Bread Help: Olive oil bread won't rise

[Owen'nZoe]

I have a recipe for an olive oil- based cheese bread from my MIL, and am having trouble getting it to rise. I'd appreciate any troubleshooting help! MIL makes it by sight without a recipe, so the amounts may be off. Also, she has trouble getting the bread to rise when she makes it here (in the US), but not when she makes it at home. Here's the recipe:

Nabulsi Cheese Bread
2 1/2 c flour
3/4 c olive oil
1 t yeast
dash of salt
water
5 pieces Nabulsi cheese, soaked and cut into cubes

Add the oil to the flour and mix with your hands. Add the yeast and salt and add warm water gradually. Leave until it rises (about 1 hour).

Add Nabulsi cheese, and cut off orange-sized pieces of dough. Bake on a oiled baking pan for 15-20 minutes at 350F.


After I had trouble with it last time, I looked for a similar recipe online. The closest one I could find used the following proportions:

4 1/2 c flour
3/4 c olive oil
1 T yeast
1 t salt
1 c warm water

So, last time I ended up taking the dough that didn't rise and adding the extra 2 cups flour, 2 t yeast, and a little water to get to these proportions. It worked - the bread rose and tasted great.

This time, I used the second ingredient list, but did not add the extra flour, yeast and water later. It didn't rise at all.

Any ideas on what went wrong? Thanks!

[tinuviel_k]

Two thoughts come to mind.
1. Your yeast might be old and past it's prime. This is easily tested. But that being said...
2. I am guessing that she uses a different kind of yeast at home. I bet that she uses what is called "instant yeast" whereas you might be using "active dry yeast." That would explain why she gets great results at home, but not when she is baking at your house. The two types of yeast work quite differently.

With instant yeast you can just mix it dry right in to the flour, add warm water (110-120 degrees F) to the flour/yeast/salt, and knead away. Also, using instant yeast means you only need one rise. When using active dry yeast you often need to do two rises.

With active dry yeast you need to proof it first by sprinkling it on top of warm water (100-115 degrees F) until it dissolves and begins to get foamy. It doesn't work so well sprinkled dry right into the flour. If you proof the yeast at the right temperature and it does not get foamy you know your yeast is past its prime.

I think the recipe worked so well when you added fresh flour, yeast, and such to the dough that didn't rise because the original active dry yeast had enough time to start reproducing. if you try instant yeast instead they won't need that longer incubation period if you just mix the yeast in with the flour dry.

Anyway, IF you are using active dry yeast try this instead:

Mix the flour and salt together. Sprinkle the yeast into 1/2 cup of the water at 105-115 degrees. Stir till dissolved, and let rest for 5-10 minutes until foamy. Make a well in the dry ingredients. Add the yeast water, the rest of the water, and the oil to the flour and stir well to combine. Knead until elastic. (Do you do a second rise after adding the cheese? or does it just go straight in the oven?)

Or you could look for instant yeast in the store and give that a go.

Hope this helps!

[Owen'nZoe]

Thank you for all of the ideas! I feel like I'm getting closer.

I am relatively confident that the yeast is still good. I bought it a little less than a year ago, so I guess that we are getting close to the 1 year mark, but I bake no-knead bread with it all the time and it rises well.

I believe my yeast is active dry yeast (I bought it in bulk, and can't remember for sure), but forgot to mention in the last email that I did mix it into the water and added it to the flour mix, and that it was frothy at that point. I never knew that you were supposed to do it one way with active yeast, and the other with instant, though - I actually sprinkle the yeast on the dry ingredients when I make no-knead bread, and it works great. I wonder why? Is it because is is such a wet dough?

I believe she does buy the instant yeast when she makes it here. She buys the yeast here, though, so I assume she is choosing the yeast closest to what she would use at home?

In your suggestions, you added the olive oil after the water and yeast - maybe I'll try doing that instead of adding the oil before. I wonder if maybe the olive oil coating the flour could be an issue?

As for kneading and rising, she barely kneads the bread, so I didn't knead it much, either - definitely not until elastic. And my MIL doesn't let it rise a second time before putting it in the oven, but I usually do, and my family prefers it with the second rise.

[tinuviel_k]

I use regular active dry yeast for "no knead' bread, too, and with good results. I think it works there mixing it in to the dry ingredients because of the super long rise time. I've been meaning to pick up some instant yeast to see if it makes a difference...

[Owen'nZoe]

Thanks for all of the great info and ideas! I'm determined to get this bread right - it is so yummy (how could it not be with all that olive oil ).

[serenbat]

I never add salt to my yeast- I only add it when I do the flour.

I was always told - sugar grows/salts kills yeast

[425lisamarie]

This is a VERY heavily enriched dough, meaning it has a lot of fat. The richer/wetter the dough, the less it rises as a regular loaf....think of focaccia. This is basically that type of dough.

I would mix the oil, water, then add it to the flour, yeast, salt. Leave it in a bowl until at least doubled. Then after you break off your pieces to shape, leave them to rise just a little again. With that much yeast 15 minutes should do.

ETA: If you are using dry non instant yeast, then mix a half cup flour, with a little water and the yeast and leave it until it is very bubble, about 20 minutes in a very warm space, then proceed.

[rainyday]

That is a LOT of oil for that amount of flour. Since you had good results with the recipe with the greater amount of flour, I would suspect that your yeast is fine. Could your mil's flour be much drier than what is typical here? Then you would essentially be getting more flour per cup because there would be less moisture.

Since the bread with the higher amount of flour rose well and tasted great, what about adapting your recipe to that amount of flour? Or, if there was something about it that didn't work well for you, what about using an amount of flour somewhere in the middle?

Flours do vary from place to place, and the same amounts of liquids will require differing amounts of flour at different times of the year and in different climates.

And.... I'm dying to make some cheese bread now! Yum!

[Owen'nZoe]

Originally Posted by rainyday

That is a LOT of oil for that amount of flour.

I know. I have to try really hard to forget how much oil is in it each time I make it, so I can just enjoy eating it and not feel too guilty. There is a reason I gain wieght every time we visit her.

Originally Posted by rainyday

Since the bread with the higher amount of flour rose well and tasted great, what about adapting your recipe to that amount of flour? Or, if there was something about it that didn't work well for you, what about using an amount of flour somewhere in the middle?

The second time I made the bread, I used the higher amount of flour, but it didn't work. I think the key might be adding it in two steps or, as someone else mentioned, mixing flour with the yeast and warm water and letting the yeast do its magic a bit longer before adding it to the dry ingredients.

Thanks for all of the ideas, ladies!