being a vegetarian because its cheaper?

[jildez]

This is probably not quite what you think...

I am a life ling vegetarian, and my husband is what i call an 'opportunistic meat eater', we long ago decided to raise our children like i was, as a vegetarian but allowing them to make their own choices to try or not try things when they were out and about. So here is my delimma- I have been a vegan for about 7 years, which a few years back to vegetarian when i was in the peace corps, and for me it is just more natural to avoid dairy and eggs.

However, we live frugally- we live on my husband's small salary from a job with a nonprofit- and we qualify and get WIC. I just didn't get the milk (my husband ate the cheese and sometimes some of the eggs), and until January we lived in WV and for a few months, we were able to get soymilk. However, we moved, since my husband finished his degree and got a job in Iowa, where WIC does not yet offer soymilk. As i have been attempting to slim our grocery budget, i have been getting and working the dairy and eggs into our meals. My husband eats most of the eggs- i have hated them since i was a child, but i have been eating a small amount of cheese, and using most of the milk to make yougurt- i can't stomach straight milk.

The problem is, i feel very conflicted about this. One one hand, i feel i need to be the best financial manager i can, and on the other hand, I don't like eating these things, especially the factory farmed, pumped up versions WIC dictates. When i was in peace corps, eating vegetarian didn't bother me because i knew how the animals how provided my dairy were treated and access to protein in the country, climate and culture i was in made it difficult to get other sources.

Today, my food budget for us (3ish, my 9 mo old eats only a small amount- i actually use most of his WIC baby food to make quick breads and stuff for us) is $200/ month- it includes our household needs- light bulbs, cleaning stuff (although i make most of them). Most of our (nondairy)protein is beans. I don't really know that I could feed us for a similar amount without using the dairy and eggs.

As i said, I am conflicted about it and would like to find out what you guys think about it. Could/should i go back to veganism?If so, is it possible for us to eat vegan for this much? Should i make peace with my vegetarianism, and what might you suggest to do this?

[KaylaBeanie]

Eating vegetarian is beyond cheap, and eating vegan is even cheaper! As you know, beans are dirt cheap. Try different recipes with bean soups, beans and rice, etc. Make a big vegetable roast in the oven. Sure, on your budget you'll have to skip things like veggie burgers or fake meat, but it is absolutely possible to do this. Here is the vegan food pyramid http://www.chooseveg.com/vegan-food-pyramid.asp

Essentially, meat eaters follow the same, except they have dairy and meat, both of which are expensive as crap. Milk is expensive, as are eggs, especially if you get organic or cage free. I eat eggs MAYBE twice a month, mostly because I don't like them enough to spend the money on them. Right now, I don't have to worry about paying for food, because my mom also doesn't eat meat and since I live at home, my parents buy my food. However, I fully intend to be mostly vegan once I move next year, solely because it IS so much cheaper than vegetarianism.

[jildez]

Kayla,

I love to cook and do mostly base my meals around beans, i make my own veggie burgers, i was making my own seitan as a meat analog, but now that i'm out of gluten flour and i've priced buying more here, i am stopping that.

i am fine with not buying meat analogs, in fact i don't even by tofu much because of its cost here. however, maybe you don't understand how WIC works- when you are enrolled the government gives you coupons for free foods, but it is very specific which foods you can get. Effectively, it increases my food budget beyond what i am spending by a fair amount (probably more then a hundred dollars), but the bulk of the coupons are for dairy.

the good thing is that i get $10 of produce every month and with careful selection i have been able to make that about half of our produce needs and i make sure we eat at least 1 fruit or veg with each meal- and this summer i am hoping i can get the farmer's market coupons i got in WV last year.

also, i am working on a garden and hoping this is going to allow us to cut back on the dairy too.

[Grace and Granola]

First off, I am not a vegetarian, but I completely understand where you're coming from. We got onto WIC when my littlest needed the very expensive hypo-allergenic formula. And it was just a bonus that we got all the other stuff too, I thought. I wanted to comment because, now we've been on WIC a couple of years and it's really hard to get off once you've become used to that part of your budget being taken care of. The problem is, WIC made me compromise my principles. My kids didn't drink juice before WIC, they ate natural peanut butter and organic milk. But because WIC made it free, I compromised my values, and now 2 years later, I'm mad at myself. Now my kids are addicted to juice, and I'm addicted to the cost benefit of regular milk and pb.

I hope you get what I'm saying. I wouldn't compromise your true values to save money, because I think you'll be mad at yourself down the line. Unless you really truly do not have enough food to eat. But I would first see if you can work out a budget without that stuff in it. Or, let your husband fill up on it if he really doesn't care. Are you able to get food stamps? At least with those you can choose what you spend your money on. Good luck, I really do feel your pain.

[jildez]

Originally Posted by Grace and Granola

First off, I am not a vegetarian, but I completely understand where you're coming from. We got onto WIC when my littlest needed the very expensive hypo-allergenic formula. And it was just a bonus that we got all the other stuff too, I thought. I wanted to comment because, now we've been on WIC a couple of years and it's really hard to get off once you've become used to that part of your budget being taken care of. The problem is, WIC made me compromise my principles. My kids didn't drink juice before WIC, they ate natural peanut butter and organic milk. But because WIC made it free, I compromised my values, and now 2 years later, I'm mad at myself. Now my kids are addicted to juice, and I'm addicted to the cost benefit of regular milk and pb.

I hope you get what I'm saying. I wouldn't compromise your true values to save money, because I think you'll be mad at yourself down the line. Unless you really truly do not have enough food to eat. But I would first see if you can work out a budget without that stuff in it. Or, let your husband fill up on it if he really doesn't care. Are you able to get food stamps? At least with those you can choose what you spend your money on. Good luck, I really do feel your pain.

Heather, i understand completely what you are saying. I haven't had to deal with my son, since he is still 95% breast fed- but it is changing our eating habits. As for food stamps, no, we don't qualify, in fact we are nearer to the top of eligibility for WIC. We are hoping to buy a house here and we decided that having a SAH parent was a top priority, and WIC hopefully will help these things happen.

As far as what you said about not having enough to eat- we are currently living on 80% of our income (we save and tithe the 20%). Our student loans will start coming due in August and then WIC will make more of a difference,but hopefully our garden will help make it less necessary- i have been reading up on garden storage and am hoping to use some peace corps lessons, too.

OH! baby awake, more later.

[Grace and Granola]

It sounds like you're pretty knowledgeable as far as cooking and meal ideas. But, I was really surprised at what quality ingredients I could by on a tight budget by following the advice on a food blog. The one I used was www.thenourishinggourmet.com I planned out a week of meals on her site, which uses ingredients that I never dared to "splurge" on, like coconut oil and organic whatever and I still came out way under my old budget. I thought I was frugal until that blog showed me otherwise! Maybe there is some such vegan/frugal blog out there that might help you make high quality meals on a budget. Plus, it's just fun having new recipes!

[jildez]

hum, i thought i replied, but it seems to have been lost in the interwebs...

Heather, thanks for the link, i am looking through it now, and it looks very interesting, i am going to give it a try. I haven't found a meal planner or a cost calculator yet, but i'll keep exploring.

I have joined a natural buying club here so i can buy things in bulk, and perhaps that can help.

Also i really liked what you said about how i want my son to learn to eat and compromising that- I am thinking that perhaps we can set a time limit- kind of like i did in peace corps- i took a 'break' for a time and a situation, but still thought of it as temporary, and we do hope that with a few years my husband's salary will increase and bump us out of the eligibility range, so i don't want to be dependent on WIC.

[caiesmommy]

It does suck when cost interupts your morals. We went through and when we had to give up the 100 mile all organic co-op that delivered...Our grocery budget had to be halfed and well that would have taken all my budget! I miss it but I do try to still feed as much organic and local as possible.

The idea of cows milk...does it affect you in anyway after having it? Tummy ache ANYTHING...I would try and use that as a medical condition as to why you cant have it...I dont really know how WIC works(im in Canada) but I would try not neccessarily to "cheat" the system but maybe work around it....or I'd sell the dairy that you get on WIC and buy soy milk with the money

[Sayward]

Find a friend who usually buys the same milk you get from WIC. Ask them to spend the money on soy milk instead, and then trade. Everyone wins.

Maybe a similar deal with the eggs? Have them but tofu? Or lentils?

[crunchy_mommy]

Do you have a discount grocery store? We have a PriceRite and some other one I can't remember the name of, and we get all our produce, beans, etc. there, it's dirt cheap, I'm not kidding!! We can feed 3 of us (all vegan) for a month for maybe $150 or so (we don't get WIC), although we buy some 'convenience' foods from TJ's etc. though we don't NEED them. The fruit looks 'damaged' but tastes great, it's just not all shiny & perfect like the big chains. So I guess I'm just saying, if you haven't already thought of it, check out the grocery stores, or maybe look into co-op or farm share etc. or try growing your own produce. For us beans & produce make up most of our meals, plus grains (corn flour, ww flour, ww pasta, etc.) and it's definitely much cheaper for us to eat vegan.

ETA: Try posting this in frugality & finances too -- super tips there -- we also made other changes that save us a ton out of the 'grocery' budget like using family cloth, cloth paper towels, CFL's, making our own soaps, toothpaste, etc.

[jildez]

I actually can't buy soymilk, tofu or even chickpeas in the one grocery store in my town and in the 'big town' they cost much more then mainstream equivalents. Additionally, WIC makes you sign an agreement that you won't sell what you get, and i don't feel comfortable breaking it, i would trade if i could but i have no one to trade with. As for getting a medical exemption, i have asked when my son was young he had BAD reactions when i accidentally ate some dairy- they would give me only lactose free milk (this was in WV, and it was before soy was available- when soy became available, there was no big deal, you just asked).

When i talked to the local WIC dietitian and she said that if my doctor said my son needed it, when he is over a year, they can do his portion as goat milk- which i might consider- Meyenburg is the only brand they allow and i need to research them. Apparently because most of the grocery stores which do WIC don't have the volume to have access to buying the neccessary brand of soymilk, Iowa isn't offering it as an option this year,and i can see why. i buy some things from the monthly buying club- 1 delivery a month, but you have to buy in bulk- like 12 cases of soymilk and i have no one to share with- i know of 2 vegetarians and no vegans in my town (1300 when you include all the rural people like me). I also have a few online sources i use to buy some stuff (when i moved here I bulk ordered nutritional yeast and mother's milk tea- i wont have to get them for at least a year!) The biggest thing is that buying bulk requires alot of cash up front- i think i am going to start saving for a soyquick or other soymilk machine and i am going to see if i can find one used, then maybe i can start ordering bulk soybeans and make soymilk. I am also going to look into getting a grinder so i can start buying wheatberries and other whole grains- i already do all our baking, but the buying club's price on flour is actually higher then the sales i can find locally.

As i said, i think my goal is going to be to make this a season- hopefully by the end of june i will be able to cut the dairy out of our everyday diet. I would still appreciate any other suggestions you all have, as i try to reach this goal.

ETA: Crunchymom- since we are in a rural area, there are 3 grocery stores that are possibilities- and 2 are just over a half hour away- no discount chains, when i was in WV, my budget was much lower because i had more choice. Also, we have made the other lifestyle choices you talked about- except family cloth (my husband totally resists it, even though he is as environmentally conscious as they come).

can i cross post this? or should i ask a separate question in frugality and finaance- i lurk there alot :-P ?

[Ianthe]

Can you qualify for food stamps? Even if you are able to get $50 a month in FS, you can use that for your tofu and soymilk. I get WIC but we just don't get the eggs, milk, and cheese.. we do the juice, cereal, produce, beans, and whole grains (corn tortillas).... and a TON of baby food.. anyway.. something to think about. Maybe Iowa has an qualification calculator on their website?

[elizawill]

you've gotten great advice. the only thing i was going to mention is that you could make your own almond milk for fairly cheap (or rice milk). i don't think you can buy nuts on WIC, but rice is included on the list probably. even if you can't buy nuts, it is still cheaper to make almond milk than to purchase it. i like to make our own almond milk & the pulp is great in breads and can replace the use of eggs in other recipes. i'm on a very tight budget as well, so i understand. hth. hugs.

[crunchy_mommy]

Oh yes you can def. make your own milks & you don't need to buy any special equipment, I've made rice milk, nut milks, etc. with a $10 blender & a $4 mesh strainer.

I think you can cross-post it or make a new post in F&F