! Despite my username we are Buddhist. It's really tough to find a balance.

i recently found an interesting tibeten cookbook called the lhassa moon cookbook in which the author discusses the seeming conundrum buddists are placed in with regards to eating meat. the author is tibeten and buddist and says traditional tibetans actually ate lots of meat and mil and butter, and very few veggies or fruits or grains until the communists forced tibetens to stop being nomads and start farming wheat which completely degraded the land. the author says tibetens fasted from flesh foods during religious ceremonies and on certain days, but generally ate a lot of animal foods.

[LionTigerBear]

Originally Posted by bluebirdmama1

Anyone ever conflicted between what you think is right dietary wise and religious diet?
I do not want to get into specifics here or have a arguing religious discussion but just wanted some unbiased support/advise.

My religion is against drugs, tobacco, and coffee, all things that I can for sure avoid and those are the rules. Easy, understandable.

But it is recommended that "grain is the staff if life, especially wheat" and to "eat meat sparingly, only in winter, cold, or famine." This is so against what I have learned about traditional diets and it just makes me so frustrated. These aren't rues but are highly recommended and I just don't want to follow it, but I feel guilty like it is a sin to not follow it. And logically more meat/less grain seems right and I feel healthy when I eat lots of meat, atleast everyday.

I want to do the best for my children and myself. This is a conflict of religion and diet.

Hey! I'm a Latter-day Saint, too. I barely skimmed the thread since I don't have a lot of time.

I was coming from more of a Traditional Food standpoint when I joined the church. I was actually excited to hear the Word of Wisdom and immediately felt it was straight from God. I definitely didn't stop eating meat.

Here're my thoughts: Grain IS the Staff of Life. What does that mean? It means, it's meant to be there for emergencies, as a support, not as the basis of our diet, though. Do we always walk with a staff? No, in fact it's considered optimal NOT to walk with a staff. But in hard times, we may need the staff, and we need the staff to be there and available for those difficult times when we need extra help. I believe wheat was made for man to hold him up like a metaphorical staff. It stores easily and for a long time.

As far as eat meat sparingly: I think when you are very sick or nutritionally deficient, whenever you are not in good health, counts as a famine of sorts, for you, and meat is a healing thing to eat in those situations. I used to crave meat more and now 10 years later I do not so much. My body had a lot of healing to do. Outside of that, I am starting to think about eating seasonally, more, and that is what is discussed in the WOW. Right now I am studying Ayurvedic eating, which is, of course, also a Traditional Food diet. It has specific guidelines for how to eat seasonally and there are times when it might be beneficial to eat more meat, and times when we should eat less or none. I recommend looking into the books by John Douillard-- tempered with our other Traditional Food info, of course.

It occurs to me that eating Traditionally does not need to mean you eat meat or very much meat. It's more about eating lots of real food and fats, properly prepared, and in season. It's about the source. Getting enough protein. Nutrients. Things like that. A lot of Traditional people's were closer to being vegetarian and were quite healthy.

P.S. In the end I wouldn't worry about it-- seriously. Follow a Traditional Diet, eat a lot of meat, if that's what your body needs right now. It doesn't make you a bad Saint. I know I'm doing my best and still learning-- we'll figure it all out at some point!