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"Gaskin Maneuver"

post #1 of 61
Thread Starter 
Am I the only person offended that Ina Mae went to Guatemala and learned this technique from traditional midwives who have done it for hundreds of years and then came back here and named it after herself? Hmmmm? I can't be the only one!! It drives me crazy!
post #2 of 61
hmmm. yeah, but I guess it's been done for years by men. she's just joined the club.
post #3 of 61
Thread Starter 
I'll be sure to tell my montgomery glands about this!
post #4 of 61
I may be mistaken, but I don't think she's the one who named it that. She's just the one who gave lectures about it and spread the word to the medical community that a laboring woman can get on her hands and knees to help baby into a better position for birthing. I think she did a great thing by sharing what she learned (but wasn't it in Belize?) from watching indigenous people give birth.
post #5 of 61
Thread Starter 
No, she named it that herself.
post #6 of 61
It was Belize, not Guatemala
and she refers to it as "The All-Fours Maneuver" in every article I've read that she wrote herself.

Either way, it doesn't bother me at all. I think it's a much better option than the alternative methods of dealing with shoulder dystocia, like Zavanelli maneuver where doc shoves baby back up into uterus and sections him out.
What difference does it make what it's called?
post #7 of 61
I agree- I believe it started to be called the "Gaskin maneuver" after she was published in an OB journal. That is pretty standard in obstetrics though - manouvers are refered to by the person that publishes and popularizes a maneuver. I'll take "Gaskin" over "McRoberts" anyday .
post #8 of 61
Thread Starter 
I'm almost 100% sure she began the trend of calling it the "Gaskin maneuver" herself. I'll have to research it more. We discussed it at length in my class and I held the position of stafl and chava, but more than a few people agreed she began the trend. Could it not be the Belize maneuver? I think if she had any integrity she would make it a point to name it something appropriate. Ina May has done good things for midwifery, but I'm just not feeling the Ina May love. I don't agree with all her techniques, I don't agree with all her stances on issues and I really disagree with her going around acting like the queen bee midwife. I know a lot of people are her fans and will be all irritated with me, but she absolutely drives me nuts sometimes.
post #9 of 61
Thread Starter 
www.inamay.com/gaskin_maneuver.htm

Quote:
I introduced the all-fours maneuver in the United States in 1976, after learning about it from a Belizean midwife who had, in turn, learned it from Mayan midwives in the highlands of Guatemala.
It is from the Guatemalan midwives. She was just taught by a Belizian MW.

She actually has a special link on her site about it. While she gives credit in this article, she obviously takes credit in general for the maneuver and bringing it into the limelight. It's one thing to be proud that you introduced a new technique and another to put on airs about how it's YOUR technique when you learned it from someone who learned it from women who have done this for hundreds of years.

Another white American steals credit for hundreds of years of brown skinned natives' ingenuity and dedication.
post #10 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by stafl
and she refers to it as "The All-Fours Maneuver" in every article I've read that she wrote herself.


What difference does it make what it's called?
She calls it the Gaskin Maneuver all over her website, no matter what she calls it in articles, she obviously calls it the Gaskin Maneuver herself.

It makes a big difference what it's called. I agree the Zavanelli maneuver is preposterous and very dangerous, but this is an issue of her taking the credit for other people's work. It is so offensive to me that she would do this. I don't see how it's any different than if a male OB did it.

It's like if I started calling Reggae, Laurenae just because I brought back some steel drums from Jamaica!
post #11 of 61
Bugs me too, Lauren.

i recently read an article about her and she did credit the midwives who taught her.... but it still bothers me a lot. I agree that it's the typical white person thing taking credit for a traditional practice.... ugh.

Interestingly, I read Spiritual Midwifery my first pregnancy and thought her to be so amazing. But since I started studying midwifery, I've looked at her techniques and beliefs in a different light-- and frankly there's A LOT i don't agree with. But then I'm sure that if you put 100 midwives in front of me, I wouldn't agree with many of them.

That said, she has, and continues to do great things for midwifery.

Karen
post #12 of 61
I don't guess I will ever learn to be brief...sorry.

I first read Spiritual Midwifery over 24 years ago, when I was pregnant with my oldest child, while living in a communal house in NC. I found the book very miraculous, because it expressed my deepest heartfelt desire for my son's birth, but I could not go to The Farm. I gave birth in a hospital setting and it was not pretty. I vowed that I would have a homebirth next time.

I never agreed with ALL that Ina May had to say, but I admired her. I still admire her, but I think that her notariety created a culture that has developed around her. She is still just another human being with human weaknesses and human strengths.

During my second pregnancy I met some ladies who had lived at The Farm for extended periods of time. They were very honest about their experiences there and with Ina May, and I let go of the stars in my eyes with regard to Ina May, and The Farm in general. Hey, it's a community made up of humans, with human nature and they are no different than you or me.

I won't get upset with Ina May for her humanity and hubris. I won't begrudge her those things because they are tools to facilitate learning; and that is true for all of us.

I whole-heartedly agree that the thousands of years of Mayan midwifery wisdom deserves all the respect and gratitude that we can sincerely muster, rather than being co-opted and renamed. There is no defense of the indefensible.

And at the end of the day, Ina May is just another woman, like every one of us. Nothing is stopping any of us from doing outstanding work in midwifery that may, as a side effect, garner us notariety. We would certainly come to understand more about that reality.

I guess one lesson might be to keep our own practices to a standard with which we feel comfortable and let others deal with theirs. Another might be, if we feel very very strongly about Ina May's actions, what is stopping us from making contact with her and respectfully expressing our concern about this issue?

After all, who is she?? Just another human being, and we can be sure that: 1- it will either make a difference....or, 2- it won't. Either way, all will have been done that is possible, to make a difference, and express concern about something that means a great deal. It occurs to me that one may get a reply as well, and get the real story from her.

You never know unless you try. It might be worth taking some time and reaching out to her.
post #13 of 61
Wow, Joyce, you are so right on. I try hard to see the divine in other people when I start feeling negative about them, and my snarky comment wasn't a result of that action.

I think that not only is she human, but we all know how hard it must be to maintain your humbleness and graciousness when you become a celebrity. Seriously.

Yes, Joyce.
post #14 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Malama
Bugs me too, Lauren.

i recently read an article about her and she did credit the midwives who taught her.... but it still bothers me a lot. I agree that it's the typical white person thing taking credit for a traditional practice.... ugh.

Interestingly, I read Spiritual Midwifery my first pregnancy and thought her to be so amazing. But since I started studying midwifery, I've looked at her techniques and beliefs in a different light-- and frankly there's A LOT i don't agree with. But then I'm sure that if you put 100 midwives in front of me, I wouldn't agree with many of them.

That said, she has, and continues to do great things for midwifery.

Karen
I thought she was amazing too, and it was funny, my MWs who gave me the book mentioned it was inspiring but not a textbook for the way midwifery and birth works, and that it was easy to get caught up.

Since then I have found that many of her techmiques are highly debatable to say the least, I'm thinking of breech here, and yes, she is human, I agree. Joyce, I like your post and I agree, but as a celebrity, she is up for my scrutiny. If she is doing things I disagree with, I'll call her on it. It doesn't mean I don't think she's done great things for midwifery.

I think she really does view herself as the queen bee of midwifery, and that bothers me, but not as much as the "Maya maneuver" being called the Gaskin maneuver." Whether or not she is a celeb, it is offensive. I want to revise my analogy to be, what is Sting said he got reggae from Jamaica, and then continually called it and allowed it to be called "stingae" or something like that? It would be super offensive. Since I am a nobody the analogy didn't work as well.

A ton of stuff goes on at the Farm I disagree with, but good things happen to. Fly in breeches, not that I'm crazy about her technique, fly in twins, VBACs, etc. I choose not to associate the cultural aspects of the Farm with the midwifery aspects because if I do, I will completely discredit the whole lot and with Ina May's celeb status I think that would do a disservice to midwifery. Geez, I'm rambling again, I always do that.

Bottom line. Ina May is who she is. Human. The term Gaskin maneuver is still highly offensive and IMO it doesn't make her look better in this community, but worse.
post #15 of 61
Well, Ina May is one of those midwives who has chosen to promote the profession by working within the system. Many people believe in that and it has it's plusses and minuses, IMO.

I personally believe that midwifery has little to do with Obstetrics... the two are just so completely different.

Ina May is just a human, and she HAS brought a lot of interest in midwifery to the mainstream. I'm sure that there are some who would never have heard about midwifery if not for the work she's done.

AND, many women, who would have otherwise been sectioned we able to have vaginal births because she's so outspoken in her stuff about breeches, etc.... That's cool.

So, i respect that about her, but still think it's lame that she took the credit for the maneuver.

karen
post #16 of 61
Thread Starter 
Thank you Karen, I agree 100%.
post #17 of 61
Veganmama...

So why not ask Ina May about it? I mean it is possible to write her a letter or an email if this issue is near and dear to your heart as it seems to be. Yes, if you think she is up for your scrutiny, then by all means communicate with her about it. I really would do that if it bothered me that much. If she is accountable as a celebrity then why not act on it?

You could really provide her the opportunity to make a change.

I have reached out to well-known folks before on matters that mean alot to me and have often received a reply and seems to me this is one of those opportunities to really do something about a wrong. A well-written letter or email may reach her and make her think. What have you to lose?

Just a thought...Joyce in the mts.
post #18 of 61
Hey Joyce! This is a little T. What did those people say about living on the Farm. I was always curious about what it was like.
post #19 of 61
Doulamomvicki...

I have PM'd you with regard to your OT question, so as not to highjack the thread.

Joyce in the mts.
post #20 of 61
lauren - what about her delivery of breeches do you not agree with? I'm just asking because my CPM learned how to do breech births the way Ina May does, and has never had any problems or difficulties.
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